status of M11 lockups/freezes?

[Malabito]

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7 hours ago, goodbokeh said:

Yes Malabito, post #50 are the results of the survey. Maybe there will be a further update but I don't expect a Excel spreadsheet report given the nature of the responses as Admin. characterized them.

That's not really the results it's just marketing...

• Share of users without freezes doubled => FW 2.1.1 has fixed the most relevant issues
• Some users still experience freezes

The results should mention what was the universe of voters and those who voted:

- how many had issues before and continue

- how many had issues before and don't have now

- how many didn't have issues and now have

They just gave you some marketing blablabla... 

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[MaxGor]

11 hours ago, brickftl said:

2 questions

1. has anyone who experienced freeze/lockup had that situation persist more than a minute or two, or even worse, been a permanent situation?

Not in my experience of Leica M11-P.  When camera gets unresponsive, I am taking battery off, putting it back and  I am sorted in the next 5 seconds.    

I bough my Leica a few month ago, so do not have years of observations. 

[brickftl]

6 hours ago, LeicaR10 said:

Hdmesa,   The last update I tried was 2.1.1 in May with the M11-P.  When I lost files and then froze on day 2, it went back to the dealer for refund and picked up a M10-R from the same.  My nuclear powered wallet suffered a melt down as well.   r/ Mark 

by any chance do you know what the build date was on your M11P? 

And did you lose files on the removable SD card or the internal storage?

I may have done something stupid but just bought a mint condition M11P for a good price - build date was December 2023. The owner says he hasn't experienced feezing/loss of files.

And to others who had the problem, are there any steps you've taken that have diminished/stopped any further freezes - such as the type of removable card you use (or whether you only use the internal storage), or any other tips?

[Malabito]

13 minutes ago, brickftl said:

by any chance do you know what the build date was on your M11P? 

And did you lose files on the removable SD card or the internal storage?

I may have done something stupid but just bought a mint condition M11P for a good price - build date was December 2023. The owner says he hasn't experienced feezing/loss of files.

And to others who had the problem, are there any steps you've taken that have diminished/stopped any further freezes - such as the type of removable card you use (or whether you only use the internal storage), or any other tips?

Congratulations on the new camera! I would honestly ignore all comments and recommendations, as no one really knows what causes the freezes. Just use a UHS-II SD card from a reliable company and use the camera as you see fit.

 

Sadly, many are selling the M11s and lying about the freezing issue. Some have even been open about it here in the group. I almost got banned for criticizing some here in the group for lying. Hopefully, you are lucky and get to enjoy your camera. So just use your canera and enjoy it!

 

[Derbyshire Man]

For now I wouldn't worry about it. Just keep using your camera. I find they are more stable using internal storage only.

[IMAGEPOWER]

Am 4.7.2024 um 20:23 schrieb Malabito:

Just curious you mentioned you have the shutter to continuous low... don't you find that it behaves irregular? Like sometimes it shoots many picts on a row when you try to shoot one image and sometimes many?

I actually cant use the camera in continuous low, it has to be in single or in high, but also in high it's quite erratic 

same here on my M11 and M11-P. I am glad I only rarely use continuous rates (low or high). No such problem on my M10-P and M10 Monochrom. Possibly connected with fact that shutter is always open when camera is ON...

[LeicaR10]

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Brickftl,   To answer your questions in your Post # 43 to me, the M11-P was made in February 2024.  I lost files both on my SD cards and Internal storage.  The freezes were secondary to me.  I had camera freeze all the way back to M9s.  It did stop for a while when I used SD Card Formatter and my procedure for formatting cards starting back with the M240.  This worked for a bit with the M11 and M11-M, but that all changed with a firmware update and it didn't work any more.  I could not afford to have missing files considering my work.  I tried the M11-P thinking the issues were mostly resolved...I was wrong.  As I wrote to Hdmesa, my nuclear powered wallet took a melt down.  I went back to the M10-R and M10-M for stability and reliability.  For whatever reason, some M11 users are forunate to have no or few issues, others have major M11 issues...I fell in the latter group.  As I suggested before, save yourself some grief and certainly money and wait until the issues are definitively resolved or simply buy a reliable/stable M10-R and go take photographs.  r/ Mark

PS..I just reread your post, where you bought a M11-P at a good price.  Might be a reason(s) why you got a "mint" M11-P for a "good price".  I suggest, if you can return it for a refund...you might consider doing so...or, perhaps you will keep in mind the famous Clint Eastwood, Dirty Harry movie line...."Do you feel lucky?".   r/ Mark

Edited July 7, 2024 by LeicaR10

[brickftl]

