Q3 viewfinder blackout is a pain

[Daniel C.1975]

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vor 9 Stunden schrieb SrMi:

Probably because they, like me, do not mind the slightly longer blackout.

Possible. I can also live with it. But as a product tester there’s a difference between not minding and not noticing / mentioning  

Jono, for example, mentioned it, as far as I remember  

 

Still, compared to the Q2, the user experience with the Q3 is less fluent. But I am also confident that it will be fixed. 

[SrMi]

18 minutes ago, Daniel C.1975 said:

Possible. I can also live with it. But as a product tester there’s a difference between not minding and not noticing / mentioning  

Jono, for example, mentioned it, as far as I remember  

 

Still, compared to the Q2, the user experience with the Q3 is less fluent. But I am also confident that it will be fixed. 

Sean Reid, the other relevant Leica reviewer, also wrote about it and estimates Q3’s blackout to be .5 sec, while Q2’s is .25 sec. He also does not consider it to be painful.

I am mostly bothered by slow startups, not by EVF blackouts.

[Daniel C.1975]

I agree that it is not painful, I can live fine with it. But I also think it’s improveable. 
 

Start up time is not always slow, which is also a bit funny. Today’s my father’s 80th birthday and I am looking forward to use the Q3 and keep some nice memories  

[geesbert]

I know it’s a first world problem, but I am just back from a week‘s trip where I exclusively used the Q3. Of course it is a super capable camera and I kind of get used to its sluggish shooting experience, but when I took out my Q2m last night I was shocked what a speed freak it is in comparison to the Q3

[nicci78]

1 hour ago, SrMi said:

Sean Reid, the other relevant Leica reviewer, also wrote about it and estimates Q3’s blackout to be .5 sec, while Q2’s is .25 sec. He also does not consider it to be painful.

A quarter a second is not ideal but manageable. 

Half a second is double the time and quite long ! 

Just remember that there is no blackout nor lag at all with M cameras, obviously. 

 

[nicci78]

Just to sum up drawbacks from Q3 60MP counts :

- 16,000th sec max electronic shutter instead of 40,000th.
- very noticeable rolling shutter in electronic shutter mode and in videos. 
- slower start-up times. 
- longer viewfinder blackout. 
- bigger files. 
- possibly more motion blur, dependant of operator steadiness. 

Am I missing something else ? 

I really hope that Leica chose to launch one day a Q3-S 33MP that will resolve all those issues and being cheaper. 
I can only dream 😴 they won’t  obviously  

 

[Guest]

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3 hours ago, nicci78 said:

Just to sum up drawbacks from Q3 60MP counts :

- 16,000th sec max electronic shutter instead of 40,000th.
- very noticeable rolling shutter in electronic shutter mode and in videos. 
- slower start-up times. 
- longer viewfinder blackout. 
- bigger files. 
- possibly more motion blur, dependant of operator steadiness. 

Am I missing something else ? 

I really hope that Leica chose to launch one day a Q3-S 33MP that will resolve all those issues and being cheaper. 
I can only dream 😴 they won’t  obviously  

 

Thanks for letting me know about all the issues. I've just been taking some lovely photos at the beach with my Q3 for the first time but at least, when I go out for a leisurely family lunch in 30 minutes, I'll now understand what bad photos I'm taking!

[clasami]

vor 3 Stunden schrieb nicci78:

Just to sum up drawbacks from Q3 60MP counts :

- 16,000th sec max electronic shutter instead of 40,000th.
- very noticeable rolling shutter in electronic shutter mode and in videos. 
- slower start-up times. 
- longer viewfinder blackout. 
- bigger files. 
- possibly more motion blur, dependant of operator steadiness. 

Am I missing something else ? 

I really hope that Leica chose to launch one day a Q3-S 33MP that will resolve all those issues and being cheaper. 
I can only dream 😴 they won’t  obviously  

 

Set to 2FPS to reduce blackout time. Use M-RAW or S-RAW for smaller files. Motion blur will be less of an issue if you scale down your image and don't look at it at 100% from up close.

[SrMi]

4 hours ago, nicci78 said:

A quarter a second is not ideal but manageable. 

Half a second is double the time and quite long ! 

Just remember that there is no blackout nor lag at all with M cameras, obviously. 

 

It is still faster then time to wind the film on film Ms. 

