Elmarit M 28mm f/2.8 V3 (made in Canada, E49 filter)

[M2Pete]

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I have a chance to get this lens with a B&W filter, hood, caps and case for a good deal. I've searched the internet and here but really not found a good answer as to questions which are, how does it render on the 262 digital sensor in terms of contrast, color and light and its general ergonomics?

There is a plethora of opinions and reviews across the net regarding the ASPH E39 version but little on this lens (maybe I haven't searched the forum enough, for that I apologize). I am looking for a lens that offers detail but not the clinically sharp modern lens look.

I know this is terribly vague request, but I'd like to know if you own it or shoot with it why you like it or dislike it.

Currently I shoot an old Canon rangefinder lens for 28mm but it is a f/3.5 (came with a cold shoe viewfinder and my M2) and desire something a bit more modern and brighter aperture for my M-D Typ262.

[UliWer]

If you search with the username "adan", you'll find a lot:

Just some examples I took today with the v.3 28mm Elmarit on the M10:

 

[adan]

1 minute ago, UliWer said:

If you search with the username "adan", you'll find a lot:

Rendering in general - I love it. Moderate overall contrast; very good raw resolution, but lower edge-contrast (MTF, accutance) and more cyan-ish color than today's (post-1994) Leica lenses.

As a legacy pre-digital M wide-angle, it benefits from 6-bit coding/identification (or diligent selection from the lens menu) to remove faint color stains caused by digital sensors. See sample below.

Although on the M10 (and probably the M262) CMOS sensors, that is less required than on the M9. That will be a matter of personal preference and pickiness. Fortunately, it is the earliest 28mm model that Leica will retrofit with 6-bit coding. Several hundred $$$, however, so factor that into the total cost if you'll want it.

Ergonomics - it is the largest 28mm Elmarit-M Leica ever made. For reasons of not blocking TTL metering (M5, M6 > today) while retaining excellent imaging. Mounted on a camera, it is (or at least feels) close to twice as big as the tiny ASPH. But I like the smooth Leitz/Mandler/Canada rendering so much that I put up with the size.

This image was made with an uncoded 28 v.3 on an M10, and ID'd via menu as a 75mm (for reasons of rapid lens changing and shooting at an event - couldn't be bothered with the menu.)

It shows some cyan-drift left and right in the white jacket and white wall. I found it acceptable, the subjects didn't give a rat's pattooty, YMMV. In subjects without large areas of solid white, it can be hard to detect without side-by-side comparisons.

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[M2Pete]

@Adan Thank you! This was very helpful, just the sort of information I was looking for! Thanks for adding the photo. The M-D shoots only DNGs so I can fiddle in post if need be. I'm looking for an atmospheric feel to my photos rather than an aspheric clinical sharpness and contrast and this looks to be it!

[tedd]

Off topic, but is the v4 based off this lens? I know the v3 is the last Mandler 28 but the v4 seems quite similar to my untrained eye.

[Stein K S]

Hi 

A highly unscentific comment from my side... I ownde the V3 for about a week, but returned it due to shape (missing hod nod, lose focus tab etc). However, I was really charmed by the rendering/¨softness¨ of this lens. I guess Adan puts it better in words than I do.

 

I then got the chance to buy a really nice copy of the v4. And in my eyes this lens hits my ¨hot spot¨ concerning rendering. Still unclinical, but crisper & more ¨lucid¨ rendering than the V3... (a clear/obvious step towards the more modern to use that term)

 

So conclusion is that I would have been happy with both, but they are still rather different... considering all things are relative...

Edited May 5, 2021 by Stein K S

[adan]

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3 hours ago, tedd said:

Off topic, but is the v4 based off this lens?

Well, the v.4 is not the v.3 with minor tweaks.

It is substantially smaller and shorter to reduce viewfinder blockage with the built-in 28 framelines in the M4-P and later Ms. The v.3 was designed when it was still assumed an external shoe-mount finder would be used for 28mm lenses.

And the glass shapes inside are quite different (the v.4 has a flat front surface, and gets rid of a rather thick element in the back half of the v.3 lens.)

In terms of the imaging, the v.4 adds both edge and global contrast, and is "transitional" in color between Leitz Canada cyan and Leica Solms/Wetzlar II pink(er).

On the other hand, my experience is that 28mm f/2.8 lenses - once designers figured out the demands of retrofocus formulas - are generally very, very good, whether they be Leica, or Nikon, or Canon or anyone else's. By the 1980s, It was hard to find a "bad" one, even from third-party brands - at least once one got past the "$39.95" store brands.

The excellent Nikkor AI-S 28mm f/2.8 could "pass" for a v.4 Elmarit, 19 times out of 20.

As one of the three pillars of the pre-zoom enthusiasts' kit (28, 50, 135, on a Nikkormat or FTb/AE-1), they got a lot of attention  and TLC from designers.