On 7/6/2024 at 9:37 PM, LeicaR10 said:

Brickftl,   To answer your questions in your Post # 43 to me, the M11-P was made in February 2024.  I lost files both on my SD cards and Internal storage.  The freezes were secondary to me.  I had camera freeze all the way back to M9s.  It did stop for a while when I used SD Card Formatter and my procedure for formatting cards starting back with the M240.  This worked for a bit with the M11 and M11-M, but that all changed with a firmware update and it didn't work any more.  I could not afford to have missing files considering my work.  I tried the M11-P thinking the issues were mostly resolved...I was wrong.  As I wrote to Hdmesa, my nuclear powered wallet took a melt down.  I went back to the M10-R and M10-M for stability and reliability.  For whatever reason, some M11 users are forunate to have no or few issues, others have major M11 issues...I fell in the latter group.  As I suggested before, save yourself some grief and certainly money and wait until the issues are definitively resolved or simply buy a reliable/stable M10-R and go take photographs.  r/ Mark

PS..I just reread your post, where you bought a M11-P at a good price.  Might be a reason(s) why you got a "mint" M11-P for a "good price".  I suggest, if you can return it for a refund...you might consider doing so...or, perhaps you will keep in mind the famous Clint Eastwood, Dirty Harry movie line...."Do you feel lucky?".   r/ Mark

well I am sort of feeling lucky

no I can't return it now, I haven't received it because it's in transit. The seller has as good a seller rating on Fred Miranda as I do and I spoke to him on the phone for a while. I could be wrong but I got a sense that he's a stand up guy, and he unequivocally told me that he has not experienced problems, so I believe him. Time will tell whether I'm being naive.

He also has a M11M and because he only shoots b/w decided to get rid of the M11-P. I'm not selling my M10 any time soon, and I'll see what happens with the M11-P. If it starts crapping out immediately, then I'll ask him for a refund and see how that goes. Or I may send it to NJ for repairs. 

I can't get a handle on numbers, but from everything I've been reading, while the freezes have been abundant, I read only a handful of people who had corrupted files. I'm not clear whether the corruption extends to both SD card and internal, or if not, simply having redundant recording on both can mitigate corruption of image on one of them.

Well this train has already pulled out of the station so I'll just have to ride it to the next stop.

Edited July 8, 2024 by brickftl

[hdmesa]

6 hours ago, brickftl said:

well I am sort of feeling lucky

no I can't return it now, I haven't received it because it's in transit. The seller has as good a seller rating on Fred Miranda as I do and I spoke to him on the phone for a while. I could be wrong but I got a sense that he's a stand up guy, and he unequivocally told me that he has not experienced problems, so I believe him. Time will tell whether I'm being naive.

He also has a M11M and because he only shoots b/w decided to get rid of the M11-P. I'm not selling my M10 any time soon, and I'll see what happens with the M11-P. If it starts crapping out immediately, then I'll ask him for a refund and see how that goes. Or I may send it to NJ for repairs. 

I can't get a handle on numbers, but from everything I've been reading, while the freezes have been abundant, I read only a handful of people who had corrupted files. I'm not clear whether the corruption extends to both SD card and internal, or if not, simply having redundant recording on both can mitigate corruption of image on one of them.

Well this train has already pulled out of the station so I'll just have to ride it to the next stop.

Very few with 2.1.1 corrupted files — they could be associated with a shot that got interrupted by a freeze perhaps.

If you get freezes with the P you bought, remember that doesn’t mean the seller was not being honest. These freezes are more voodoo than science, and different menu settings and way of using the camera can change things. Also it sounds like they didn’t take very many photos with it. Sometimes freezes happen every 1,000 or more shots.

Edited July 8, 2024 by hdmesa

[J S H]

I've had the M11 since early 2023 and have never had a corrupt file. I shoot to internal memory and use the USB connection to transfer images and charge the camera. I do have an SD card installed, but only to be used if the internal memory fills, which has never happened. Generally mine has been trouble free, but I did have a few issues while using the electronic shutter after updating to 2.1.1. A full reset and rebuild of my profiles eliminated the problems and it has been perfect since that time. 

[brickftl]

I'm not concerned about freezes so long as I can turn the camera off, remove the battery, put it back in, power back up and all is okay.

But if files became corrupted, I'd be very unhappy. I'm going to follow the advice of using internal memory, and then a SanDisk SD UHS-II only as overflow in the unlikely event the internal memory fills up. I hope/pray that's sufficient to avoid corrupt files.

