d-lux8 D-Lux 8: DNG: post process as monochrom in Lightroom

[Leicamero]

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On 9/19/2024 at 9:19 PM, HansPAF said:

PS: Today I accidentally found a way to output a TIFF (lossless and, unfortunately, uncompressed), which corresponds to the JPG in terms of color and tonal values. Tested in PSD with 2 layers and the difference. 

Hi, Could you help to share how did you output to TIFF directly from the camera? I also have D-lux 8 and like the JPG color science but also like some room for post adjustment.

[jaapv]

The TIFF is contained in the raw - your raw converter can output the TIFF format.

 

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[HansPAF]

Am 22.9.2024 um 12:31 schrieb Leicamero:

Hi, Could you help to share how did you output to TIFF directly from the camera? I also have D-lux 8 and like the JPG color science but also like some room for post adjustment.

It is nice to read that there are also people who like the general output of the Leica D-Lux 8, like me. Yes, I can agree with you: after the export, a few adjustments (maybe in blacks, whites, shadows, brightness, and exposure), and then you usually have a great result.

My approach is:

1. Take a picture with the appropriate profile (BW / BW HC).
2. Transfer the DNG files to Apple Photos
   • via the Leica Software on iPhone/iPad, or
   • via the Mac, in which the SD card is read directly by the Photos app.
3. Export as TIFF (Files -> Export -> TIFF). See screenshot.

Afterward, if needed/desired, you can post-process the images with more or less any program that can read TIFF files. The workflow is lossless. 

With this method, the TIFF images correspond exactly to the JPG images. The size of a TIFF file is approx. 101 MB (macOS).

BR.
 

 

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[HansPAF]

vor 18 Stunden schrieb jaapv:

The TIFF is contained in the raw - your raw converter can output the TIFF format.

[…]

On the subject of whether the TIFFs are integrated into the DNG. As far as I know and after further research (e.g. Wiki, Adobe) the DNG are based on the TIFF format, but there are no dedicated TIFF images included that can be explicitly extracted. However, I could be wrong.

[jaapv]

There are no image files included in a DNG ( except for a small jpg). A DNG file is a data container which can be developed to an image file. 

[davidzvi]

@HansPAF You are not alone.  Late to this thread, but I just picked up the D-Lux 8 and am surprised that profiles are not available in LR by default. 

I almost always shoot RAW + JPEG.  This is the first digital camera I have owned that, when I open the files in Lightroom, the JPEG and RAW either don't look the same, or I can't just select the right profile so they do match. 

For context, I was a professional event photographer, and I like to try different things.  So my list of cameras over the last 25 years has included Nikon, Fuji, Sony, Olympus/OM System, Panasonic, Ricoh, Pentax, and Canon.  About 55 of those shot RAW, this is the first without Lightroom profiles.  Additionally, I've been using Lightroom since beta 4, the first version available for Windows.

I haven't had a lot of time to explore the forum yet.  Has a better resolution been found for this other than saving as a TIFF?

[jaapv]

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Save as DNG ? 

[Einst_Stein]

It appears to me DNG file does not contain some or all post processing infos. For example, I scanned a negative by digital camper into  DNG, then post process to convert to positive image in LR, then either save or export to another DNG file. When open the DNG as a fresh file, it will appear as the original negative image. I didn’t check whether only the inversion was lost or all post processing was lost.

If any post processing info was lost, then it is impossible to display the post-processed image as seen in LR from the re-imported DNG (unless staying in the original post processing LR)

Not sure how other raw format works, not sure DL7 raw format, what happens to DL7 raw file might not be the same to DL8.

 

Edited August 10 by Einst_Stein

[davidzvi]

9 hours ago, Einst_Stein said:

It appears to me DNG file does not contain some or all post processing infos. For example, I scanned a negative by digital camper into  DNG, then post process to convert to positive image in LR, then either save or export to another DNG file. When open the DNG as a fresh file, it will appear as the original negative image. I didn’t check whether only the inversion was lost or all post processing was lost.

If any post processing info was lost, then it is impossible to display the post-processed image as seen in LR from the re-imported DNG (unless staying in the original post processing LR)

Not sure how other raw format works, not sure DL7 raw format, what happens to DL7 raw file might not be the same to DL8.

 

Odd.  A Ricoh GR IIIx also uses DNG, and I did get the "camera setting" in LR.  I also see them in other camera brands when I export as DNG.  I saw that a lot in the past few versions of LR when it would save a DNG for noise reduction.

