Lens choice: creative consistency vs versatility?

[pippy]

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3 hours ago, IkarusJohn said:

More specifically, trying to understand the original question (rephrased):

The question is written from the perspective of equipment, rather than what I consider to be the core question - how do I capture what I’m seeing in a way which gives me pleasure and gives others a glimpse into the way I see the world but which they perhaps don’t.....if there is a scene I wish to capture in a particular way, then I choose the lens which will further that end......In that context, the equipment choice gets in the way of the creative process...

I agree with pretty much everything you wrote in your very thoughtful post.

Considering, for a moment, the part I've quoted I'd like to say why I believe the the joint questions of......

(1) Which equipment should be used? and (2) How do I capture the image in the way I see it and wish it to be portrayed?

...are far from being a problem and, moreover, they are often inseperable.

In much the same way a (non-photographic) Fine Artist can elect to render the same scene in oils / watercolour / charcoal-sticks (and so forth) a photographer can select camera bodies and lenses which have different capture- and drawing-styles to portray the same scene in a different manner. If - as discussed in post #189 - I am carrying both my 40mm Nokton and my 50mm Summarit with M-D and Monochrom it is my equivalent of the Fine Artist carrying both Oil Pastels and Charcoal sticks with canvas-boards and watercolour paper. In the same fashion as the Fine Artist will decide whether one particular vista would benefit more from being captured in polychrome pastel or monochrome charcoal I will choose between clinically sharp or more atmospheric; in colour or, erm, in Monochrom.

From the way I approach things these choices of lens / body combinations, far from being an obstacle to the creative process, are actually a fundamental and important part of it.

Just a thought!

Philip.

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[capo di tutti capi]

as I said. Brush selection again

Edited May 21, 2021 by capo di tutti capi

[jaapv]

21 minutes ago, capo di tutti capi said:

as I said. Brush selection again

It must be hard to maintain your lofty artistic ambitions without basic understanding of your tools... You must be like Karel Appel: "I'm just messing about". 🤡

[pgk]

9 hours ago, Ko.Fe. said:

Rangefinders. They are made to be close to people.

I don't understand those who are using rangefinders for flowers in bokeh and landscapes at F16. All of my books I have purchased are free of it. Majority of books I have are with photos taken with rangefinder cameras. And it is about people.

There are many examples of photographers who have and do use Leica RF cameras for taking images of subject matter other than people. W A Poucher was a highly succesful mountain photographer who I believe used a Leica III with perhaps 35/50/90 lenses in the 1930s/40s/50s+ and was heavily published with numerous books, especially in B&W. The weight and compact nature of the Leica was obviously important especially when travelling the world. My father met him once in the mountains of Snowdonia. Poucer was wearing lipstick (he worked as a perfumier for half the year and a photographer for the other half) as he was testing it out - I suspect it also reduced the number of people mithering him when he was taking photographs! We tend to pigeonhole equipment which is actually very versatile.

[Cobram]

24 minutes ago, pippy said:

I agree with pretty much everything you wrote in your very thoughtful post.

Considering, for a moment, the part I've quoted I'd like to say why I believe the the joint questions of......

(1) Which equipment should be used? and (2) How do I capture the image in the way I see it and wish it to be portrayed?

...are far from being a problem and, moreover, they are often inseperable.

In much the same way a (non-photographic) Fine Artist can elect to render the same scene in oils / watercolour / charcoal-sticks (and so forth) a photographer can select camera bodies and lenses which have different capture- and drawing-styles to portray the same scene in a different manner. If - as discussed in post #189 - I am carrying both my 40mm Nokton and my 50mm Summarit with M-D and Monochrom it is my equivalent of the Fine Artist carrying both Oil Pastels and Charcoal sticks with canvas-boards and watercolour paper. In the same fashion as the Fine Artist will decide whether one particular vista would benefit more from being captured in polychrome pastel or monochrome charcoal I will choose between clinically sharp or more atmospheric; in colour or, erm, in Monochrom.

From the way I approach things these choices of lens / body combinations, far from being an obstacle to the creative process, are actually a fundamental and important part of it.

