M3 and a m4-2 for 50mm F1.4 2nd gen. Will compare the focus accuracy

[Radost]

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Just Got an M3 and a M4-2 for 50mm F1.4 2nd gen. Will compare the focus accuracy wide open and the viewfinder brightenss quality.

I know the M3 gives me better viewfinder 0.91 magnification and accuracy but apart from painting it black I dont want to be a shiny chrome thief target.

Anybody else own both those cameras and shoot with 50 sumilux? 

I will also shoot 90mm F2.8.

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[TomB_tx]

I have a couple M3s and M2,4,5.6 etc. and use all with 50 (and others). I prefer the .72 finder for all lenses. Don't really care for the M3 finder.

[Radost]

4 hours ago, TomB_tx said:

I have a couple M3s and M2,4,5.6 etc. and use all with 50 (and others). I prefer the .72 finder for all lenses. Don't really care for the M3 finder.

Thank you

What dont you like? Brightness? Magnification? rounded frame lines?

 

[TomB_tx]

1 hour ago, Radost said:

What don't you like? Brightness? Magnification? rounded frame lines?

I guess mainly I like the wider FOV around the frame lines for judging framing for action and composition, plus the fact that with the M3 the thick 50 framelines are always visible even with 90 or 135 lenses. In 1968 I could have bought a brand new M3, M2 or M4 as my first M (M3 & M4 same price then) and even though I was buying a 90 TE at the same time, I liked the M4 finder better. It just seemed "crisper" - and as the M3 was still new it wasn't due to the now common M3 finder aging. It was many years later when I added an M3 to my cameras, and I immediately confirmed I had made the right choice getting an M4 instead.

I wore glasses for 62 years which may have influenced my original choice, but no longer need them, and still like the .72 finders better.

[Radost]

10 minutes ago, TomB_tx said:

I guess mainly I like the wider FOV around the frame lines for judging framing for action and composition, plus the fact that with the M3 the thick 50 framelines are always visible even with 90 or 135 lenses. In 1968 I could have bought a brand new M3, M2 or M4 as my first M (M3 & M4 same price then) and even though I was buying a 90 TE at the same time, I liked the M4 finder better. It just seemed "crisper" - and as the M3 was still new it wasn't due to the now common M3 finder aging. It was many years later when I added an M3 to my cameras, and I immediately confirmed I had made the right choice getting an M4 instead.

I wore glasses for 62 years which may have influenced my original choice, but no longer need them, and still like the .72 finders better.

Do you think focus is just as accurate with wide open 50 sumilux? The reason I am buying those leicas is with my Leica CL and the dim and short rangefinder i miss focus wide open often.

[TomB_tx]

I also have a CL, but have only used it with its 40 f2. and 90 F4. Its RF is really intended for close range snapshots, and it uses a different cam mechanism, so don't judge the .72 vs .91 finders on that basis. I haven't used the Summilux with the M3, but have never had issues focusing a 50 at f1.4 with an M4 or M6.

[Radost]

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Thank You. 

I have 28mm Elmerit and 40 sumicron but those stay permentantly on my CLE.

The M3 is only for the 50mm sumilux. The m4-2 is for the black chrome. I want to experiment with stripping chrome cameras and making them black chrome.

[dpitt]

On 2/13/2024 at 2:39 AM, Radost said:

Just Got an M3 and a M4-2 for 50mm F1.4 2nd gen. Will compare the focus accuracy wide open and the viewfinder brightenss quality.

I know the M3 gives me better viewfinder 0.91 magnification and accuracy but apart from painting it black I dont want to be a shiny chrome thief target.

Anybody else own both those cameras and shoot with 50 sumilux? 

I will also shoot 90mm F2.8.

'thief target'... Long time ago yes. Now it is the black ones they are after. Even my M9 digital grey looks too old fashioned for most thieves. They either know what they are dealing with and then black tape over logo and color will not help much IMO, or they do not know the first thing about it and it might just as well have been a Nikon or Canon RF.