[lct]

11 minutes ago, brickftl said:

[...] if files became corrupted, I'd be very unhappy. I'm going to follow the advice of using internal memory, and then a SanDisk SD UHS-II only as overflow [...]

I'd go the IN=SD route if you fear corrupt files. Little chance that SSD + SD are both failing then. Just a guess as i never got corrupt files so far.

[bcaslis]

2 hours ago, brickftl said:

I'm not concerned about freezes so long as I can turn the camera off, remove the battery, put it back in, power back up and all is okay.

But if files became corrupted, I'd be very unhappy. I'm going to follow the advice of using internal memory, and then a SanDisk SD UHS-II only as overflow in the unlikely event the internal memory fills up. I hope/pray that's sufficient to avoid corrupt files.

I've only experienced corrupted files with firmware 2.0.2. Never had a corrupted file on earlier firmware and not had any on 2.1.1. I think that issue has been fixed. FYI, I have only used Delkin Black UHS-II cards on M11, M11 Monochrom, and M11-P (128GB & 256GB).

 

[goodbokeh]

On 7/8/2024 at 4:39 AM, brickftl said:

well I am sort of feeling lucky

no I can't return it now, I haven't received it because it's in transit. The seller has as good a seller rating on Fred Miranda as I do and I spoke to him on the phone for a while. I could be wrong but I got a sense that he's a stand up guy, and he unequivocally told me that he has not experienced problems, so I believe him. Time will tell whether I'm being naive.

He also has a M11M and because he only shoots b/w decided to get rid of the M11-P. I'm not selling my M10 any time soon, and I'll see what happens with the M11-P. If it starts crapping out immediately, then I'll ask him for a refund and see how that goes. Or I may send it to NJ for repairs. 

I can't get a handle on numbers, but from everything I've been reading, while the freezes have been abundant, I read only a handful of people who had corrupted files. I'm not clear whether the corruption extends to both SD card and internal, or if not, simply having redundant recording on both can mitigate corruption of image on one of them.

Well this train has already pulled out of the station so I'll just have to ride it to the next stop.

brickftl, I followed your post on Fred Miranda. I think you made a prudent decision buying from the seller there, he has a good reputation.

I took hdmesa's earlier advice (to me) and spoke to a Leica dealer I've dealt with about the M11-P. He said the M11 had a number of issues but so far with the M11-P they have not encountered many. Of all the M11-Ps they've sold so far only one major issue happened, which was the shutter wouldn't fire. Other issues like rangefinder alignment, memory card issues etc. have not happened yet. He thought overall the M11-P was a reliable camera. So I may be joining you in the silver M11-P club soon.

Enjoy, Doug

Edited July 9, 2024 by goodbokeh
Added info.

[brickftl]

2 hours ago, goodbokeh said:

brickftl, I followed your post on Fred Miranda. I think you made a prudent decision buying from the seller there, he has a good reputation.

I took hdmesa's earlier advice (to me) and spoke to a Leica dealer I've dealt with about the M11-P. He said the M11 had a number of issues but so far with the M11-P they have not encountered many. Of all the M11-Ps they've sold so far only one major issue happened, which was the shutter wouldn't fire. Other issues like rangefinder alignment, memory card issues etc. have not happened yet. He thought overall the M11-P was a reliable camera. So I may be joining you in the silver M11-P club soon.

Enjoy, Doug

thanks Doug!

[Malabito]

.

Edited July 10, 2024 by Malabito
Please erase comment. Thanks!

[colonel]

I am on the verge of buying a M11-P.

Freezes don't worry me if they are not hardware related and will be fixed in eventual firmware.

Corruption of photos is however a nono.

I prefer to use an SD card, and don't want to be confined to internal memory. 

It seems that the M11-P is more benign, perhaps because it is more recent and has the latest firmware updates.

reading the other thread on 2.2.1 issues and interesting ....

cheers

 

Edited July 10, 2024 by colonel

[brickftl]

I've read conflicting opinions whether copying images to SD instead of IN will lessen OR increase the possibility of freeze/corruption.

Similarly I've read conflicting opinions whether copying images to IN instead of SD will cause that problem.

The person from whom I bought my M11-P says that he writes all images to IN, and only puts a SD in when he wants to copy IN images to SD which can then be uploaded to laptop with a card reader.

Honestly I'm so confused about what to do . . .

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[elmars]

Do what you want to do. I do not believe that the freezes are dependent on these settings. I save IN = SD from the start and have no freezes.

[brickftl]

1 hour ago, elmars said:

Do what you want to do. I do not believe that the freezes are dependent on these settings. I save IN = SD from the start and have no freezes.

does IN = SD mean that you're simultaneously saving images to both?