Is The M10-D Peak Digital M?

[LeicaM60]

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For many, the move to M11 was just too much of a departure from the original M formula and with recent M11-D rumors, can we now conclude that the M10-D will be remembered as Peak Digital M?

Real M look and feel

Brass top cover and removable bottom plate

Black Chrome finish - that after over 50 years of use, seems to be discontinued for good? (other than in the M-A).

Peak M digital sensor with the “Leica look”, perfect resolution for an M and ideal high ISO performance.

Magical mechanical shutter sound and feel. 

Very practical fake advance lever.

No LCD screen to look dated in a few years.

Traditional M center weighted metering.

Traditional optical RF.

Did I forget anything?

Just The Perfect Digital M!

Here’s my 1 of 1 “Black Chrome Limited Edition Set”...

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[evikne]

I'm afraid it will be.

[patrickcolpron]

1 hour ago, LeicaM60 said:

Very practical fake advance lever.

They, Leica, call it an integrated thumb rest  

It is my favourite M10 variant by far, you correctly said it, it will not look dated in a few years, no LCD display back! 

As much as I prefer the rendering of the M10, M10-P and M10-D, my most used M10 remains the M10-R Black Paint, so I have to agree with...

1 hour ago, Al Brown said:

For me, the current peak digital M is the M10-R Black Paint. Brass, sass and badass.

... what he said, "Sass and Badass"  this said I can see myself parting with my BP M10-R, not so with my M10-D. 

Now, had Leica made the M10-D a Black Paint camera, I would have bought two and be done with new Leica Digital M 

Edited June 15, 2024 by patrickcolpron
Because, because (as my kids would say...) "parceque parceque"

[Anbaric]

1 hour ago, LeicaM60 said:

For many, the move to M11 was just too much of a departure from the original M formula and with recent M11-D rumors, can we now conclude that the M10-D will be remembered as Peak Digital M?

The answer is clear.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ULjAwiqufPE

[patrickcolpron]

52 minutes ago, Al Brown said:

Before parting I pinch myself every time when I realize my M10-R can be a black paint M10-D with a close approximation of the thumb thingy.
Even some Leica entities have shared the sentiment on their social media. Best of both worlds? Perhaps.

I will get my M10-D converted to a black paint M10-D and get it done by Shueido, along with my SRR. First I am in the works trying to find someone to switch some parts from my M10-R black paint over to my M10-D, the thumb wheel and the shutter speed dial, and also find a chrome hot shoe for it, plus see if I can get a polished shutter release well for it or get one done, this way it will end up looking like my BP analog MP ... that's the plan for my M10-D, fully realizing that Leica will not touch it for repairs once these modifications are done. 
 

 

[jdlaing]

5 hours ago, Al Brown said:

For me, the current peak digital M is the M10-R Black Paint. Brass, sass and badass.
But it is still true that tech wise the M11 is the best M digital body in the broader universe (and Beverly Hills). Some even freeze at no additional cost.

Sensors do not have Leica looks. The only Leica look any M BODY has is this one.

Sensors don’t have any look. They’re a mindless brick.

[crons]

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Peak M is the one I have. M10R Black Paint. Bought it brand new so it was mine from day 1. 

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[3D-Kraft.com]

I think, with the M11 Leica is currently in a dilemma. The capabilities of it's sensor even more show the limits of the rangefinder concept. To meet the needs of those who want to get more out of it, they would have to break with traditions and would have to include an EVF, video etc. But you can see already in the discussions about the bottom plate, what happens, when you break with traditions - even if they do not make sense anymore. The question of survival strategy will be whether breaking these traditions will win more new, younger customers than losing more tradition-conscious, usually older (and more affluent) customers. For the latter, propably the M10-D will be some kind of peak but Leica has to look forward.

For me, the M9 is still the peak of the M-system due to the simplicity and unique look you get out of it. This makes it easier for me to accept all the limitations and to even get some kind of fun out of it. When I need a  camera with less limits, I choose the Sony A1 or A7CR.

So in my opinion, Leica should try to find a better way, to catch up with capabilities of current technology and include an EVF and video into the M12 and AF in M13 (capable of handling manual lenses like the Techart Pro LM-EA9) but continue to maintain the beautiful, iconic, case design of the M-series. And the should include a mode that allows to create a look similar to Kodachrome film, like the M9 was capable of.

Edited June 15, 2024 by 3D-Kraft.com

[crons]

1 hour ago, 3D-Kraft.com said:

I think, with the M11 Leica is currently in a dilemma. The capabilities of it's sensor even more show the limits of the rangefinder concept. To meet the needs of those who want to get more out of it, they would have to break with traditions and would have to include an EVF, video etc. But you can see already in the discussions about the bottom plate, what happens, when you break with traditions - even if they do not make sense anymore. The question of survival strategy will be whether breaking these traditions will win more new, younger customers than losing more tradition-conscious, usually older (and more affluent) customers. For the latter, propably the M10-D will be some kind of peak but Leica has to look forward.

For me, the M9 is still the peak of the M-system due to the simplicity and unique look you get out of it. This makes it easier for me to accept all the limitations and to even get some kind of fun out of it. When I need a  camera with less limits, I choose the Sony A1 or A7CR.

So in my opinion, Leica should try to find a better way, to catch up with capabilities of current technology and include an EVF and video into the M12 and AF in M13 (capable of handling manual lenses like the Techart Pro LM-EA9) but continue to maintain the beautiful, iconic, case design of the M-series. And the should include a mode that allows to create a look similar to Kodachrome film, like the M9 was capable of.