The DL7 has profiles in LR; see the file list.  I had hoped that when I found a post about legacy profiles being disabled by default, that would be the solution, but sadly, it was not the case. In the other attached image, I just want the DNG to come in with the settings used to create the JPEG.  It's the starting point for my process (normally NAT or B&W HC).

 

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[Einst_Stein]

If LR does save some post processing infos into DNG and can be seen if freshly imported, I hope to find simmaries what can be saved and what not, even better, how to save all post processing if possible. 

[davidzvi]

29 minutes ago, Einst_Stein said:

If LR does save some post processing infos into DNG and can be seen if freshly imported, I hope to find simmaries what can be saved and what not, even better, how to save all post processing if possible. 

There is nothing that would be stored in an XMP file that isn't stored in a DNG.  Or at least there shouldn't be, since Adobe was the founder of the format.

[Einst_Stein]

I don’t have knowledge about that. All I know is the inversion and exposure adjust on the scanned negatives would not be saved in the DNG.  

[marchyman]

On 8/10/2025 at 6:32 AM, Einst_Stein said:

It appears to me DNG file does not contain some or all post processing infos.

It is an option.  By default post processing info is not written to the DNG (or XMP sidecar) by Lightroom Classic.  If you save after editing an image the DNG will be updated.  You can also select images and save at any time.  The menu item is in the Metadata menu on maxOS -- ⌘S.

There is also a checkbox in the Catalog Settings to "Automatically write changes to XMP".  Memory said that when the option was checked edits would automatically be saved to DNG files, too. However, I just tried that and it didn't work.  Perhaps my memory is incorrect.

[davidzvi]

15 hours ago, Einst_Stein said:

I don’t have knowledge about that. All I know is the inversion and exposure adjust on the scanned negatives would not be saved in the DNG.  

 

1 hour ago, marchyman said:

It is an option.  By default post processing info is not written to the DNG (or XMP sidecar) by Lightroom Classic.  If you save after editing an image the DNG will be updated.  You can also select images and save at any time.  The menu item is in the Metadata menu on maxOS -- ⌘S.

There is also a checkbox in the Catalog Settings to "Automatically write changes to XMP".  Memory said that when the option was checked edits would automatically be saved to DNG files, too. However, I just tried that and it didn't work.  Perhaps my memory is incorrect.

@marchyman is correct. It's something I take for granted; I always have it set to save the data.

[Einst_Stein]

5 hours ago, marchyman said:

It is an option.  By default post processing info is not written to the DNG (or XMP sidecar) by Lightroom Classic.  If you save after editing an image the DNG will be updated.  You can also select images and save at any time.  The menu item is in the Metadata menu on maxOS -- ⌘S.

There is also a checkbox in the Catalog Settings to "Automatically write changes to XMP".  Memory said that when the option was checked edits would automatically be saved to DNG files, too. However, I just tried that and it didn't work.  Perhaps my memory is incorrect.

Catalog setting is set by default. But it doesn't work for me.

[Einst_Stein]

4 hours ago, davidzvi said:

 

@marchyman is correct. It's something I take for granted; I always have it set to save the data.

Can you please try to post process any image, say inverse it, then save to DNG, then re-import, see if the inversion still there. 

 

[davidzvi]

1 hour ago, Einst_Stein said:

Can you please try to post process any image, say inverse it, then save to DNG, then re-import, see if the inversion still there. 

 

Is this what you are looking for (Original, edited, imported DNG with edits retained).

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Edited August 12 by davidzvi

[marchyman]

I snapped this image looking out my window.

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I inverted the image using Tone Curve tool in LrC then used ⌘S to save the metadata.  I copied the saved image and renamed is so I could re-import it into LrC. Be aware that saving the metadata does NOT update in thumbnail in the DNG file. The import screen shows the original thumbnail which makes it look like the changes were not saved.  However, once imported and after the preview has been generated the image looked like this:

That shows the metadata was written to the file and used by LrC upon import.  I also looked at the DNG metadata before and after changing and saving the image.  Lots if info written to the metadata.

If you are not seeing the changes are you sure you are not looking at the original thumbnail stored in the DNG?  The Mac finder seems to use the thumbnail. That would give the impression that the edits aren't saved.  To update the thumbnail as well you can export your edited file as a DNG file. That creates a new file that also can include an updated thumbnail. In export File Settings use file type of DNG and select a medium or large JPEG preview.