[SrMi]

4 hours ago, nicci78 said:

Just to sum up drawbacks from Q3 60MP counts :

- 16,000th sec max electronic shutter instead of 40,000th.
- very noticeable rolling shutter in electronic shutter mode and in videos. 
- slower start-up times. 
- longer viewfinder blackout. 
- bigger files. 
- possibly more motion blur, dependant of operator steadiness. 

Am I missing something else ? 

I really hope that Leica chose to launch one day a Q3-S 33MP that will resolve all those issues and being cheaper. 
I can only dream 😴 they won’t  obviously  

 

Bigger files can be seen as an advantage (more resolution, more cropping possibilities).

To decide whether the current Q3 fits one’s need one should list also the advantages and then decide which of advantages and disadvantages matter.

Q2 is still a great camera. 

[bobtodrick]

To me this is a huge issue that hopefully can be fixed with a firmware update

I, like many entered the world of Q because it was a great street camera…and I think that has been one of its core niches (I sell them and the feedback from most of my customers is this is what they bought the Q/Q2 for).

1/2 second blackouts are unacceptable in these shooting scenarios.

I fear that Leica is trying to make the Q3 a ‘do everything’ camera to appeal to more people…at the expense of those who made up the bulk of its sales.

Those various firmware updates can’t happen fast enough.

Edited September 9, 2023 by bobtodrick

[geesbert]

I think in the meantime I keep the camera on 2 pictures per second when I am working on a faste pace. This is slow enough to shot single exposures in 90% of the time and in those rare situations where I wasn't quick enough to lift my finger I don't mind. It adds a bit of camera wiggle though and you loose the ability to use the review function while keeping the shutter pressed.

Somehow I am confident Leica will address this.

[thighslapper]

9 hours ago, geesbert said:

I know it’s a first world problem, but I am just back from a week‘s trip where I exclusively used the Q3. Of course it is a super capable camera and I kind of get used to its sluggish shooting experience, but when I took out my Q2m last night I was shocked what a speed freak it is in comparison to the Q3

The increase in mpx is not that great and the camera allegedly has a faster processor so this has to be a firmware glitch.

Of course they could be using knock off cheap semiconductors due to the chip shortages ...... 

[SrMi]

FWIW, my measurements show a 200ms blackout for Q2 and a 400ms blackout for Q3.

I wonder if there are any settings that increases or decreases the blackout time.

[SrMi]

2 hours ago, bobtodrick said:

1/2 second blackouts are unacceptable in these shooting scenarios.

Why? Film cameras had a bigger delay between shots and were and are still considered great street cameras.

[bobtodrick]

14 minutes ago, SrMi said:

Why? Film cameras had a bigger delay between shots and were and are still considered great street cameras.

So if it was good enough in the old days that’s it’s good enough today?

Then why is everybody so hyped over the Q3???

We did fine with the 24MP  of the original Q.

The point is the blackout on the Q3 is much worse than it’s predecessors or current competitors.

Ya know…you can be a Leica fan yet still recognize a shortcoming,

[clasami]

vor 24 Minuten schrieb SrMi:

FWIW, my measurements show a 200ms blackout for Q2 and a 400ms blackout for Q3.

I wonder if there are any settings that increases or decreases the blackout time.

Yes: Set camera to continuous shooting , 2 FPS.

[Stuart Richardson]

38 minutes ago, SrMi said:

Why? Film cameras had a bigger delay between shots and were and are still considered great street cameras.

That is because the film M's had nearly no shutter delay at all, and zero blackout. So while they could not crank out many frames at a time, they could catch the frames they were meant to...and you could continue to track the subject the whole time.

I do not have the Q3, only the Q2. Blackout/delay was not really a problem for me, but I am not an action photographer. I do, however, remember trying the Hasselblad X1D right after it came out and it was so bad that I could not envision using the camera. I know they improved it in firmware and more or less fixed it in the X1DII, but it did go to show how frustrating it can be for a user, even if action is not their forte. For some reason it never bothers me with view cameras, haha.

Edited September 9, 2023 by Stuart Richardson

[adrianh]

13 hours ago, CalStanford said:

And yet they put a 2000s era 2.36 million dot (not pixels) EVF into their new A7CR. So there's that.

And on top of that a pretty cheap back LCD that they can't excuse with small size constraints... 

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica Q

[Voxen]

Why is there a blackout delay anyway? If one shoot at 1/1000 I don’t get why the viewfinder would get black half a sec. If someone can explain this to me I’ll go to sleep smarter 🙂