Not sure what you want to find with the RF comparison. Accuracy at 50mm is never an issue for me, even at F1.4. And if it is, the focus shift of the lens is the main issue.

With 90mm and 135mm, I can imagine some differences.

I like the M3 because it is very easy to use with both eyes open. And the 50mm frames are nice and large. I dislike that the 50mm lines are thick,rounded and permanent... My favorite is the M2 with its uncluttered single frames for 35/50/90. Maybe because that was my first RF ever, just before my M8. In fact the M2 experience was the reason that I risked spending a lot of money on the M8.

Edited February 14, 2024 by dpitt

[dpitt]

11 hours ago, Radost said:

Do you think focus is just as accurate with wide open 50 sumilux? The reason I am buying those leicas is with my Leica CL and the dim and short rangefinder i miss focus wide open often.

Everything about the RF in the CL is inferior to the M RF experience. The CL is just a box, to put an M lens on. And if focus is right you can not see a the difference with a shot taken with the Ms, but using it is a completely different experience.

[Helge]

Am 13.2.2024 um 02:39 schrieb Radost:

…

I know the M3 gives me better viewfinder 0.91 magnification and accuracy but apart from painting it black I dont want to be a shiny chrome thief target.

…

Today the opposite is true, no thief will target a chrome camera, it is considered old.

[Radost]

had a CLE on my neck for many years. I wear black shirts. It blends nice. All my chrome cameras catch eye…

[250swb]

12 hours ago, Helge said:

Today the opposite is true, no thief will target a chrome camera, it is considered old.

Unless photographers spend too much time imagining people are looking at their old retro camera and thinking it, and therefore they, look super cool 😁 Perhaps thieves only see a sad old git who can't afford a proper camera? If a thief can either see or identify a film camera on a twenty five year photographer the thief may assume it's cool, even a Lomo camera, but on anybody older they think you are a sad case and still shooting your Dad's stockpile of Kodachrome and are almost ready to have 100 rolls processed....

[Radost]

10 minutes ago, 250swb said:

Unless photographers spend too much time imagining people are looking at their old retro camera and thinking it, and therefore they, look super cool 😁 Perhaps thieves only see a sad old git who can't afford a proper camera? If a thief can either see or identify a film camera on a twenty five year photographer the thief may assume it's cool, even a Lomo camera, but on anybody older they think you are a sad case and still shooting your Dad's stockpile of Kodachrome and are almost ready to have 100 rolls processed....

Another thing I will never own is a Red dot. THiefs look for the red dots.

[Radost]

The m3 viewfinder is so much better than M4. Not even close brighter and clearer

 

[Radost]

The m3 viewfinder is so much better than M4. Not even close. Brighter and clearer. Magnification really helps and compliments the long throw of sumilux 50 Gen2

 

 

Edited February 15, 2024 by Radost

[hansvons]

On 2/13/2024 at 9:11 PM, Radost said:

On 2/13/2024 at 8:56 PM, TomB_tx said:

Do you think focus is just as accurate with wide open 50 sumilux?

Leica M range finder mechanism are the most accurate money can buy. But f1.4 on a portrait will always be a hit and miss with RFs, especially for longer lenses. And 50mm can already be considered long on a range finder. If sharp eyes are the goal at f1.4 and 50mm, I’d prefer an SLR any day; the only reason why I kept the R6.

[Radost]

16 hours ago, hansvons said:

Leica M range finder mechanism are the most accurate money can buy. But f1.4 on a portrait will always be a hit and miss with RFs, especially for longer lenses. And 50mm can already be considered long on a range finder. If sharp eyes are the goal at f1.4 and 50mm, I’d prefer an SLR any day; the only reason why I kept the R6.

The main reason I shoot with Range finders is manual SLRs are hard to focus for me. 

I get good hot rate with minolta 50MM f1.4 with autofocus.