Just a thought!

Philip.

True. I certainly look at the scene in different way if I suppose to take B&W or color photo. 

Ohh...Only now I realised I lost my brush😅 I'm definitely not an artist...

Edited May 21, 2021 by Cobram

[jaapv]

3 minutes ago, pgk said:

There are many examples of photographers who have and do use Leica RF cameras for taking images of subject matter other than people. W A Poucher was a highly succesful mountain photographer who I believe used a Leica III with perhaps 35/50/90 lenses in the 1930s/40s/50s+ and was heavily published with numerous books, especially in B&W. The weight and compact nature of the Leica was obviously important especially when travelling the world. My father met him once in the mountains of Snowdonia. Poucer was wearing lipstick (he worked as a perfumier for half the year and a photographer for the other half) as he was testing it out - I suspect it also reduced the number of people mithering him when he was taking photographs! We tend to pigeonhole equipment which is actually very versatile.

Or Dr. Paul Wolff.

[pippy]

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13 minutes ago, pgk said:

...W A Poucher was a highly succesful mountain photographer who I believe used a Leica III with perhaps 35/50/90 lenses in the 1930s/40s/50s...

Anyone care to mention why Oskar Barnack came up with the idea of what was to become the Leica in the first place?...

Philip.

[Ouroboros]

17 minutes ago, pgk said:

There are many examples of photographers who have and do use Leica RF cameras for taking images of subject matter other than people. W A Poucher was a highly succesful mountain photographer who I believe used a Leica III with perhaps 35/50/90 lenses in the 1930s/40s/50s+ and was heavily published with numerous books, especially in B&W. The weight and compact nature of the Leica was obviously important especially when travelling the world. My father met him once in the mountains of Snowdonia. Poucer was wearing lipstick (he worked as a perfumier for half the year and a photographer for the other half) as he was testing it out - I suspect it also reduced the number of people mithering him when he was taking photographs! We tend to pigeonhole equipment which is actually very versatile.

Only yesterday I was thumbing through my copy of The Welsh Peaks as we're packing for our impending house move.  WA Poucher was a huge inspiration to me in my early days as a photographer and hillwalker.  His photography and his books are just as relevant today as they were over 70 years ago.

ETA, it's amazing how an image title such as Tryfan in Winter Raiment can stay with you from early teenage to to mid-60's! 

Edited May 21, 2021 by Ouroboros

[pippy]

37 minutes ago, capo di tutti capi said:

as I said. Brush selection again

If you truly think that brush selection is not of primary importance to a fine artist then, clearly, you have never been a painter yourself nor have even the slightest understanding of how a painter approaches their art.

Philip.

 

[jaapv]

Actually I am one of those idiots who'll happily take an M camera off the street and into the world..

 

https://the.me/henri-in-africa-the-leica-monochrom-as-a-travel-camera/

https://the.me/die-leica-in-der-hand-the-monochrom-goes-into-the-snow/

 

[capo di tutti capi]

everything that has been done before has already been done. There is no point in making another Mona Lisa. This is cloning. We have a lot of experience in the work of great artists. Billions of unnecessary photos that don't need to be shown. 

I saw the Apotheosis of modern photography. The person who does the reviews. The train station toilet photographed on 0.95 lux.

Edited May 21, 2021 by capo di tutti capi

[Fedro]

5 minutes ago, jaapv said:

Actually I am one of those idiots who'll happily take an M camera off the street and into the world..

 

https://the.me/henri-in-africa-the-leica-monochrom-as-a-travel-camera/

https://the.me/die-leica-in-der-hand-the-monochrom-goes-into-the-snow/

 

lovely photos Jaap

[capo di tutti capi]

