Analog Leica produced in Portugal

[gabrielaszalos]

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Looking at a Youtube video, one of the commenters there claimed to be working at Leica in Portugal on the mechanical cameras, and after being asked (by me) if they are produced there, he claims that all parts of the MP are made in Portugal. Can this be true? It still says "Made In Germany". Please check the highlighted comment in the video 

I am kind of skeptical about his claims, looking at his music channel

Edited May 4, 2021 by gabrielaszalos

[kivis]

That's been going on for years. Most swiss watches have their innards made elsewhere. It's the Global Village, baby. 😁

[andybarton]

The same goes for digital M cameras too. A lot of the sub-assembly is done in their long established factory in Portugal, and the bits are then assembled in Wetzlar.

Portugal is where binoculars and scopes are made too.

 

You might find this article interesting

https://www.fdtimes.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/02/80FDTimes-LEICA-PortugalFactoryTour.pdf

And this

https://www.leica.pt/?lang=en

 

 

 

[gabrielaszalos]

15 minutes ago, andybarton said:

The same goes for digital M cameras too. A lot of the sub-assembly is done in their long established factory in Portugal, and the bits are then assembled in Wetzlar.

Portugal is where binoculars and scopes are made too.

 

You might find this article interesting

https://www.fdtimes.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/02/80FDTimes-LEICA-PortugalFactoryTour.pdf

And this

https://www.leica.pt/?lang=en

 

 

 

Thanks a lot Andy. Those are great links, despite the mistakes: spelling MP as M-P and writing “M-A shutter” under an MP shutter image where the light meter white spot is visible

[andybarton]

I just linked to the stuff - I didn't write it!

[ianman]

1 hour ago, gabrielaszalos said:

Can this be true?

Yes, it’s widely available info. There was an article written about Leica Portugal which mentions this available as PDF.

 

edit: sorry I hadn’t read Andy’s post which refers to the pdf I was writing about.

Edited May 4, 2021 by ianman

[Anbaric]

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Nice video from the M9 days here:

At the beginning you can see how the M9 arrived in the German factory from Portugal, not just a set of parts but already a loosely assembled camera, ready to have the sensor fitted and calibrated. The factory in Portugal deserves a lot more credit. My pocket Ultravids are labelled 'Made in Portugal' (quite discreetly), but most of the other products are 'Made in Germany', at least for marketing purposes. Presumably there are rules about the minimum you have to do in Germany to be allowed to claim it as the country of origin.

[andybarton]

That is the case. EU law prescribes how much needs to be done in order to allow it to be "Made in Germany"

IIRC, the R8 and R9 cameras were completely made in Portugal.

I think that the Porto factory was set up during the (first) Cold War, so that should West Germany ever fall to the east, Leica could still remain in business. This was why the had a lens factory in Canada too.

 

A few years ago, prior to the "Lisbon One Challenge" a few forum members had the factory tour in Porto.

[gabrielaszalos]

Makes sense. It’s about which one sounds better and how you can work around the law, rather than saying exactly where the camera is actually made. Makes sense to me. 

[logan2z]

3 hours ago, gabrielaszalos said:

Looking at a Youtube video, one of the commenters there claimed to be working at Leica in Portugal on the mechanical cameras, and after being asked (by me) if they are produced there, he claims that all parts of the MP are made in Portugal. Can this be true? It still says "Made In Germany". Please check the highlighted comment in the video 

I am kind of skeptical about his claims, looking at his music channel

He spent a lot of time talking about how the packaging of the MP has recently changed to the 'fallaway' outer box, the black inner box with magnetic closure, etc. like the digital cameras.  I'll have to go double check, but I'm almost positive that the M-A I bought in 2017 was packaged exactly like that.

[logan2z]

3 hours ago, gabrielaszalos said:

Thanks a lot Andy. Those are great links, despite the mistakes: spelling MP as M-P and writing “M-A shutter” under an MP shutter image where the light meter white spot is visible

Interesting that the commenter on YouTube said that they only make the MP and 'Leica Mechanic' (whatever that means) in Portugal.  The PDF states that the M-A is also made there.  It would be surprising if the MP and M-A were made in different places.

[adan]

As Andybarton says, Leitz/Leica diversified the factory locations after WW2, because of the possibility of a Soviet invasion.

But it would not have even required that West Germany "fall."

