All the Nikon menus

[jrc]

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I use a D2x in addition to the M8, and just took a look at DP Review's preview of the D300. It looks like a nice camera, but honest-to-God, when I got to the part of the preview that details the menus, I just faded out. I never did figure out the endless complexities of the D2x menu, and the D300 appears to be just as complicated. The D300 also has a monochrome "settings" LCD on top, and just the explanation of that LCD bummed me out. Leica's minimalism is, I think, extremely functional -- you can actually understand the camera, and never worry that there's some function in menu 1.3 © ( that you're missing.

 

JC

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[Guest s.m.e.p.]

Leica has this minimalism because you have to do all those settings in your raw-converter.

[billh]

These two threads might interest you,

 

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1021&message=24736304

 

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/readflat.asp?forum=1021&thread=24752213

[ho_co]

John--

You're already half-way there if you're using a D2x, aren't you?

 

Allow me a brief rant, please, to wit:

 

I've got a D200, and at least the D300 has done away with the "tone" and "color mode" menus! In the D200 you've got a choice of Color Mode I, Color Mode II, or Color Mode III (except that Color Mode II is accessible only if you're in Adobe RGB color space). And nowhere does the manual or the menu-accessible help file (!) explain what Modes I, II and III do, except that one is better for portraits and another is more vibrant. Just more Nikon jargon IMHO, like calling Full-Frame "FX."

 

It's the difference between building a camera to do everything and building one (Leica) to take pictures. As I recall, on all the thumbwheel-set adjustments but one, "+" values are to the right on the D200, but on that one (what were they thinking?), "+" values are to the left. Why, oh why?

 

And the worst of all is that after you've got almost all the way through the manual (really a very clear, quite praiseworthy manual) trying to master the twists and turns, you find out there's a custom setting that lets you flip for all the settings whether the main control knob is the one on the front and the secondary control knob the one on the back of the camera, or whether that is to be reversed.

 

There's a lot of inconvenience in the D200, but it's still a very workable camera. I prefer Leica's approach, but Nikon sells a few more of these things than Leica does (even sold me one ), so maybe they're doing something right?

 

Sorry to latch onto your thread to unload, but thanks for opening the opportunity.

 

--HC

[erl]

Leica has this minimalism because you have to do all those settings in your raw-converter.

 

. . . . and ain't that the most convenient and suitable time and place to do it?

 

Can't think of anything worse than making a "million" decisions in the 'face of the enemy' (or whatever I am shooting).

[Guest guy_mancuso]

I agree Erl and main reason i sold the Canons. Even after a year with a camera i was still confused on how to do a simple task in the menu. Guess i like driving a stick better. LOL

[Guest s.m.e.p.]

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. . . . and ain't that the most convenient and suitable time and place to do it?

 

Can't think of anything worse than making a "million" decisions in the 'face of the enemy' (or whatever I am shooting).

 

With the D2X and D200 you get 4 "Shooting Presets".

 

I have programmed them one time for

A. Stage- and Concert-Pictures

B. Portrait

C. Landscape/Travel

D. Event

 

So it´s very easy to switch.

 

A.+D. is just jpg

B. is raw + jpg

C. is only raw

[lct]

My Nikons have always been easy to use as far as i recall.

Don't need menus for simple operations like changing ISO for instance.

Are D2x and D200 different?

[Guest s.m.e.p.]

Are D2x and D200 different?

 

No.

 

ISO, White Balance and Quality are very easy to switch without menu.

[lct]

Thank you s.m.e.p., so left thumb on the button and right one on the dial as usual i guess. Pretty straightforward IMHO.

Bill, i'm impressed by the D3 and D300 as well but what a pity that those bodies are that big and (i suppose) so noisy.

I keep using my little D70 instead of the D2H for the same reasons.

I am still waiting for Nikon to launch a small/quiet body with a big bright viewfinder allowing the use of Ais and Zeiss lenses easily.

