Good old lens, new M11

[Jiminy]

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Looking at the vintage f/4 135mm Tele-Elmarit for my M11.  Will it work?  What about focus and viewfinder framing?

Edited June 15, 2024 by Jiminy

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[Knorp]

Why a 'vintage f/4 135mm' lens ?

[jaapv]

Why shouldn’t it work?  The only caveat is that in the film days tolerances were wider so it may be that the focusing has to be adjusted. Any competent technician can do that. The lens may need a CLA anyway. It is a very good lens BTW. 

[davysn]

135mm f/4 Tele-elmar is my favorite lens and highly recommanded.

[lct]

You mean Tele-Elmar (11851) i guess. My v1 copy from 1971 works perfectly with the M11. Just a snap @ f/5.6 here.

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[Jiminy]

Thanks Ict, yes that’s the one. Glad to hear it works well for you. Does that include the viewfinder framing lines?

[Jiminy]

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Just discovered the lens is in the manual setup list on my M11. Should have done that earlier.  Feeling better about buying it now. Thanks to all. 

[nodrog]

I've been out today with the Tele-Elmarit attached to a Nikon Z6. Works like a charm, though the 'leatherette' covering has become brittle and is flaking off. Here's a shot taken with my M10R-BP last year. Superb contrast and sharpness. 

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[lct]

45 minutes ago, Jiminy said:

Thanks Ict, yes that’s the one. Glad to hear it works well for you. Does that include the viewfinder framing lines?

Yes but i use more often the Visoflex 2 with the M11.

[lct]

To avoid misunderstandings, Tele-Elmarit is a 90/2.8 lens (11800) and Tele-Elmar is a 135/4 lens in two versions (11851, 11861). BTW no Tele-Elmar lens has leatherette AFAIK, contrary to the earlier Elmar 135/4 (11850). JFI.

[Jiminy]

Update to the original post:  Encouraged by the positive comments on the performance of this very old lens with a very new camera, I took the plunge and today received my "new" 53 year old F/4 tele-elmar 135.  It is physically without signs of wear externally, amazing for its age.  Unfortunately, the B&H used equipment department obviously didn't give it a proper check before turning it around.  The mechanical sliding mechanism in the rear of the lens which communicates focus change to the camera was stuck in place, which meant no movement of the viewfinder images when the focus ring was turned.  With gentle coaxing and a tiny drop of oil, I soon had the mechanism working again after all those years.  Next came the challenge of learning to focus.  My first efforts made me think the lens was seriously out of calibration, but with a bit practice I have learned this is not the case.  As others have pointed out, you really have to have it dialed in carefully, especially at/near infinity.  So far, my best results have been achieved using the rear screen focus function; not ideal for action shooting.  Bottom line, using this lens to its best advantage is going to take some practice.

[Gregm61]

ANY 135mm lens, even the newest 135mm f3.4 APO Telyt-M, is a challenging lens to use with the rangefinder, even if the camera’s rangefinder and lens are both in the best/most optimal of calibration, and requires practice to get the best possible results.

[LocalHero1953]

If you are otherwise happy with the lens, I suggest you send it off for servicing. The stuck focus is probably due to old grease, which is now still there, moved around a bit by your oil. It would be better to have both oil and old grease removed and replaced by new lubricant designed for the job.

As for framing, no Leica M gives a WYSIWYG view in the optical viewfinder, and framing at 135 is likely to be approximate (which is nothing to do with the age of the lens). Don't expect too much, allow a bit of leeway around the edges and learn by experience what you can get away with. Remember you can compare the framing in the OVF with the (WYSIWYG) framing on the rear LCD or in the add-on EVF.

And don't confuse the lens's ability to bring up the correct 135mm framing lines, which is a mechanical link arising from the shape of the lens mount, with the inclusion of the lens in the firmware list of lenses: selecting the correct lens only makes the correct optical adjustments to the image and writes the lens name to image metadata. Selecting the correct lens makes no difference to the OVF framelines. 

Edit. This was one of the first lenses I had when I bought my first Leica, a M3 in 1981. At the time I had a Pentax MX with a 135mm, so went for the equivalent Leica. Eventually I found using a 135mm on a M to be an unsatisfying experience, not because of framing difficulties, but it was just too small a view in the OVF. I decided that Ms with longer lenses were not for me, and evolved to a M2 with 35, 50 and 90 lenses.

Edited June 20, 2024 by LocalHero1953

[spydrxx]

Although the 135s are a challenge with rangefinder bodies, especially as we age and our eyes aren't quite as acute as they once may have been, they aren't really that hard to use. I offer an old example (from 1969), I had just received my 135/4 to use on my M4  2 weeks before this shot of the rescue team and the Apollo 11 capsule.

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[PCPix]

20 hours ago, spydrxx said:

the rescue team and the Apollo 11 capsule.

How come you got all the fun assignments?! How wonderful to have been there. Ektachrome or Kodachrome?

[spydrxx]

2 hours ago, PCPix said:

How come you got all the fun assignments?! How wonderful to have been there. Ektachrome or Kodachrome?

Kodachrome

[spydrxx]

8 hours ago, PCPix said:

How come you got all the fun assignments?

Quick comment on "fun assignments". I was scheduled to fly out from San Diego for a day or two to shoot the event. The admiral overseeing it though thought it would be more cost effective and instructive for me to spend a few weeks training with the ship's crew, the rescue group, the technicians, and the press photographers, and assist in watch standing in one division where I had a ton of experience and clearances. The sleeping quarters were not air conditioned, as I was used to on more modern vessels and I had to sign a  government waiver in the event the astronauts brought back microbes not indigenous to earth, that I might be quarantined at sea the rest of my life. I also had to write a chapter for using certain new equipment in future capsule recoveries for a project management manual. Not a "fun" assignment, but well worth the time and effort for the shots and memories I got including those of the astronauts and President Nixon.