'Leica batteries'

[2M6TTLs]

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Just bought an SL2s with 24-70. All is well but couldn't help noticing the battery is made in China.

Anyone know why Leica batteries are so expensive if made in  China? Wouldn't the reason to have them made in China be to reduce cost?

Seems a bit ridiculous. I would expect they could easily be made in Germany for that price. 

[Ba Erv]

Just to make you feel better…they’re significantly cheaper in the EU than the US too.

[Photoworks]

37 minutes ago, 2M6TTLs said:

Just bought an SL2s with 24-70. All is well but couldn't help noticing the battery is made in China.

Anyone know why Leica batteries are so expensive if made in  China? Wouldn't the reason to have them made in China be to reduce cost?

Seems a bit ridiculous. I would expect they could easily be made in Germany for that price. 

You can thank Donald Trump for prices going up in usa

[masjah]

It's because it's Leica, irrespective of the OEM country source. They charge what their market will bear. For example, compare the price of a Leica flashgun with the branded product of which it is self-evidently a clone. Or consider the flash PC socket caps for the R8/R9 and some film Ms (literally a few pence worth) which were about £6. Welcome to the world of Leica.

[Anbaric]

2 hours ago, 2M6TTLs said:

Anyone know why Leica batteries are so expensive if made in  China? Wouldn't the reason to have them made in China be to reduce cost?

It is to reduce cost. The cost to Leica, not their customers. 🙂

[frame-it]

1 hour ago, Photoworks said:

You can thank Donald Trump for prices going up in usa

i thought that was only for optics a.k.a lenses

[Photoworks]

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1 hour ago, frame-it said:

i thought that was only for optics a.k.a lenses

Battery have the same. But I think Leica distributed the tariffs cost across the product line.

It is amusing how in the USA the welcomed the tariffs to punish other countries , but the cost is just pushed to the USA consumer.

I buy my batteries when I travel to Europe for euro 125 on amazon from a French Leica dealer.

 

[Chuck Albertson]

2 hours ago, frame-it said:

i thought that was only for optics a.k.a lenses

The tariffs were only for lenses, and they've been suspended for five years while the US and EU work out their aircraft subsidies. SL batt prices were sky-high even before Leica increased prices across their products lines in response to the tariffs, and were sky-high even before Trump hit town.

[beewee]

It’s probably related to the rather low volumes that Leica purchases. Pricing is very dependent on order quantities and the larger the quantities a company can order, the better pricing they get, which they can pass on to the consumer. The number of SL2/SL2-S/Q2 batteries sold pales in comparison any Sony/Nikon/Canon/Fuji and often those cameras share the same battery across multiple models and across multiple generations. So this enables these companies to order massive quantities at a time (at least relative to Leica) which reduces cost.

[sillbeers15]

It is just simple business sense.

Charge customers based on the percived value of Leica branded batteries,

Pay lowest OEM battery producer (China producer, perhaps subsidised by Chinese Govt to aid competitiveness against other battery producers in the world),

Maximise profit at Leica.

[2M6TTLs]

20 hours ago, Anbaric said:

It is to reduce cost. The cost to Leica, not their customers. 🙂

I thought of that. It doesn't give me a smiley face though.

[2M6TTLs]

21 hours ago, masjah said:

It's because it's Leica, irrespective of the OEM country source. They charge what their market will bear. For example, compare the price of a Leica flashgun with the branded product of which it is self-evidently a clone. Or consider the flash PC socket caps for the R8/R9 and some film Ms (literally a few pence worth) which were about £6. Welcome to the world of Leica.

Understood John. I have been in the world of Leica for some time with my M  system so I've 'adapted' to the price premium. However this is the first time for me to encounter the world of Chinese Leica! I see you are based in Hull. I'm from Grimsby originally but somehow ended up far, far away on the other side of the globe in Japan.

[masjah]

7 minutes ago, 2M6TTLs said:

Understood John. I have been in the world of Leica for some time with my M  system so I've 'adapted' to the price premium. However this is the first time for me to encounter the world of Chinese Leica! I see you are based in Hull. I'm from Grimsby originally but somehow ended up far, far away on the other side of the globe in Japan.

Nice to meet another Leica owner from our neck of the woods. Given the relatively low cost of living in our region, we'd doubtless feel the Leica premium pain even more, though I guess living in Japan may have got you used to it!

[BernardC]

On 10/1/2021 at 9:20 AM, masjah said:

It's because it's Leica, irrespective of the OEM country source. They charge what their market will bear. For example, compare the price of a Leica flashgun with the branded product of which it is self-evidently a clone. Or consider the flash PC socket caps for the R8/R9 and some film Ms (literally a few pence worth) which were about £6. Welcome to the world of Leica.

In other words, the markup on PC socket caps is lower than the markup on breakfast cereal!

It's easy to figure-out why Leica can't provide these small parts "at cost," 20 years after the cameras that they fit went out of production. The other option is not to keep spares around, which is what most brand do.

Flashguns have the same inherent costing rules. Leica buys a small number of flashes, and supports them for a decade. The OEM pumps them out in between orders for bluetooth speakers. Sure, you can get "the same" flash for another brand much cheaper, but they'll only be available for a limited time, and they won't be supported for more than a year. It's unfortunate, but Leica doesn't have the sales volume required to buy container-loads of flashes, which also means that you can't rely on your favourite retailer to have a cheap compatible unit in-stock when you need one.

