edinsiam Posted March 13, 2009 Share #21 Posted March 13, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) Interesting comments regarding the Arab attutude towards photography. I thought that, whilst arts like drwaing and painting are forbidden by certain very traditionalist Islamic communities because of the danger of wanting to "create" something, which is something that only God can do, photography was actually accepted. If I am not wrong, in Islam they call this "creating" which is forbidden "shrik". Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted March 13, 2009 Posted March 13, 2009 Hi edinsiam, Take a look here M8 or M7?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
dewittehd Posted March 14, 2009 Share #22 Posted March 14, 2009 I spent 6 years in Riyadh and exposed as many rolls of film..... IMHO Saudi and photography don't go together, even if Jeddah is slightly less conservative than Riyadh. Good luck, Jean Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jockele Posted March 14, 2009 Share #23 Posted March 14, 2009 M8.2 Best wishes Jockele Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael-IIIf Posted March 14, 2009 Share #24 Posted March 14, 2009 (heard that in Jeddah people are more open then in ryiad, were i stayed).l True, Jeddah is much more relaxed. I've worked in both places. I heard all the warnings about photography before I went but to be frank I had less hassle there than photographers are currently getting in the UK. I could tell you some funny stories about smuggling cameras past the security guards to photograph a certain royal yacht I was working on. I own both an M6 and an M8. For Saudi I would be tempted to get the M8, you will get memory cards everywhere but I would imagine film processing labs are getting thin on the ground. The Saudis are always quick at adopting new technologies and chucking out the old. Have fun. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael-IIIf Posted March 14, 2009 Share #25 Posted March 14, 2009 I am open do convince myself. I luckily have not been forced to travel to Saudi but have worked and lived in the Middle East quite a bit. My comments are based on direct experience of friends (including arabs) who stayed there for month to years. All said they would never ever return to Saudi after return although some of them followed the track of money again. Regards Steve Steve (and Matt) Yes KSA is not to everyone's taste but I'm sure Matt has done his homework before accepting the job. From my experiences there over the years I would advise hanging onto your passport whenever possible. Employers like to keep employees' passports. With a bit of negotiation you might be able to hang on to yours. It'll give you greater peace of mind. On one return flight the chap sitting next to me was a Belgian engineer who was sweating from head to toe. He told me he had had to jump through hoops to get is passport back from his employer who had basically held him prisoner in KSA for the previous few years. Another thing to be wary about is the driving. Everyone drives believing Allah will look after them. He doesn't always and road fatalities are shockingly high. A colleague and good friend was killed on the freeway north out of Riyadh. Finally the attitude to life can be a bit shocking to western sensibilities. One office we used to visit regularly we noticed was missing its print-boy on one visit. These were the days of ammonia dye-line printing for anyone who is old enough to remember them. When we asked where Abdul was we were told he died of ammonia poisoning. Obviously due to lack of ventilation. We protested that that was terrible news but their reply was simply: "Oh not really, we'll easily get another boy". Cheaper than fixing the ventilation. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcraf Posted March 14, 2009 Share #26 Posted March 14, 2009 Steve (and Matt) Another thing to be wary about is the driving. Everyone drives believing Allah will look after them. He doesn't always and road fatalities are shockingly high. A colleague and good friend was killed on the freeway north out of Riyadh. I would agree on that; I had quite a few close shaves when I was there, including last moment avoidance of cars running at night without lights. I was always told that in the event of a car accident with a Saudi, I would automatically be at fault and be arrested. The Saudi logic was that if I, a foreign infidel, hadn't been there then the accident would not have happened, no matter whose fault the accident actually was. Not sure how true that was or is, but as employees of Her Majesty's Govt, we all carried official Govt documentation to give to the Saudi police, just in case. Anyhow, I'm now way off topic.......... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattwardle Posted March 14, 2009 Author Share #27 Posted March 14, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) I'm going out in a week so will hold off buying anything until Ive really settled in and worked out whats what. I'm really wanting to use my M for travel photography due to my central location so I think the M8 will be the choice. Thanks for all your advice on Saudi, Ive done allot of research and one of my good friends is out at the company I'm moving to, plus my wife's family lived in Riyadh for 4 years and loved it. Driving - Ive been told to get the biggest 4x4 I can afford - so a Land Cruiser will be ordered on arrival!! Thanks again guys - for now I will settle with my D200 and a prime Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kukuphoto Posted July 14, 2009 Share #28 Posted July 14, 2009 Hi, I live in Jeddah and I agree with some issues pointed out, however, alot has changed. You are now allowed to shoot as long as there arent no signs indicating that photography is not allowed. You also