ho_co Posted December 31, 2010 Share #81 Posted December 31, 2010 Advertisement (gone after registration) I don't think you can expand the count string. Earlier versions of some Adobe products could, I think, truncate the number in the display. I don't think that's still the case. You've tried it on two computers and got the same result, so it's not a fluke. It sounds to me as if you're not looking at the correct string. As Ed suggested, could you post a screen shot of what you're seeing? Just point Bridge to an image, display the metadata, and do a capture (Cmd-Shift-4) of that part of the screen. Without that, we're flying blind. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted December 31, 2010 Posted December 31, 2010 Hi ho_co, Take a look here Determining Shutter Actuations on an M8. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
bonjac Posted January 1, 2011 Share #82 Posted January 1, 2011 As I said, I am no wizard when it comes to computers. Here is a screen capture of a dng file taken with the camera.. I did a little homework and this was the last of 15 pix I took. The very first unique id was ...0001. The last was ...000F. I know I took images before this. Am I not looking at the right thing? Actually I'm not even sure how to attach a screen capture. /Users/jack/Desktop/Screen shot 2010-12-31 at 5.05.30 PM.png Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ho_co Posted January 1, 2011 Share #83 Posted January 1, 2011 To attach something to a post, scroll down on the Reply screen. Under "Additional Options" there's a "Manage Attachments" button that will get you started. Or check out http://www.l-camera-forum.com/leica-forum/about-leica-forum/144293-how-upload-photos-forum.html. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonjac Posted January 1, 2011 Share #84 Posted January 1, 2011 Thank you, Howard. Here are two screen captures of exif data. I think. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/34953-determining-shutter-actuations-on-an-m8/?do=findComment&comment=1545460'>More sharing options...
Shootist Posted January 1, 2011 Share #85 Posted January 1, 2011 Ok Thanks for the screen shots. If you take more images does that number stay the same, 000>f, or does it change? Please post a JPG from this camera converted from a DNG using Adobe Camera RAW. There is a Save Image button on the bottom of the ACR screen and I know for a fact that JPG will have the Image Unique ID included. Oh and when making the JPG small enough to post here on this website make sure you don't use a program or setting that strips out the EXIF data. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ho_co Posted January 1, 2011 Share #86 Posted January 1, 2011 (edited) Ed sneaked in while I was preparing my answer, and beat me to it by three minutes. First, thanks for the screen captures! (Un)fortunately, they remove all doubt: What you've been reporting is exactly what's on the screen. It's not a problem with the software or the wrong string or anything external to the camera. IOW, you're right! One more question: Each time you fire the shutter, the "Image Unique ID" should be incremented by 01 hex. That means that each image you make should have a different image unique ID. From what you've said, that's not happening. Am I right? In other words, does the Image Unique ID stay the same when you take a picture? If so, there's something wrong with the camera. Possibly a lead is broken and the counting module isn't receiving the information that the shutter has been fired. I've never heard of such a thing. It shouldn't happen, and I'm sure Leica would be surprised to find that it has. Edited January 1, 2011 by ho_co Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonjac Posted January 2, 2011 Share #87 Posted January 2, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) The unique ID does not stay the same. I formatted a card, put it in the camera and took 15 images. The hex code count for the images ran from 01 to 0F -- which as I understand it is 1 thru 15. This suggests one of two things: first, removing a card and then putting it back in resets the hex counter, or, two, formatting a card causes the hex counter to reset. I'm going to try and steal some time today and run a few experiments. Does what I have related here suggest anything to you? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
farnz Posted January 2, 2011 Share #88 Posted January 2, 2011 T... Does what I have related here suggest anything to you? Jack, Since the frame numbering is retained by the battery on the motherboard it suggests to me that there may be a problem in that area. The mobo battery should recharge from the M8's Li-Ion battery but perhaps that's not happening. To test this you could save some custom settings, remove the (Li-Ion) battery and see if they've been retained. Also, is the camera retaining the number of shots on the card in the circular window on the top deck? (You'll need to try this with a low MB SD card otherwise it'll sit at 999.) Pete. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonjac Posted January 3, 2011 Share #89 Posted January 3, 2011 OK, here's what I have found. I had a memory card with images from a few weeks ago. I reinserted the card into the camera, and took some additional shots. The first image number was an accumulated number from severals years of use, but its unique ID was 01. The numbers for both the Image and the Unique ID continued to increment. Next, I formatted the card and took 4 additional images. The mage numbering sequence continued to accumulate from the previous total BUT the unique ID reset itself to 01 and then incremented properly. While taking the images, I did watch the count down in the top window of the camera and it is decrementing as it should. Also, I checked and the date and time are working as they should. As to processing a DNG through ACR, I did that but I am not sure I did what was asked. I'll redo it and attach. Suggestions or clarifications? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shootist Posted January 3, 2011 Share #90 Posted January 3, 2011 (edited) Just take a shot, load it on the computer, open it in ACR, click the Save Image button at the bottom left corner. In that window select JPG as the output and 5 as the quality. Click OK (or whatever it is) then open that JPG in PS and reduce its size to 960 pixels wide at its widest dimension Save it and watch what the file size will be, it has to be less then 240K (I think). You may have to reduce the image quality number again to get it below the MAX allowed for posting on this site. Then post it here. The image count and the shutter activation count are two totally different things and the shutter activation number/count should not change EVER. Edited January 3, 2011 by Shootist Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ho_co Posted January 4, 2011 Share #91 Posted January 4, 2011 (edited) ... Suggestions or clarifications? Jack, doing more won't bring any new knowledge. You've double-checked everything already. Your camera has a serious flaw. The Image Unique ID should always only increase. Of course, this behavior has absolutely no influence on picture-taking. If it were mine, I would send it to get a repair estimate. Check the estimate price and decide whether it's worth doing at the moment. If you don't have it fixed and decide to sell it, it may bring a higher price so long as the purchaser doesn't realize that the low reported number of activations is due to a defect and not to lack of use. If you send it to Leica for any repair, they will likely repair the counting circuitry as part of a general overhaul. But all the exposures already made will remain missing from the count. Your camera has a secret past that we'll never be able to recover. Personally, I doubt that Leica has seen anything like this, and I bet they would like to take a look at your camera to uncover what caused this behavior. Who knows, they might need to redesign that part of the circuit. Maybe even call it "Jack's fix." Edited January 4, 2011 by ho_co Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonjac Posted January 4, 2011 Share #92 Posted January 4, 2011 OK. Well I have only owned this camera for 2 months or so and am still trying to understand how to use it. The camera has a strange history from what I know. It was purchase, supposedly from B&H, by the person I bought it from in September. She decided after a month or so that she didn't like it and I bought it from her. "she" indicated that it had been some kind of demo -- image sequence number suggests it was not. My gut feeling is that the Image file sequence number is probably accurate and I'd be comfortable if Leica could set the unique id number to that number -- which is a little over 10K images. What attracted me to the Leica was the clarity of the images rendered by the M8. Of course, I am still learning how to use it. I have only one lens. But, I have been told I have a "good eye" and am hoping to captilize on that with the M8. However, you do raise a valid issue. If I do decide to sell, how do I represent the camera in terms of actuations? I don't want to mislead someone. I guess I will contact Leica. Is it better to contact Leica in NJ or Germany, given the situation? Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks to all. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ho_co Posted January 4, 2011 Share #93 Posted January 4, 2011 (edited) In the US or Canada, contact NJ. (Dealing with Germany is fine, but you're on your own for customs etc. I always send to NJ; if it needs to go to Germany, they handle that.) US number is 800-222-0118. Ask for Customer Service. You'll probably talk to their phone-mail, and they'll probably call you back in 24 hours. Tell them the whole situation--relatively new, bought from original purchaser, maybe still under warranty, give them the serial number, tell them that the Image Unique ID number resets when you format a card (and whenever else it does). Since Leica demo cameras normally have a one-year warranty, it may be under warranty to the original purchaser. If her story is accurate and she registered it, and if you've got any paperwork showing you bought it from her, they may be able to cut you some slack since it's so new. That is, the warranty isn't transferrable; but if she bought it as a demo a few months back, they may be able to help. They'll have to see the camera to say anything definite about it. You send it to them; they'll send you an estimate. Then you tell them to do the work or not. The problem is probably a strange one to them, Jack, so they're likely to have to run the same tests you did to see what's happening. When you pack the camera, send a description of how you've tested it, just as you've done here. Whatever you do, keep us posted. Edited January 4, 2011 by ho_co Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonjac Posted January 4, 2011 Share #94 Posted January 4, 2011 Howard, Thanks so much for all your help and assistance with this. Jack Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olsen Posted January 6, 2011 Share #95 Posted January 6, 2011 I tried one of my last pictures taken with my M8 - which I have bought new: Image Unique ID 00000000000000000000000000001529 What does this tell? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olsen Posted January 6, 2011 Share #96 Posted January 6, 2011 And this one: From the 'new' M9 I have bought: 0000000000000000000000000000192A Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
farnz Posted January 6, 2011 Share #97 Posted January 6, 2011 I tried one of my last pictures taken with my M8 - which I have bought new: Image Unique ID 00000000000000000000000000001529 What does this tell? (1 x 4096) + (5 x 256) + (2 x 16) + (9 x 1) = 4096 + 1280 + 32 + 9 = 5417 The shutter count is 5,417. Pete. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olsen Posted January 6, 2011 Share #98 Posted January 6, 2011 I found this hexadecimal - decimal converter here: hexadecimal conversion, convert decimal to hexadecimal When using this, my old (well) M8 has 5417 actuations, while the new (well) M9 I have just bought has 6442 actuations under it's belt. Well, interesting... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonjac Posted January 6, 2011 Share #99 Posted January 6, 2011 As suggested, I contacted Leica. Spoke with a technical representative who stated that the only way actual shutter actuations can be determined is by a technician and that while other manufacturers may use EXIF data for such purposes, Leica does not. Not giving up easily, I asked if the Unique Image ID should be resetting after a card is formatted. He said he didn't know. I explained all the discussion from our forum. He failed to be impressed but passed me to a digital person who was out of the office. So waiting, waiting.... This is my first experience with Leica and Leica support; so far, underwhelming. But, some information. If this person was correct, the Image Unique ID is not an accurate reflection of actuations! Up to this point, I thought it was. Now, I am not sure what it says. More to come. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olsen Posted January 6, 2011 Share #100 Posted January 6, 2011 Regardless; Checking my own four years old M8 it gave a result wich seems accurate when comparing this with the file numbers I have generated up through the years. I tried to do the same test on my 1Ds III this page gave no result at all: Jeffrey's Exif viewer Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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