Sorry. It was https://www.google.com/search?source=univ&tbm=isch&q=african+children&client=ms-android-htc&fir=1VaYz6pUGSH_7M%2CuED2CJCfHWDCtM%2C_%3B11jfbOZ5FLP7_M%2CUhi3tkH8bPXJpM%2C_%3BJDD2nXkEiN4idM%2CYqUjbpUvoRt0_M%2C_%3BjFYUod5dqI3vJM%2C1sMRcibdOabZyM%2C_%3BybuFZUgvt1yyrM%2CdYQwC53P5pc_1M%2C_%3B8FNfHvv-fs4rfM%2CJyA6ozKFRd9r2M%2C_%3ByCa5mHDq237bKM%2CgImAcGENPbhdTM%2C_%3BjAAbljKEiS0tPM%2C05736_o-ZG27JM%2C_%3BW8WuPsz4-FrAWM%2CdTpHewEar3KdKM%2C_%3BHf7otXu-_q1xWM%2CseCu1KF3F6eo5M%2C_%3BzdEpfiuSGdbX6M%2CAFBLopswmzFK8M%2C_%3Bj5_YZM_nkkMLXM%2Ct2VbhkqfYovF9M%2C_%3Bir43DbpprQyr1M%2CvAvnO0hVF7IF1M%2C_&usg=AI4_-kSu_iv-iFMh3nsn9ayN2-hOregj3Q&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjrqI6axNrwAhUlCRAIHTjlAFoQsAR6BAgDEAI&biw=360&bih=567&dpr=2

[pippy]

10 minutes ago, capo di tutti capi said:

everything that has been done before has already been done...

 

Ermmm......yes. You really are a Philosopher!

Philip.

Edited May 21, 2021 by pippy

[jaapv]

Yes - and? I have hudreds of such photographs - even quite a few in the Photoforums.

[capo di tutti capi]

16 minutes ago, jaapv said:

Yes - and? I have hudreds of such photographs - even quite a few in the Photoforums.

Think about it.

Edited May 21, 2021 by capo di tutti capi

[Cobram]

20 minutes ago, capo di tutti capi said:

 

 

Read my article: " children are easy to photograph in Africa". Show me one photograph that you have done that hasn't, in essence, been done before. Not that it is of any interest. Actually, I am sure that these were the first photographs that were done using the Monochrom in Africa. The essence being that the rendering of this tool has a unique signature. So no, they were not done before.

Capo: Show me one photograph that you have done that hasn't, in essence, been done before. Can you show us one of your photos that was not done before? I'm really interested. 

Am I allowed to add one additional philosophic thesis to your lecture?

My answer is: The most beautiful mornings are in the morning. 😅😂

[capo di tutti capi]

18 minutes ago, Cobram said:

Capo: Show me one photograph that you have done that hasn't, in essence, been done before. Can you show us one of your photos that was not done before? I'm really interested. 

Am I allowed to add one additional philosophic thesis to your lecture?

My answer is: The most beautiful mornings are in the morning. 😅😂

Oh my God. Read attentively. Wrote about this many times. I turned off the camera. For the internet. Until the moment when I do not make a philosophical project. In addition, I need to apply knowledge about art, tricks from the cinema. It is very difficult to take a photo. Not just another rubbish.

The coolest trash has already been photographed. Toilet at the train station. Plus <Magnum>

Edited May 21, 2021 by capo di tutti capi

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[pippy]

OK; this is the very last thing I'm going to say which is Off-Topic in Masukami's interesting thread;

I've finally realised where tutti is coming from and it is here;

Point #1; All art which has already been done has already been done.

Point #2; All existing art is therefore, by definition, Derivative and is a complete waste of time and space.

Point #3; If I create any Art - as Point #3 - it follows that Point #3 leads to Point #1 which leads to Point #2.

Point #4; It is my duty as a True Artist to not create anything.

From now on I will block the, erm, True Artist from my viewing experience so I can concentrate on the more interesting replies which discuss the OP's question.

Philip.

Edited May 21, 2021 by pippy

[pgk]

12 minutes ago, capo di tutti capi said:

Oh my God. Read attentively. Wrote about this many times. I turned off the camera. For the internet. Until the moment when I do not make a philosophical project. In addition, I need to apply knowledge about art, tricks from the cinema. It is very difficult to take a photo. Not just another rubbish.

The coolest trash has already been photographed. Toilet at the train station. Plus <Magnum>

If all photographs are rubbish, why are you here? You will, according to your posts, see nothing new and I assume read nothing new, so why bother?