tomasis7 Posted September 22, 2008 Share #81 Posted September 22, 2008 Advertisement (gone after registration) Who know if Leica coud produce Summilux S-lenses I like S2 design much better than Hasselblad H series. It might be a lot easier to handle too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted September 22, 2008 Posted September 22, 2008 Hi tomasis7, Take a look here Digital Reflex S2 - please post all thoughts here.... I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
sandymc Posted September 22, 2008 Share #82 Posted September 22, 2008 Well, that's an absolutely stunning achievement on Leica's part. For a company Leica's size, just to build an AF system that's competitive with Nikon/Canon "from the ground up" would be stunning. Regardless of price. But nine lenses as well? Amazing - it just blows me away. But I would say that the Flickr image looks heavily Photoshopped to me; I hope this is for real...... Sandy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
manolo Posted September 22, 2008 Share #83 Posted September 22, 2008 I bet my R glass fits, as well 30*45mm sensor and a larger than ff viwefinder. It reminds me of the DMR with the vf being larger than the sensor but in this case larger also than the lens circle. So a scuare crop?,a 3/4 crop etc... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlesphoto99 Posted September 22, 2008 Share #84 Posted September 22, 2008 Cool idea (that I'll never be able to afford ). Lets hope for Leica's sake that they get the electronics in this one right before release. Anything like the M8 debacle (need for filters, initial batch recall, etc) and pros are just going to move on and pass this one by. The M8 had a built in base of previous lens owners so no matter what it was going to sell, even with teething problems. But this is a new system from the ground up which is going to be a real leap for many pros. Personally, I'm looking forward to a rangefinder MFD ala the Mamiya 6/7. Not holding my breath.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stunsworth Posted September 22, 2008 Share #85 Posted September 22, 2008 One further point. The camera can use either a focal plane shutter, or a leaf shutter, so you can choose to have either fast shutter speeds _or_ fast flash sync. What's the fastest shutter speed / flash sync on the other available MF bodies? Genuine question, I have no idea - or even know if this dual shutter facility is available elsewhere. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mgcd Posted September 22, 2008 Share #86 Posted September 22, 2008 Did I mention it's weather-sealed? Why on earth would you need that for fashion?? It's smaller than a 1d3 and a bit bigger than a 5d? That's a small dSLR with a very large sensor I'm not even sure how they did that. I bet my R glass fits, as well Sounds like a good bet to me, in the lineage of the "S" system if you catch my meaning.... We'll see in less than one hour Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolo Posted September 22, 2008 Share #87 Posted September 22, 2008 Advertisement (gone after registration) I haven't seen a price yet... but the specs have me hopeful they are TARGETTING Canon and Nikon. Did I mention it's weather-sealed? Why on earth would you need that for fashion?? It's smaller than a 1d3 and a bit bigger than a 5d? That's a small dSLR with a very large sensor I'm not even sure how they did that. I bet my R glass fits, as well It's beyond Canon and Nikon. If the photographer is satisfied with a 1Ds or a D3, he won't want one of these. If he's unhappy with the D3 & 1Ds, but needs the speed they offer that he can't get from the 1 frame a second Hass .... this is for him. It starts and finishes with glass. N&C haven't got the glass to take them beyond 30 mpix, so the bar was set beyond them an all new glass developed to support it. The 21mm M lens has dropped out of that work. Weather sealing ?? If you design a tool like this it has to be able to go out of the studio and weather sealing also means dust proofing, not silly waterfalls. Not sure how they have gone to the size of sensor, but there cannot be a swinging mirror in a body that size .... must be some form of pellical mirror technology ..... again weather sealing/ dust proofing. I'll be surprised if the R glass will work. No doubt, if it will work an adapter will be available, but the throat of that body looks massive. Obviously, this technology will be passed down to the R range sometime soon and IMO that will be the direct competitor for the D3 and 1Ds. Leica is being re-born. Rolo Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KevinA Posted September 22, 2008 Share #88 Posted September 22, 2008 It looks like the camera many have wanted, but very scary. With a Canon system you have a backup body or two, even a couple of 1DsmkIII will most likely be half the price of one S Leica. If it's under £10k and does what we all hope it will, I would consider going on the waiting list, if it's £20k + it will be to rich for me whatever its performance. I'm glad it wasn't around last year when money was no object, 'cos this year I would be struggling to fund that kind of machine and the new car and fuel and food and heating and and and.... Kevin. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
markowich Posted September 22, 2008 Share #89 Posted September 22, 2008 i am just wondering: if leica can really do this -after their discouraging m8 intro and untimely firmware issues (wb, larger then 2gb cards were just made posible with the recent firmware..) and backfocusing lens disasters- then why can nikon/canon/hasselblad/leaf not do it, given all the serious technology they have? where does leica suddenly have the technology from? you can buy sensors, but, for example, did nikon sell them their autofocus algorithms? i doubt it. at this point, i see no reason to sell my H1/P45/A75 combos. peter Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolo Posted September 22, 2008 Share #90 Posted September 22, 2008 The problems is in the price.What pricing will be necessary in order to make this S2 competitive? Hasselblad is offering a HD3-II camera + 31MP back for 12.000 euros (+ a 80mm lens). So any price higher than that is too dangerous. The price for the high end professional market is not of prime importance. Having the tool for the job is what makes the fee possible. Weren't these guys paying £30,000 for digital backs not long ago ? If you want to shoot in bursts of 8 frames a second and collect 37 mp files what competition is there ? Answer ... none ! This will not suit the 5D market, nor the Leica user with £1,200's worth of ten year old glass. This is bleeding edge product. The R replacement will be soon no doubt for the guy with the sub-£20,000 budget. Rolo Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andybarton Posted September 22, 2008 Share #91 Posted September 22, 2008 On the other hand, I see too many systems for a company so small like Leica: M, R, S, M4/3... How they will handle this? How they will keep alive the R system? Seeing as how Leica have now "upped the ante", it could well be that they do not dip their toes in the Micro 4/3 market at all. In a couple of hours, I am sure we will learn more. Let's hope the server is up to it Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