Wetzlar was/is only about 100km/60 miles west of the East/West German border, and the Fulda Gap - a low point through mountains that was expected to be the primary mechanized invasion route. Leica was essentially right in the mouth of the gun barrel.

Soviet tanks could have been in the streets of Wetzlar in a matter of hours, even if an invasion was repelled within days.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fulda_Gap

Edited May 4, 2021 by adan

[digger1914]

11 hours ago, logan2z said:

He spent a lot of time talking about how the packaging of the MP has recently changed to the 'fallaway' outer box, the black inner box with magnetic closure, etc. like the digital cameras.  I'll have to go double check, but I'm almost positive that the M-A I bought in 2017 was packaged exactly like that.

I got my MP in September of 2020 and it did not have the fall away packaging.  I believe that started this year some time..

[Ouroboros]

That video would have been far more entertaining if the cat had knocked it off the table. 
Another YouTube missed opportunity!

[earleygallery]

On 5/4/2021 at 2:17 PM, andybarton said:

The same goes for digital M cameras too. A lot of the sub-assembly is done in their long established factory in Portugal, and the bits are then assembled in Wetzlar.

Portugal is where binoculars and scopes are made too.

 

You might find this article interesting

https://www.fdtimes.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/02/80FDTimes-LEICA-PortugalFactoryTour.pdf

And this

https://www.leica.pt/?lang=en

 

 

 

More illusions shattered. It must be like finding out that Santa isn't real or that there actually isn't a crock of gold at the end of the rainbow.

[pgk]

7 minutes ago, earleygallery said:

More illusions shattered. It must be like finding out that Santa isn't real or that there actually isn't a crock of gold at the end of the rainbow.

According to wiki: "The modern character of Santa Claus was based on traditions surrounding the historical Saint Nicholas (a fourth-century Greek bishop and gift-giver of Myra), the English figure of Father Christmas, and the Dutch figure of Sinterklaas (also based on Saint Nicholas)." So he is a mix of parts from various places too. I'll ignore the bit about him not being real just this once😉.

[willeica]

13 minutes ago, earleygallery said:

More illusions shattered. It must be like finding out that Santa isn't real or that there actually isn't a crock of gold at the end of the rainbow.

I'll show you where the rainbow ends when you come over here, James!  As for the Portugal thing, this is not news. There are EU rules about claims for country of manufacture and I am sure that Leica AG has studied these well. In this globalised world it does not matter where an item is manufactured or put together. What matters is how well it is put together. The 'Made in Germany = Quality' thing belongs to the past. All of the major German auto manufacturers have plants in China and buyers in China and elsewhere in Asia are very happy to buy the output.  When I was young 'Made in Japan'  meant cheap and nasty. Now I see users of other makes of camera expressing concern if their cameras do not have 'Made in Japan' printed on them. When buying products from global companies you have to expect that the product can come from anywhere on the planet.

As for Santy, he does exist. I track him on Norad every year and so it must be true!

William 

[earleygallery]

Of course the 'modern' santa, jolly, fat and wearing a red suit, was created by Coca Cola.

I still don't know how he gets down the chimneys, especially those that are capped off, not to mention all the homes without any chimneys!

Edited May 5, 2021 by earleygallery

[willeica]

36 minutes ago, earleygallery said:

Of course the 'modern' santa, jolly, fat and wearing a red suit, was created by Coca Cola.

I still don't know how he gets down the chimneys, especially those that are capped off, not to mention all the homes without any chimneys!

Norad has a counter, so he must be getting in somewhere. I'm sure he has a Leica or two in his bag very year. Next thing you'll be doubting how he gets all those presents into a bag which fits on a modestly sized sled.

Does anyone from the US know if those 'Made in Portugal' lenses, which were produced for fiscal reasons, are still being sold into your market ? If they have stopped producing them then they might become a future collectible. I can see the future listings at the Leitz Auction saying 'rare Made in Portugal version' with a price premium attached. Every cloud etc.

William

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[logan2z]

36 minutes ago, willeica said:

Does anyone from the US know if those 'Made in Portugal' lenses, which were produced for fiscal reasons, are still being sold into your market ? 

I believe they are...

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/search?N=0&InitialSearch=yes&sts=ma&Ntt=Leica Portugal

 

 

Edited May 5, 2021 by logan2z