adli Posted August 28, 2009 Share #21 Posted August 28, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) I have got responses on all my mails to customer service, nothing to complaint about there. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted August 28, 2009 Posted August 28, 2009 Hi adli, Take a look here I did not order an M9 today. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
guidomo Posted August 28, 2009 Share #22 Posted August 28, 2009 ...so it really is clearly down to who at Solms you know and have built a relationship with. As is so often the case in life... Nothing wrong with that, if you ask me. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted August 28, 2009 Share #23 Posted August 28, 2009 August is often a vacation month in Europe folks. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rdubois Posted August 28, 2009 Author Share #24 Posted August 28, 2009 Real world experiences are just that. What happens, happens. Leica are not alone for long service, unanswered phones, recorded messages telling you how important you are........ etc. It is COMMON business practice and if you were unaware of it you are on Mars! I actually chose my suppliers very carefully and no, in the main, apart from some large companies such as telecoms, water authorities and suchlike I cannot say that I can agree with you. And last time I looked outside it didn't appear that I live on Mars I know for a fact it was only because I am ALWAYS courteous and respectful to and about those service people. I fully agree but fail to see why anyone would be under the impression that I was discourteous to Leica Customer Services. In fact quite the contrary (when I finally managed to talk to someone). Frankly ( ), some of the rants I read here make my hair curl and I would not entertain going out of my way for the author(s). If you are unhappy about service, back track and look your self in the mirror. Also ask is it REALLY worse than offered generally anywhere today. If you are still dissatisfied after that examination you probaly made a wrong decision in the past and should now move on. I would re-iterate what I wrote to Hoppyman: I am not really in the mood to receive advice on how to deal with suppliers nor do I need to be patronised by you or anyone else. I believe I made a valid (and polite) post. I am not prepared to come under attack for stating that my camera has not performed reliably as this is fact. Three repairs in less than 2 years is excessive. Similarly my experience on this occasion with customer service has been less than satisfactory. That is also a fact. Leica themselves recognised and agreed as much when I spoke to them even if you don't. Dubois Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
erl Posted August 28, 2009 Share #25 Posted August 28, 2009 Dubois, I was not addressing you in particular, but if the cap fits............. You disagree. Fine.I have no problem with that. In fact I have no problem. As you have, apparently, you must solve it on your own. As for my original comments, I believe them totally valid. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rdubois Posted August 28, 2009 Author Share #26 Posted August 28, 2009 I must admit that despite my great disappointment that my sensor failed twice in less than 6 months, Leica customer service have been very responsive. When my sensor went into Jackson Pollock mode again earlier this month, Leice responded to my email within 24 hours, and immediately arranged for my camera to be collected. I had mentioned that I was going on holiday at the end of the month, and my camera was returned within 2 weeks. It even came back in a brand new box, complete with an outer carton bearing the same serial number. I have no special relationship with anyone at Leica either. I hope that your repair will be dealt with as promptly, and that it will be to your complete satisfaction. Many thanks! Dubois Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rdubois Posted August 28, 2009 Author Share #27 Posted August 28, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) Dubois, I was not addressing you in particular, but if the cap fits............. You disagree. Fine.I have no problem with that. In fact I have no problem. As you have, apparently, you must solve it on your own. As for my original comments, I believe them totally valid. Especially in view of recent posts with reference to moderators I must let you know that I find the tone of your answers to my post if not rather unpleasant then certainly undiplomatic. Dubois Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eoin Posted August 28, 2009 Share #28 Posted August 28, 2009 My goodness, where has all the love gone in this forum?. I pop in and out now and again but the air is thick with hostility. Must be nerves over the impending M9. Anyhow, having been in somewhat similar positions with my M8 which had to be returned to Solms quite a few times. I adopted the attitude of continuing to deal with the person who looked after my first return. It's always beneficial to have a name and a point of contact. Anyhow over time I unintentionally developed a familiarity with the individual concerned that was based on politeness, mutual respect and understanding. My point is, in the end, that person fought my corner and I had a very positive outcome which sorted my problems. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stunsworth Posted August 28, 2009 Share #29 Posted August 28, 2009 I had mentioned that I was going on holiday at the end of the month, and my camera was returned within 2 weeks... I took my lenses to Leica UK to be coded and mentioned that I needed them ASAP. The technician I was speaking to offered to code those that didn't need sending to Solms while I waited. I left with most of the lenses coded shortly afterwards. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rdubois Posted August 28, 2009 Author Share #30 Posted August 28, 2009 My goodness, where has all the love gone in this forum?. I pop in and out now and again but the air is thick with hostility. Must be nerves over the impending M9. Anyhow, having been in somewhat similar positions with my M8 which had to be returned to Solms quite a few times. I adopted the attitude of continuing to deal with the person who looked after my first return. It's always beneficial to have a name and a point of contact. Anyhow over time I unintentionally developed a familiarity with the individual concerned that was based on politeness, mutual respect and understanding. My point is, in the end, that person fought my corner and I had a very positive outcome which sorted my problems. Eoin, Unquestionably it is important, as a customer, to maintain a courteous attitude towards your suppliers. There is never an excuse for bad manners. But, however expedient as it may be to cultivate a particularly good relationship with one member of staff it should not necessarily be a prerequisite for good service especially as it may not always be possible to deal with the same person on each occasion. Best Dubois Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BigSplash Posted August 28, 2009 Share #31 Posted August 28, 2009 Frank I hope I correctly detect irony in your message. In response to those who suggest that I should be building up a relationship with customer services or sending them flowers: Of course it might work but the concept is bollocks and whereas it might be an incredibly nice thing to do it should be completely unnecessary when dealing with a reputable company. Dubois You are right of course......and sorry to hear your story although from personal experience I am not surprised.. First it is a sad fact that there are those on this forum that will excuse Leica for all lapses of performance. I have personally had agonizing, and very time consuming situations with Leica after sales on several occasions over many years. ...and on top of that it has been a very expensive relationship. I have read that the director in charge is happily stating that 80% of all service interventions are fixed within a week....but this is certainly NOT my experience nor that of many other people. I have written about this and have been attacked as being unfair on after sales etc etc. by those who can only see good in all that Leica do. > I then saw your posting and recommendations that you need to buy flowers to get your new £4000 camera repaired that should not have gone faulty in the first place! > Then it takes 4 attempsts and it is still not fixed....and you are told that the way to approach this is to build a personal relationship. Somehow the impression is left that YOU are at fault. > Then yet again we are reminded that Geoff (and others such as Jaapv) get express service for no extra fee because they have built a realtionship....this seems like unequal treatment which is wrong. Sorry I could not resist the opportunity with my thread. That said I hope that you get the thing fixed at the 5th attempt. I also think given what you have experienced you should ask Leica for a gesture of good faith (an M9?) The advice to build a relationship unfortunately is probably actually good advice if they pick up the phone and this in itself says a lot about Leica after sales. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eoin Posted August 28, 2009 Share #32 Posted August 28, 2009 Eoin,......it should not necessarily be a prerequisite for good service especially as it may not always be possible to deal with the same person on each occasion..... I fully agree with the point you make, but I don't wish to appear as this is the only course to take to receive good service from Leica. My first experience with the individual was so positive I sought them out for subsequent dealings. However if my first dealing was less than satisfactory, I assure you I would have been looking for someone else to deal with. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BigSplash Posted August 28, 2009 Share #33 Posted August 28, 2009 Eoin, Unquestionably it is important, as a customer, to maintain a courteous attitude towards your suppliers. There is never an excuse for bad manners. But, however expedient as it may be to cultivate a particularly good relationship with one member of staff it should not necessarily be a prerequisite for good service especially as it may not always be possible to deal with the same person on each occasion. Best Dubois Dubois you are certainly correct and I am sure that you have been courteous towards Leica staff. That said I think that a product is not just a camera body. It is defined as: > The hardware and software ....M8 in this case > The quality of the item (ie conformance to requirements) ....when new and over its life FAILED > The reliability of the item. .FAILED > The brand, and image of that product > The after sales support provided by the manufacturer FAILED > Other (training, brochures etc etc). It is amasing that anyone would wish to critique you because you are unhappy about what has happened. All you have done is bought a £4000 camera body alone, plus a bunch of lenses where clearly the score is less than perfect for each item listed. . Somehow you are in the wrong because you have not cultivated a personal relationship with a service dept. who do not answer the phone!!?? I do not get it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BigSplash Posted August 28, 2009 Share #34 Posted August 28, 2009 As is so often the case in life... Nothing wrong with that, if you ask me. You are kidding! I have such a relationship with my yacht supplier as it is a custom built item, but for a standard M8 product ....what about my car, hifi etc etc do I need to build a rapour with at a personal level? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andybarton Posted August 28, 2009 Share #35 Posted August 28, 2009 I have found it better to get a personal relationship (in a professional way!) with my dealer. HE has the access to the right people in Solms. HE is the one that got me excellent service when my M7 was treated earlier this year. HE is the one I have a contract with when buying my kit. HE is the one that has the contract with Leica. Having said that, I do have the personal email of the service manager at Leica UK, but have found that it is better to deal with Solms, via my dealer. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stunsworth Posted August 28, 2009 Share #36 Posted August 28, 2009 I have read that the director in charge is happily stating that 80% of all service interventions are fixed within a week....but this is certainly NOT my experience nor that of many other people. Logically _someone_ has to fall into the other 20%. People are far more likely to post their frustration if they feel they've been treated badly than they are likely to post a message to say that everything went smoothly. Anecdotal evidence isn't sufficient, without knowing the numbers you can't say whether the 80% statement is true or untrue. Do you have the numbers Frank? If you do are you saying that the director is lying? It would also help if you could point us to where the 80% claim was made. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BigSplash Posted August 28, 2009 Share #37 Posted August 28, 2009 Logically _someone_ has to fall into the other 20%. People are far more likely to post their frustration if they feel they've been treated badly than they are likely to post a message to say that everything went smoothly. Without knowing the numbers you can't say whether the 80% statement is true or untrue. Do you have the numbers Frank? Are you calling the director a liar? It would also help if you could point us to where the 80% claim was made. The 80% claim was made in a thread just after the recent Solms meeting .....I have no visibility of the number but would believe that the number may be correct if all old camera and lens repairs are taken into account. I have no way to confirm or dispute the number. That said the 80% number is suggestive of a fast, responsive service dept. and if true I do not believe we would see the level of complaints with respect to new product. New camera repairs should whistle thorugh in my opinion and that is clearly not happening as evidenced repeatedly in threads on the forum. Dubois cannot even manage to get them on the phone. My own experience has been awful on new (less than two years old) equipment and I have taken the approach of going via my dealer as has been suggested here. However in previous threads we have been advised to go directly to Solms as it is much faster. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rdubois Posted August 28, 2009 Author Share #38 Posted August 28, 2009 Andy I'd generally agree with you but in the case of my M8 and the nature of the failure it had to go back to Solms anyway and going via the dealer would just have lengthened the process. Anyway, the GOOD NEWS is that their online tracking shows that shipment is now in progress and ahead of time as specified yesterday. Thankyou Leica. :) Dubois Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BigSplash Posted August 28, 2009 Share #39 Posted August 28, 2009 I have found it better to get a personal relationship (in a professional way!) with my dealer. HE has the access to the right people in Solms. HE is the one that got me excellent service when my M7 was treated earlier this year. HE is the one I have a contract with when buying my kit. HE is the one that has the contract with Leica. Having said that, I do have the personal email of the service manager at Leica UK, but have found that it is better to deal with Solms, via my dealer. This is what I have done in the past ......and it takes a long time and my M5 came back with the flash lead not soldered. Andy in a previous thread it was strongly suggested to ship the camera or lens directly to Solms or NJ as it is reputed to be quicker. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stunsworth Posted August 28, 2009 Share #40 Posted August 28, 2009 That said the 80% number is suggestive of a fast, responsive service dept. and if true I do not believe we would see the level of complaints with respect to new product. But what _is_ the true level of complaints with new product? I certainly don't know, do you? Yes, for the individual it's very, very, bad news, but you can't extrapolate from isolated incidents and say anything about the percentage of this or that. To do that you need figures. Number of units sold, number of units faulty. Number of units sent in for repair, number of units repaired within 5 working days. Again, these are numbers I have absolutely no idea about. Maybe it's time for you to call Stefan Daniel again. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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