[jrc]

I didn't mean that the D2x isn't an easy camera to use -- it is, as long as you use it in it's simplest mode, as a point-and-shoot. But it really wants you to get into all the operations, and that's where it shines.

 

Thom Hogan, the Nikon specialist guy, published an on-line PDF book to explain the D2x. I bought it, and It's 749 (!!!) full-sized book pages long. The "custom settings" section of the menu review is more than 70 pages long, and that's just one part of the menu stuff. An equivalent book for the Leica would be about 20 pages long.

 

The D2x is a great camera for somebody who has highly specific needs (shooting dance, for example, where the conditions are at once extreme and at the same time fairly easy to anticipate in the sense that you know where the performance will be, generally what the lighting will be, where you will be, etc.)

 

The Leica, on the other hand, seems to be a specialized generalist machine, if that makes sense -- maybe not so good at the margins, but brilliant in the center.

 

In lots of ways, the Nikons and Canons remind me of the BMW iDrive, which seems to be designed for engineers who are fascinated by precison and function, rather than for the guy who wants to turn on the radio.

 

JC

[lct]

I didn't mean that the D2x isn't an easy camera to use -- it is, as long as you use it in it's simplest mode, as a point-and-shoot.... Nikons and Canons remind me of the BMW iDrive, which seems to be designed for engineers who are fascinated by precison and function, rather than for the guy who wants to turn on the radio.

So you want to turn on the radio without using your cam like a point-and-shot?

To each his own of course but setting autofocus aside i use my Nikons the same way as my DRFs basically i.e. without chimping and using the menus to format the cards mainly.

[guywalder]

well I dont think DP reviews format helps much...

personally I like the fact that I could set up my D2x how I want to, 90% of the menus were set and forget for me. I find it irritating that I have No choice on the M8.

I think Leica missed a great opportunity, with the F5 Nikon started a great idea, personalisation via pc. Leica could have left the M8 as a simple camera, but let customers set it up how They want via a pc.

As it is my D2x is actually easier and faster to use for all of the, few, options that I change regularly (ISO, WB), while the M8 works the way a few german engineers think it should, rather than how I want it to.....

Leica are great at lenses, but they really, Really need to move on from the M3

[sdai]

i use my Nikons the same way as my DRFs basically i.e. without chimping and using the menus to format the cards mainly.

 

Actually you only need to press both FORMAT buttons at the same time ... there's absolutely no need to go into the menu.

 

These menus are pretty much once set never bother again type of things, especially when you can store multiple sets of settings in different shooting banks.

[lct]

Actually you only need to press both FORMAT buttons at the same time ...

Yes you're right of course.

In fact i use the menus so rarely that i forgot why.

[kobold]

I like the Nikon menus on my D2Hs, frankly. I always ahoot Raw for work, but the menu system allows me to set and forget (as someone said above) for those times when I just want to shoot and download. Pretty much everything's configurable—if you want/need to.

 

If you don't, as LCT said, just use the buttons. Almost everything's there, once you have set the camera up to behave the way you wan it to.

[leonpro]

Coming from a Digilux 3 to a Nikon D80, I didn't find any difficulty in adjusting. Just like the Leica menu, there are buttons on the body to give you the most accessible features a photographer might need. Hence, you don't have to go into the menu to change settings like ISO, WB, etc.

 

The problem with Japanese design is that they love to make it look more like some gizmo with so many buttons that it looks like a remote control rather than intuitive like a Leica.

 

I wonder how the Digilux 4 will look like if they don't finally cave in to Panasonic's design ideas. I'm hoping they go separate ways with DSLR models than succumb to looking like another Japanese camera.

 

Nikon and Canon have found their design and "ergonomics" already with those multiple LCD screen, which I don't mind. I just hope Leica finds a way to keep on developing their own body than piggy-back with Panasonic. If Nikon can utilize Sony sensors without having a Sony design, Leica should just do the same like what they are did with the M8.