The M11 does indeed and I'm afraid it marks the beginning of the end for the Leica M rangefinder. The only hope is they keep perfecting and updating the Leica M film cameras. Maybe in the future when the Leica M10R's and older break, the only choice for us will be to go to film to get the rangefinder experience. 

We are just heading towards the Leica M digital only having the outside looks of a rangefinder but behave no different than any other EVF mirrorless camera. I wouldn't put it past the Leica M to eventually have Autofucus too. 

Edited June 15, 2024 by crons

[evikne]

I agree that Leica has a dilemma with the digital M's because with the M11 they have now painted themselves into a corner. I think the only way to avoid losing a lot of customers is to split the series in two: One looks further ahead, while the other takes a step back. For the latter, this means an M10-D with a slightly improved sensor and software. Forget EVF, IBIS and all that stuff. And no screen. Just 24 million of the best pixels available (a reliable CCD sensor if possible would make people ecstatic!).

[costa43]

30 minutes ago, evikne said:

I agree that Leica has a dilemma with the digital M's because with the M11 they have now painted themselves into a corner. I think the only way to avoid losing a lot of customers is to split the series in two: One looks further ahead, while the other takes a step back. For the latter, this means an M10-D with a slightly improved sensor and software. Forget EVF, IBIS and all that stuff. And no screen. Just 24 million of the best pixels available (a reliable CCD sensor if possible would make people ecstatic!).

I think I would do cartwheels in my front room if they released this 😂

[darylgo]

5 hours ago, jdlaing said:

Sensors don’t have any look. They’re a mindless brick.

My best sensor continues to be less important than the quality of light amongst other factors.  

[jdlaing]

12 hours ago, Al Brown said:

for $100 I can show you the difference between CMOS and CCD.

No you can’t. You can show me the difference in the image engine. 

[3D-Kraft.com]

Set them both to ISO 2500 and you easily see the difference...
Regarding different looks, see: http://www.reddotforum.com/content/2015/02/the-great-debate-ccd-vs-cmos-part-1/ (+ part 2 and part 3).

[crons]

Leica will never go back to a ccd sensor. The downsides outweigh the benefits.  Also since they've now entered the Sony Spec Race those sensors can't support the amount of megapixels. Leica M is heading to 100 megapixels I'm sure.

[LeicaM60]

On 6/15/2024 at 12:49 AM, Al Brown said:

Before parting I pinch myself every time when I realize my M10-R can be a black paint M10-D with a close approximation of the thumb thingy.
Even some Leica entities have shared the sentiment on their social media. Best of both worlds? Perhaps.

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Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

Nice try but not even close to the real thing… seriously, don’t really understand the appeal of the high-gloss black paint that easily gets scratched and wears so quickly… Very much prefer the matte black chrome finish.

[jensthoes]

Am 15.6.2024 um 07:46 schrieb LeicaM60:

the M10-D will be remembered as Peak Digital M

...from my point of view. it is the only digital alternative to my beloved M3.

Best,

Jens

[patrickcolpron]

1 hour ago, LeicaM60 said:

Nice try but not even close to the real thing… seriously, don’t really understand the appeal of the high-gloss black paint that easily gets scratched and wears so quickly… Very much prefer the matte black chrome finish.

My Leica M10-D is my favourite M10, yet I much prefer using the M10R black paint because it looks great and the little brassing it is tarting to have looks good to me, a well used Leica black paint always looked great to me. 

Personally, I prefer Leica's black paint over the black chrome finish. I just wish it wasn't so glossy, piano black as I heard someone call it. 

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[Smudgerer]

2 hours ago, patrickcolpron said:

My Leica M10-D is my favourite M10, yet I much prefer using the M10R black paint because it looks great and the little brassing it is tarting to have looks good to me, a well used Leica black paint always looked great to me. 

Personally, I prefer Leica's black paint over the black chrome finish. I just wish it wasn't so glossy, piano black as I heard someone call it. 

I do agree with you Patrick, and others who have said that the M10-D is their favourite Digital M so far...........I sold mine a few weeks ago, sadly it was a somewhat "troubled child" with +four returns to Wetzlar to try to correct electronic troubles, ( three main boards replaced in total ), and despite it being my go-to M for everyday use I had to sell it on, trading it into a Leica Store when once again it started playing up, ( incomplete digits in the VF ). I didn't want to sell it on the open market, that given it's history wouldn't have been a good thing to do even though it would have reaped me more €€€€'s.

Now despite owning, ( in conjunction with Wetzlar where it's been languishing for 5 months ), a M10-R my M10-P has taken over the "favourite M" spot now, and once again proving to me that 24mps are really all that one needs 85% of the time............And thus I do wish that Leica would consider another 24mp M with an updated and improved 24mp sensor, like Panasonic and Sony offer I think, but Leica is on another mp track it seems which is causing I believe all kinds of stresses, a pity.

[RexGig0]

I think of the M10-R, especially the Black Paint M10-R, and the M10 Monochrom as being “peak” digital M, but have not yet convinced myself to buy either of them. (Both of these were introduced after my personal financial/budgetary “peak,” which was in 2018/2019, and, I tend to prioritize lenses, rather than the pursuit of camera bodies.)

The LCD-less digital camera does have some personal appeal, but, I like the idea of acquiring the M-D Type 262 more than the M10-D. This may be due to there having been an M-D Type 262 at the nearest Leica dealer, tempting me, for a period of time, even though I had an M10. Another factor could be that the Leica app, in my iPhones and iPads, has been very annoyingly temperamental, acting to discourage the idea of acquiring a camera that depends upon that app. 

 

 

Edited June 19, 2024 by RexGig0