Leica Tele-Elmarit 90mm f2.8 is the same as Leica Tele-Elmarit-M 90mm f2.8

[wolan]

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Hi,

please help me to understand.

I have just seen on a Japanese website some beautiful pictures taken with this lens: Tele-Elmarit 90mm f2.8 (that is what is written on the website, no more infos).

I did check this Wikipedia site for Leica lenses and indeed there is a Tele-Elmarit 90mm f2.8

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Leica_lenses

However, looking up in the internet and on eBay I find both Tele-Elmarit 90mm f2.8 and Tele-Elmarit-M 90mm f2.8, which is not reported on the Wikipedia page btw.

So it is the same lens? Or are two different lenses?

Thanks.

 

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[Ecar]

These should clarify:

https://wiki.l-camera-forum.com/leica-wiki.en/index.php/90mm_f/2.8_Tele-Elmarit-M

https://wiki.l-camera-forum.com/leica-wiki.en/index.php/90mm_f/2.8_Tele-Elmarit

[TomB_tx]

They are two different models. In the Leica-Wiki of M lenses listed by focal length it lists both next to each other. The Tele Elmarit 90 2.8 was produced from 1964 to 1974, and the -M model after 1974. Commonly the later unit (-M) is called the "Thin" Tele Elmarit and the earlier one the "Fat" Tele Elmarit. I bought the earlier model as my first Leica lens when I bought my M4 in 1968, and it still performs beautifully on my M10. Some report the -M model has better performance, while others report more problems with that model as they age, such as internal haze that can't be cleared. The earlier Fat model is the same diameter as the non-tele Elmarit 2.8, so the Fat designation is just because the new model is thinner. The Fat model does have a long focus throw or rotation, which makes for fine control, but is slower in fast action. I never user the Thin model so I don't know it it was changed then. I also have a 90 Summarit 2.5 that is faster focusing, but in spite of that I use the Fat TeleElmarit more.

The "-M" confusion is that originally M mount lenses didn't have the -M designation, but it was added to new models in the 1970s, likely because Leica was pushing the "R" models more.

 

[Ecar]

I sold the fat version many years ago and kept the thin one, only because of its small size and weight. Extremely useful for travel. The thin's main drawback in my experience is its propensity to flare.

[farnz]

I second what Ecar has said. 

The 'thin' 90/2.8 Tele-Elmar is a lovely little lens and provided that its tendency to flare is noted it produces very good pictures.

Pete.

[UliWer]

Am 21.4.2025 um 21:34 schrieb wolan:

I find both Tele-Elmarit 90mm f2.8 and Tele-Elmarit-M 90mm f2.8

Yes, you find both variants of the "thin" Tele-Elmarit". The earlier production didn't have the "-M" engraving yet. The lenses didn't differ otherwise: same optical design, same black anodized lens mount, all produced in Midland Canada  etc. It was only the new Leitz nomenclature to make a distinction between lenses for the M and for the R-system. They say (though this is not completely reliable) that the "thin"Tele-Elmarit (without "-M") was introduced in 1973 with serial number 2585 501 and goes to 2.794.650.  From 2.831.351 (1977) onwards it is engraved Tele-Elmarit-M.

So you have the "fat" Tele-Elmarit in silver chrome and black which never had the -M suffix and the black "thin" Tele-Elmarit without "M" and the same lens with "-M".

To add to the confusion there was also the early Elmarit 90mm 1:2.8 (always without M) which was produced from 1958 to 1974 (so it was on offer at the same time as the "fat" and the earliest batches of the "thin" Tele-Elmarit). It is longer than the two Tele-Elmarits as it was no "tele" lens design. It comes in silver chrome and the late examples black anodized,  there is also a rare version in screw-mount. The optical performance is in no way worse - other than the two Tele-Elmarits it is not prone to flare, lens separation is no issue. Does anybody know a lens (of whatever brand) which shows less vignetting and distortion?  Other than with all Tele-Elmarits you can unscrew the lens head and use it for close focussing with the Visoflex and especially the bellows - the results will only be topped by the Apo-Macro Elmarit-R. Though it must be a bad lens since it is unpopular in this forum because it is a little bit longer than the others - let's leave it there, it is still one of the cheapest Leica lenses.

Some more confusion: there is of course the late Elmarit-M without "Tele-" which was the successor of the thin Tele-Elmarit-M produced from 1988 to 2007: the optical performance was much improved, though it is a rather heavy lens.  

[adan]

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Basically, when Leitz/Leica introduced the Leicaflex SLR line in 1964, to differentiate the lenses for that mount from the M lenses, they designated those as Summicron-Rs, Elmarit-Rs, and so on.

A lens with no suffix-letter was presumed to be for the M.

About 15 years later, Leitz finally decided that M lenses should have their own suffix ("-M") as well. Especially since Dr. Mandler and Leitz Canada were introducing whole new optical designs (the "class of 1980" lenses) for many of them (21 Elmarit-M, 28 Elmarit-M v.3, 35 Summicron-M v.4, 50mm Summicron-M v.4, 75mm Summilux-M, 90mm Summicron-M v.3 - all 1980 designs ± a year or so.)

(In addition, at the same time, Leitz began applying the large yellow focal-length designators beside the DoF scale on the lens mount (  21, 28, 35, 75, 90, etc.)

And for consistency's sake, also added the "-M" suffix and yellow numbers to the pre-1980 designs that remained in the line-up, but had not changed optically (90 Tele-Elmarit v.2 thin, 50 Summilux and Noctilux f/1.0, 35 Summilux, and the 135s)