dont want to point your cameras towards families as they still feel uncomfortable around cameras. Jeddah is way better because people mind their own business as long as you mind yours. The driving is scary, watch out for limo (taxi) drivers, crazy teenagers that are always in a rushhhh. Some of the comments I have read here are a bit harsh, default, and incorrect. You might have had some bad experiences here with the wrong people.unfortunateIy. But there are "wrong" people everywhere no matter what country,race, and religion. And I have done my share of travelling. I cant deny the fact that we depend on Allah, also known as GOD, in everything we do. God please get me there safely, but I still buckle up and keep my eyes on the road. God please help me with my exams, but I still study hard. God please help my sick grandmother, but I still take her to the hospital and give her medication. Doesnt everybody ask God for his help? Also, The Islam religion is refers to statue sculpturing as "creating", Not to photography which is actually the capturing of light, the image of Gods creations, which is NOT creating. Many dont know this, Muslims included. Respect Ziad Please check my website and galleries Kukuphoto And please feel free to contact me if you need anything here in Jeddah. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
offshore Posted July 15, 2009 Share #29 Posted July 15, 2009 Hi all! I'm moving to Jeddah, Saudi Arabia in a couple of weeks on a long term contract. I'm undecided as to which camp I should set up in, film or digital. I'm looking at investing long term into the M system, I miss my old M6, however I'm concerned about the image quality of the M8, and weather I should stick with what I know best and go back down the film route? I've also no idea how easy it is to obtain the likes of velvia etc in Saudi so this may play an important part! Cheers Matt M8 and don't look back. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andalus Posted July 15, 2009 Share #30 Posted July 15, 2009 I have extensive experience in the Middle East. But been to KSA only for three weeks and that in 1980. I would suggest waiting for the M9 and taking a D Lux 4. With that camera you have a discrete way of taking fine images! And the cost is low, too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwelland Posted July 15, 2009 Share #31 Posted July 15, 2009 My worry with the M8 is really to do with the longevity and investing in a camera that produces similar files to my Nikon D200, ... With all due respect, if your M8 images look like that then either your camera or you are doing something wrong! Seriously. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NZDavid Posted July 15, 2009 Share #32 Posted July 15, 2009 What an interesting post from Ziad. Local knowledge is priceless when traveling. And a very nice site! Fascinating to hear about the differences between sculpting and photography. Of course, Islamic art is among the most beautiful and timeless in the world. I always thought it was images of people in art that were not -- usually -- accepted; but I have read that Sunni and Shi'ite differ in this regard. Apart from people, it looks like there are many scenic and architectural opportunities for photography in Saudi Arabia, too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilfredo Posted July 24, 2009 Share #33 Posted July 24, 2009 Thanks for the feedback guys. Im going to wait until I get to Jeddah to make my decision, only two weeks to go! I think the MP is a great suggestion, its my favorite M. My worry with the M8 is really to do with the longevity and investing in a camera that produces similar files to my Nikon D200, what I really want is that special M feel to the shots Ive really missed since selling my M6, so im biased to the film cameras, I just need to make sure its possible to get film and get it developed! Nothing is really similar to an M8 file, the new Olympus Ep1 comes closest. If you are new to digital, you will need to become familiar with processing soft-ware etc. As a former M6, MP, M7 and current M2 owner, I have to say that what I get from my M8 can't be beat. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenneth Posted July 24, 2009 Share #34 Posted July 24, 2009 Hi all! I'm moving to Jeddah, Saudi Arabia in a couple of weeks on a long term contract. I'm undecided as to which camp I should set up in, film or digital. I'm looking at investing long term into the M system, I miss my old M6, however I'm concerned about the image quality of the M8, and weather I should stick with what I know best and go back down the film route? I've also no idea how easy it is to obtain the likes of velvia etc in Saudi so this may play an important part! Cheers Matt M film camera would be my choice, M6, M7, MP. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
noah_addis Posted July 25, 2009 Share #35 Posted July 25, 2009 Especially if you plan to travel, I recommend the M8. I love film, and yes, it keeps getting better. But traveling with film can still be a hassle. You can carry enough cards for a week or two of shooting in very little space, and the M8 image quality is amazing. I would worry also about the availability of film (without having to ship from B&H) and also you'd have to find good labs. Clearly with digital you'll have to worry about getting cards, etc. but they're reusable so once you have enough you're set. My standard prints with the M8 are 12x18 inch and I'm consistently amazed at the quality. The prints look more like medium format than 35mm film. I've even made some 40-inch prints and was amazed at how well the files held up. Get an M8. Use Capture 1, and you'll be a happy camper. Good luck with the new job. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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