marknorton Posted September 22, 2008 Share #92 Posted September 22, 2008 Looks great, though way out of my league. If this is the real camera, I welcome the fresh design, just wish the M8 hadn't turned out to be so conservative in its design. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mooky Posted September 22, 2008 Share #93 Posted September 22, 2008 i am just wondering: if leica can really do this -after their discouraging m8 intro and untimely firmware issues (wb, larger then 2gb cards were just made posible with the recent firmware..) and backfocusing lens disasters- then why can nikon/canon/hasselblad/leaf not do it, given all the serious technology they have? where does leica suddenly have the technology from? you can buy sensors, but, for example, did nikon sell them their autofocus algorithms? i doubt it. at this point, i see no reason to sell my H1/P45/A75 combos. peter Remember, all the issues you mention were/are a result of pre-Kaufmann ideas. Hang in there - let's see what this is all about - but it's still a huge step for Leica. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ndjambrose Posted September 22, 2008 Share #94 Posted September 22, 2008 It's a great camera and fulfils a niche. Perfect! Not sure I see it as a Nikon/Canon killer though - I think they're very different markets. The sensor size of the S series means there'll never be really fast glass for it. In MF world f4 is pretty normal, and f2.8 is about as fast as it goes due to cost of manufacture and weight of the glass needed to cover that image circle at wider apertures. So if anyone's looking for f1.4 they'll need to keep their 35mm outfits. But I could see this as a great replacement for my Hasselblad - similar or better resolution with smaller form-factor, and the benefit of weather sealing and robust casing. And for anyone running a business who can depreciate the cost against tax over two or three years, it's also a lot more affordable than some early posters in this thread seem to think. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rosuna Posted September 22, 2008 Share #95 Posted September 22, 2008 One further point. The camera can use either a focal plane shutter, or a leaf shutter, so you can choose to have either fast shutter speeds _or_ fast flash sync. What's the fastest shutter speed / flash sync on the other available MF bodies? Genuine question, I have no idea - or even know if this dual shutter facility is available elsewhere. Hasselblad and Rollei/Sinar/Leaf have leaf shutter lenses... Mamiya has focal plane shutter, but they are developing new leaf shutter lenses (the first will come later this year, and new ones will come in 2009). Leaf shutter lenses are more expensive and bigger... This is a system for studio professionals... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
graham_mitchell Posted September 22, 2008 Share #96 Posted September 22, 2008 cant see it being long though before canon drop a 40-50mp sensor in the 1ds Does that matter? The sensor is too small for that many pixels, the viewfinder will still be limited in size, they have no leaf shutter lenses, and no decent wides, etc. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrc Posted September 22, 2008 Share #97 Posted September 22, 2008 Many questions here. If the S2 allows the use of R lenses with an adapter, as with Nikon DX lenses giving a crop of their FF cameras, it would certainly ease the cost problem -- You'd have a Leica quality FF camera using your R lenses, and could then buy the new lenses as you could afford them. Price is absolutely critical. If the price is really 30,000 euros, it will have trouble competing with the removable-back systems. Leica would be better-off, IMHO, selling the body for less -- for cost, if necessary -- and looking for their profit on the lenses. It won't be going to Iraq. Leica IQ is not necessary (not usable) for PJ photos, and who really wants to risk a Leica, when you could risk a Canon, with no difference in the end-product? This would be a dream product for high-end outdoor art and fashion photographers, though, if it actually has weather sealing, given the numbers of those kind of shots that are done in the desert, and near oceans... The marketing will be interesting, to say the least. JC Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
graham_mitchell Posted September 22, 2008 Share #98 Posted September 22, 2008 Incidentally, the S2 is no more of a paradigm shift than the Mamiya ZD was. The ZD introduced nothing new at all. It was an attempt to bring out a cheaper product by cutting corners. The S2 could be the first medium format camera with high speed AF. It could be the first with 2 fps or more (let's see). It's the only current camera I can thinkof which combines leaf shutter lenses and a focal plane shutter. It's the first time a 35mm manufacturer is going to medium format. The list goes on.... exciting! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
graham_mitchell Posted September 22, 2008 Share #99 Posted September 22, 2008 The Leaf AFi is about 28.500 Euros, the Sinar Hy6 about 26.000 Euros, both the Sinar and the Leaf with 33 Megapixels. So the S2 for something about 20.000 might be worth the money. (http://www.fotopartner.de) The Sinar Hy6 - 65, which is 31 MP, is EUR 12'073. The new Leica looks great, but if it's over EUR 15K for a basic set, I don't see it taking off. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
graham_mitchell Posted September 22, 2008 Share #100 Posted September 22, 2008 What's the fastest shutter speed / flash sync on the other available MF bodies? Genuine question, I have no idea - or even know if this dual shutter facility is available elsewhere. The dual shutter is not available elsewhere. The fastest leaf shutter lenses are the Rollei PQS lenses - 1/1000. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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