So we are always talking small differences. Even the 28mm Elmarit-M ASPH is mostly about "smaller, not better."

Edited May 5, 2021 by adan

[M2Pete]

Update:

I missed out on the V3 28mm but found a V4 and bit the bullet. I am really liking this lens and the way it renders subjects so far but at two weeks I cannot really critique this lens yet. Happy days of exploration and shooting ahead!

[Stein K S]

6 hours ago, M2Pete said:

Update:

I missed out on the V3 28mm but found a V4 and bit the bullet. I am really liking this lens and the way it renders subjects so far but at two weeks I cannot really critique this lens yet. Happy days of exploration and shooting ahead!

Really nice 👍🏻

[kitreyes]

On 5/5/2021 at 10:00 AM, adan said:

Well, the v.4 is not the v.3 with minor tweaks.

It is substantially smaller and shorter to reduce viewfinder blockage with the built-in 28 framelines in the M4-P and later Ms. The v.3 was designed when it was still assumed an external shoe-mount finder would be used for 28mm lenses.

And the glass shapes inside are quite different (the v.4 has a flat front surface, and gets rid of a rather thick element in the back half of the v.3 lens.)

In terms of the imaging, the v.4 adds both edge and global contrast, and is "transitional" in color between Leitz Canada cyan and Leica Solms/Wetzlar II pink(er).

On the other hand, my experience is that 28mm f/2.8 lenses - once designers figured out the demands of retrofocus formulas - are generally very, very good, whether they be Leica, or Nikon, or Canon or anyone else's. By the 1980s, It was hard to find a "bad" one, even from third-party brands - at least once one got past the "$39.95" store brands.

The excellent Nikkor AI-S 28mm f/2.8 could "pass" for a v.4 Elmarit, 19 times out of 20.

As one of the three pillars of the pre-zoom enthusiasts' kit (28, 50, 135, on a Nikkormat or FTb/AE-1), they got a lot of attention  and TLC from designers.

So we are always talking small differences. Even the 28mm Elmarit-M ASPH is mostly about "smaller, not better."

Edited May 5 by adan

Hi there! I seem to see a lot of the Canadian 28mm Elmarit V4 on eBay. Do you have any experience using older pre-ASPH lenses like this on a modern digital sensor, say the Leica SL2-S?

[adan]

I have very little experience with the v.4, on either film or digital. But other have, and I don't see any problems with the images they submit here.

As with most M wide-angles, it probably benefits substantially from 6-bit coding, or menu selection, to avoid color tints in the edges of color pictures.

[M2Pete]

19 minutes ago, kitreyes said:

Hi there! I seem to see a lot of the Canadian 28mm Elmarit V4 on eBay. Do you have any experience using older pre-ASPH lenses like this on a modern digital sensor, say the Leica SL2-S?

I shoot my Elmarit 28mm v4 (E46, German not Canadian) which I use on my M-D 262 and a Fuji X-T4. Sometimes I boost the contrast in post processing but rarely  have to fiddle with the colors, maybe the highlights. I'm not a pixel peeper so I really can't speak to the resolution but I like what I see when I use it.

[Stayfocused]

On 5/5/2021 at 7:00 AM, adan said:

Well, the v.4 is not the v.3 with minor tweaks.

It is substantially smaller and shorter to reduce viewfinder blockage with the built-in 28 framelines in the M4-P and later Ms. The v.3 was designed when it was still assumed an external shoe-mount finder would be used for 28mm lenses.

And the glass shapes inside are quite different (the v.4 has a flat front surface, and gets rid of a rather thick element in the back half of the v.3 lens.)

In terms of the imaging, the v.4 adds both edge and global contrast, and is "transitional" in color between Leitz Canada cyan and Leica Solms/Wetzlar II pink(er).

On the other hand, my experience is that 28mm f/2.8 lenses - once designers figured out the demands of retrofocus formulas - are generally very, very good, whether they be Leica, or Nikon, or Canon or anyone else's. By the 1980s, It was hard to find a "bad" one, even from third-party brands - at least once one got past the "$39.95" store brands.

The excellent Nikkor AI-S 28mm f/2.8 could "pass" for a v.4 Elmarit, 19 times out of 20.

As one of the three pillars of the pre-zoom enthusiasts' kit (28, 50, 135, on a Nikkormat or FTb/AE-1), they got a lot of attention  and TLC from designers.

So we are always talking small differences. Even the 28mm Elmarit-M ASPH is mostly about "smaller, not better."

Just ordered the v3. How much of the viewfinder is blocked😳

[sarav]

don't worry. I use it often and I never look at the blockage. You can also use it without shade, never had a problem with stray light.

[Stayfocused]

Thanks for responding! I feel great about my purchase now🙏

how do you like the lens overall do you shoot film or digital?