Putting this here as general M11 question/issue regarding shutter button action

[Derbyshire Man]

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Just supplemented my M11-P with a brand new M11M (I know!). The shutter release needed to be pressed so hard to fire I thought at first the shutter was actually inoperable. Needs about 2-3x more pressure than on the M11-P. It had loosened up with usage to 1.3x the pressure but then when I returned to it an hour later had re-stiffened up. 

On discussion with retailer - customer care tech said 'freshly greased should loosen up with time'.

Anyone else experienced a similar shutter button issue? I'm a bit worried about keeping it in case of issues down the line.

QA = shitshow, anyone pressing the shutter at the factory would realise it wasn't right!

Any thoughts or comments?

Edited April 30, 2024 by Derbyshire Man

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[Anbaric]

Sounds dubious. Is this one of the well-known dealers? Do they have another M11M in stock? You could get a second opinion at one of Leica's own shops, or perhaps at another third party dealer if you ask nicely.

Edited April 30, 2024 by Anbaric

[Derbyshire Man]

Big main dealer, based in UK. Camera shipped direct from Germany.

 

[lct]

1 hour ago, Derbyshire Man said:

On discussion with retailer - customer care tech said 'freshly greased should loosen up with time'

Heard this so many times about stiff focus rings that i don't believe a word in that. I would return the faulty body.

[Kwesi]

Just return it for a new one

[Derbyshire Man]

Yep, been out and put 100 shots on the body. Shutter button doesn't fire after passing the soft stop (like it does on the M11-P) you need to press harder to get the shutter to fire and really bottom it out. This is achievable with the mechanical shutter but when using the electronic, all too often I thought I'd taken a picture and actually hadn't.

Back it goes!

 

[gotium]

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6 hours ago, Derbyshire Man said:

'freshly greased should loosen up with time'.

 

Sounds like BS to me. 

[Derbyshire Man]

6 minutes ago, gotium said:

Sounds like BS to me. 

And me, total but I'm far too lovely to say.

[Strmbrg]

Cameras for over 10.000 behaves like Soviet junk...
😵
Everything seems to get more and more complex (because it can be done...) and at the same time more and more sloppily done.
I'm not at all referring particularly to this camera brand - or cameras. I think it's that we humans in general that tend to care less and just "float around".
The damned mobile may be put away in the Leica assembly workshop, but the damned mobile may have some kind of long time effect on mind-distraction that results in some kind of permanent disability to focus and get things done correctly - one thing at a time.

In this era everything is focused on the superficial and easy recognition on brands (i.e surface) and nothing is really focused on real, engaged nerdy labor or the inner details of execution.
"Why care? What's in it for me? I'm in a (mental) hurry (don't really know why but...). Wonder how many likes I have received on my phone since last coffee-break."

Excuse me for this long and stretched exposition, but from my point of view it is relevant. Think of it. 🙂

[lct]

19 hours ago, Strmbrg said:

[...] Excuse me for this long and stretched exposition, but from my point of view it is relevant. Think of it. 🙂

"Soviet junk " ..."sloppily done"...  I know it's becoming popular to bash the M11 on this forum but the relevancy of such imputs escapes me somewhat i must say.

[Strmbrg]

Well, it doesn't really matter if a camera for 1.000 behaves like what is described above it is basic not to accept it regardless.
Of course it is a personal part involved in valuating things, but I would say that it is shameless to not make things well enough to avoid matters like this.
I'm not at all personally dependant to any brand or any gear or so. That maybe makes it a little easier for me to express myself the way i did.

Cloud things with more and more functions and features all the time (because it is possible - and hopefully selling - rather than because it is really necessary). And at the same time live at the mental surface without enough engagement in the thinking and execution.

For the clarification and moderation: "Soviet junk " ..."sloppily done". The shutter-behaviour in this case is quite easy to blame as just that. The camera as a whole is of course not at all "Soviet junk " ..."sloppily done". 
But besides that - why is it a tendency towards more and more faults like this example? The camera freezes and such. 10.000, 1.000 or 5.000... it doesn't matter at all. Try and test products in a real life-way for some months or so,  before launching them would hopefully avoid it.
 

Edited May 2, 2024 by Strmbrg

[Derbyshire Man]

I'm usually happy to cut some slack as electronics go wrong, particularly in the first few hours. However this was a clear mechanical problem in the primary place where the user interacts with the camera. Harder to imagine a more important thing to check than the shutter actuation as part of any kind of scanty QC. To find that one has to press so hard that one's finger goes white to take a shot is not exactly subtle. It did after some very firm pressing and working out get better but it still wasn't like the operation of the shutter on the other bodies where the shutter fires as soon as one gets past the shutter button detent. It needed to past the detent and have a solid further press. From a photography point of view a shutter having a delicate operation is an essential part of keeping camera shake to a minimum. A working shutter = Das Wasentliche.

The body also ate batteries at 4x the rate of the M11-P and front focused by about 1m across a 5m room.

What was somewhat annoying was that the vendor wanted to send it off for assessment before replacement even though issues reported on first day. Cheekiness like that and the lack of a goodwill offer like 'I'm really sorry you experienced this allow us to send you a battery as a complementary item' just rubs salt into the wound. I still think they are great cameras though!

Edited May 2, 2024 by Derbyshire Man

[LeicaR10]

Derbyshire Man,   I feel your angst.  I had the same issue with my M11-M.  I returned the camera to the Leica dealer and received my requested refund.  There is another photographer with this same problem on another thread with the M11.  I would look around for it in the M11 thread.  It was fairly recent too.  The shutter release is NOT going to loosen up in time as told to me by my Leica dealer.  The camera would need to go back for service had I wanted to keep that body.  I declined as mentioned and took the refund.  I most highly recommend you return the camera to the dealer and either request a new replacement or refund.  I would copy the defective camera serial number down just in case it makes a round trip back to you.  (It happens)  I suggest you don't waste your time with getting it fixed, the wait is too long at present.  Total replacement or refund.  r/ Mark

PS:  I found the M11 thread try:  

 

Edited May 2, 2024 by LeicaR10

[Derbyshire Man]

Just received the replacement camera 24 hours ago. New shutter just like the one on my M11-P, a thing of joy! The M11M is great, my only minor compliant is I prefer the leatherette on the M11-P, the low texture stuff on the M11M is not as nice looking nor grippy. I understand why the do it however.

The level of detail in the files is amazing and the benefits from modern 50mm summilux to 35mm pre-aspheric. The CV ultron 28mm looks stellar. The camera is in my opinion superb.

The only odd thing is that it's the 3rd (of three!) M camera I've had over the last couple of months that significantly front focussed. I've just been to a spot where I tune my cameras and re-adjusted the mechanism and it's now spot on but overall very odd!

 

[DadDadDaddyo]

Hooray! Sounds as if it worked out as it should!

I came late to the thread, but for certain, Derbyshire Man, that shutter release you first described sounded to me, to use a technical term, to be totally hosed!

Glad to hear the resolution...