m11 camera shake VS m10-r

[ryanlowry]

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Hello forum!

I have been shooting the M11 for about 4 months now and have been driven crazy by the amount of camera shake that is legible on the M-DNG and L-DNG files above 1/180th with my 35mm Summicron ASPH.

I am considering selling the camera and making a backwards move to a M10-R or even an M10-P.

I know for a fact the m10-p or m10 will do exactly what I need it to do as I owned the m10 for 5 years, and was quite happy with the camera. My reasons for upgrading to M11 were only based on the extended dynamic range and colors of the M11 - the added resolution was a perk, and I figured the ability to change the resolution would help with the camera shake but it doesn't seem to make a substantial enough difference compared to M10.

Has anyone extensively used m10, m10-r, and m11 that could speak to this for me? I am shooting a lot of flash outside which is where I see a lot of motion blur especially. 

[hmzimelka]

I have an issue too with the M11 and its rather harsh shutter. I can easily hand hold my M11 with Summicron 50mm at 1/125 or 1/100 or even 1/60 at times with electronic shutter. But with mechanical shutter I can see motion blur at 1/125 up to around 1/180sec. 

It annoys me immensely, and I don't recall having nearly as much shutter shock with the M10M.

[ryanlowry]

Ya its really driving me nuts... it seems like I can even see it in the smaller DNG's as well...

[SrMi]

Hmmm.

I do not see any shutter shock effect unless I use a lens longer than 180mm, and it is the same amount as with M10-P.

I am shooting with 1/2f and have no issues with camera motion blur.

I speculate that there is something suboptimal with OP's shooting technique when using M11.

@ryanlowry, could you share an example?

 

Edited April 2, 2023 by SrMi

[hmzimelka]

I would guess it'd be shooting technique if electronic shutter images came out similarly as the mechanical shutter, but it's definitely not in my case and I doubt it's different for ryanlowry.

With my M10M 2F shutter speeds was adequate. M11 its 4F speed. 

[Nimar]

Perhaps it’s something silly like the removal of the baseplate that was acting as a dampener as surely it can’t be explained away with pixels alone, especially if people have issue with medium resolution and you could argue the m10m has similar absolute resolving power to the m11@60mp. 

Edited April 2, 2023 by Nimar

[sometimesmaybe]

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4 hours ago, ryanlowry said:

I am shooting a lot of flash outside which is where I see a lot of motion blur especially

maybe grab a strobe or a trigger than supports HSS. i'm not sure whats available the m11. the current godox lineup only has limited support for m10 and SL2

[DenverSteve]

5 hours ago, ryanlowry said:

Hello forum!

I have been shooting the M11 for about 4 months now and have been driven crazy by the amount of camera shake that is legible on the M-DNG and L-DNG files above 1/180th with my 35mm Summicron ASPH.

I am considering selling the camera and making a backwards move to a M10-R or even an M10-P.

I know for a fact the m10-p or m10 will do exactly what I need it to do as I owned the m10 for 5 years, and was quite happy with the camera. My reasons for upgrading to M11 were only based on the extended dynamic range and colors of the M11 - the added resolution was a perk, and I figured the ability to change the resolution would help with the camera shake but it doesn't seem to make a substantial enough difference compared to M10.

Has anyone extensively used m10, m10-r, and m11 that could speak to this for me? I am shooting a lot of flash outside which is where I see a lot of motion blur especially. 

I would like to know your settings.  If you are shooting outdoor, with strobe, and getting motion blur, it sounds like your shutter speed is set too low.  Maybe post a couple of pictures with your data so we can see. If you're shooting with strobe, outdoor, I would keep my shutter speed as high as possible and let the strobe do its job to freeze the image.

[Harout62]

Ok after reading this thread and half a dozen more like this in the past year I just went out in my garage and took a few shots to put this to bed 

M11  50mm Summilux Asph All shots hand held  first shot at 1/60th f 2.8 No Shake no shutter slap 

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[Harout62]

Same set up 1/30th of a second  no shake no Shutter slap

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[Jeff S]

OP…. Viewing magnification and distance?  Identical to m10?

Jeff

[Harout62]

how low can we go  Same set up 1/15th hand held 

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[gotium]

This is of interest to me also. I have never had so many blurry photos from any other camera as I get from the M11 and it is indeed frustrating me. I'm not sure what the cause is though, but particularly with telephoto lenses I rarely if ever see my subject in focus. 

[Harout62]

Can we go even lower ???? how about 1/8th of a second 

All this was taken in my garage 50mm Summilux Asph Hand held 60mpx, The M11 has no issues Learn to use it or just sell it and move on 

 

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[Jeff S]

9 minutes ago, gotium said:

This is of interest to me also. I have never had so many blurry photos from any other camera as I get from the M11 and it is indeed frustrating me. I'm not sure what the cause is though, but particularly with telephoto lenses I rarely if ever see my subject in focus. 

Post #12

Jeff

[gotium]

44 minutes ago, Harout62 said:

Can we go even lower ???? how about 1/8th of a second 

All this was taken in my garage 50mm Summilux Asph Hand held 60mpx, The M11 has no issues Learn to use it or just sell it and move on 

 

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Where are you? Would be interesting to see if you can do the same with my camera. 

[rustyrus]

I think Harout may be a bit more direct than I with this problem but I legitimately have no idea what you guys are talking about. 

 

You can't shoot a 35mm and get sharp pictures unless shooting at 1/180 or faster? The below is a picture I wasn't after crazy sharp details up close but its handheld at 1/15. I use the 3 points of contact method. This is a you problem not a Leica problem. 

 

 

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[mark1958a]

2 hours ago, sometimesmaybe said:

maybe grab a strobe or a trigger than supports HSS. i'm not sure whats available the m11. the current godox lineup only has limited support for m10 and SL2

I was just about to order the Godox Trigger for my M11--- so at this point it will not work?  I saw a similar comment after reading yours  on the bhphoto website review. 

[Harout62]

10 minutes ago, gotium said:

Where are you? Would be interesting to see if you can do the same with my camera. 

I am in Toronto Canada , and I took all 4 images in a matter of 3to4 minutes 1 shot at each Shutter speed casually just sitting in a chair in my garage.

these were not cherry picked from multiple try’s one shot each 

focus , take a deep breath and shoot.. I have consistently taken sharp images at speeds below my focal length without any issues. 

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Hallo,

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[gotium]

Hmmm well this is a new problem for me, and I've used....five film Ms and nine digital Ms before this one...