[masjah]

9 minutes ago, BernardC said:

In other words, the markup on PC socket caps is lower than the markup on breakfast cereal!

It's easy to figure-out why Leica can't provide these small parts "at cost," 20 years after the cameras that they fit went out of production. The other option is not to keep spares around, which is what most brand do.

Flashguns have the same inherent costing rules. Leica buys a small number of flashes, and supports them for a decade. The OEM pumps them out in between orders for bluetooth speakers. Sure, you can get "the same" flash for another brand much cheaper, but they'll only be available for a limited time, and they won't be supported for more than a year. It's unfortunate, but Leica doesn't have the sales volume required to buy container-loads of flashes, which also means that you can't rely on your favourite retailer to have a cheap compatible unit in-stock when you need one.

I don't quite follow this. TESCO charges about £5 for a large pack of 72 Weetabix. I can't believe that this is a greater percentage mark-up  that that on one PC socket cap. Let's be generous to Leica and say that it costs them as much as 6 pence to have them made. That's a mark-up of 100 times. That would correspond to Weetabix being able to manufature a large 72 pack for 5 pence.

I'm not suggesting that Leica should provide socket caps at cost. Obviously there's storage costs, costs of maintaining their inventory, and a very small amount of capital tied up. I am suggesting that it's a question of degree, and that £6 was somewhat over the top. 

[rtai]

In a typical supply chain outsourcing scenario who makes the most money? The factory, the brand, the distributor/agent, or the retailer? In the world of mass consumer goods the factory makes the least money per unit followed by the brand, both of which deal in volume. Per unit wise the retailer marks up the highest because they need to pay rent hire people to sell the crap. Distribution/logistics cost varies by country with the West being the highest due to unions, etc. I am afraid I have no experience with high end luxury products.

[AndreasG]

vor 3 Stunden schrieb rtai:

who makes the most money?

The government via the VAT - no expenses, no investment but the money is free flowing.

[Anbaric]

On 10/2/2021 at 11:40 AM, 2M6TTLs said:

I thought of that. It doesn't give me a smiley face though.

If we don't laugh, we have to cry.

This is, after all, a company that charges £120 for a UV filter, which they probably outsource somewhere and I doubt is any better than the £40 B+W equivalent. Not to mention those £30 plastic lens caps...

21 hours ago, BernardC said:

It's easy to figure-out why Leica can't provide these small parts "at cost," 20 years after the cameras that they fit went out of production. The other option is not to keep spares around, which is what most brand do.

Leica don't always keep spares around either. The 14043 hood cap became impossible to find shortly after the lenses that used it were discontinued. And DMR owners were resorting to third party refurbs of their batteries just a few years after Leica stopped selling the module. What will happen when SL and M series batteries are no longer available from Leica? The larger camera companies tend to use the same battery across quite a few models and there are usually decent (and some not so decent substitutes) from third parties. You can still find compatible batteries for a 20 year old Nikon like the D100. Will this be the case for Leica batteries, which have a single supplier? The DMR experience suggests not.

Edited October 3, 2021 by Anbaric

[Chris Nebard]

17 minutes ago, Anbaric said:

If we don't laugh, we have to cry.

This is, after all, a company that charges £120 for a UV filter, which they probably outsource somewhere and I doubt is any better than the £40 B+W equivalent. Not to mention those £30 plastic lens caps...

Leica don't always keep spares around either. The 14043 hood cap became impossible to find shortly after the lenses that used it were discontinued. And DMR owners were resorting to third party refurbs of their batteries just a few years after Leica stopped selling the module.

Apologies if this is veering off topic but I’ve heard that your point on filters is correct and that they may be made for Leica by Hoya. Additionally, I’m not sure that lenses on digital cameras actually need UV filters - i.e. they don’t add anything useful other than protection. I use B+W clear filters which add absolutely no colour cast, don’t reduce light and are intended for that ‘protection’ purpose, They suit me better, but each to their own of course. 

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica L-Mount

[Anbaric]

32 minutes ago, Chris Nebard said:

Apologies if this is veering off topic but I’ve heard that your point on filters is correct and that they may be made for Leica by Hoya. Additionally, I’m not sure that lenses on digital cameras actually need UV filters - i.e. they don’t add anything useful other than protection. I use B+W clear filters which add absolutely no colour cast, don’t reduce light and are intended for that ‘protection’ purpose, They suit me better, but each to their own of course. 

Yes, we'd probably better not get too far into the whole UV/protective filter debate, the subject of endless debates between people who think you'd be mad to use them, vs others who think you'd be mad not to! But I think it's a good example of something Leica must be selling at a really substantial markup, when we know there are high quality alternatives for perhaps 1/3 of the price from companies with excellent reputations. As masjah says above, Leica sells at the price the market will bear. If people are prepared to pay £120 for an E39 UV, Leica are happy to oblige them.

With generic things like filters, straps and standard caps, of course, we have plenty of choice. With batteries and other very specific accessories, we may have no other choice than to buy from Leica, assuming the item is even still available. But before I get too critical, Leica were recently able to replace a compact binocular case for a price I thought was perfectly reasonable, not much more than the third party alternative I was considering. So full marks to the Sports Optics spares division!