My new MP's rewind knob is too tight to pull out

[Jeff23333]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

Hello，

I bought a new MP black paint finish, I found the pull-up rewind button is so tight and hard to pull it out.

Anybody same? Will this situation improve over time?

[Advertisement]

The Leica Q3 is available for pre-order at B&H Photo Video and Adorama

[Ouroboros]

5 hours ago, Jeff23333 said:

....Anybody same? Will this situation improve over time?

Take it back to the dealer, it sounds like it needs attention.

[gabrielaszalos]

I bought a new MP, and the rangefinder was misaligned...

Then I exchanged it for a new MP, and the frame counter broke, the frame spacing was uneven, and I discovered my lens was back focusing.

Then I exchanged that for a 3rd MP, which also has uneven frame spacing (seems to be the norm now with new Leicas, even though Leica themselves claim it's not normal if you ask them) and also scratches my film.

Now I'm probably waiting for a 4th exchange MP. It's the last chance I'm willing to give Leica.

I'm probably going to get a lot of hate for this, but: get your money back while you can In my experience, people who say that their MP/M-A's work well and reliably for many years, are much older from other batches which might've still been ok. I think 2003-2004 batches were likely the best, when Leica was even offering 5 years or warranty.

People will say that a broken analog M is not the norm, but that has not been my experience. And while it's true that on forums you will find all the problems ever, I know multiple people who have had multiple consecutive exchanges and each was broke every time in one way or another.

Just to be clear: I love Leica M. Nothing compares to the experience. I wish I was able to have a new working Leica M, but I'm losing all hope.

Edited April 27, 2021 by gabrielaszalos

[gabrielaszalos]

11 hours ago, Jeff23333 said:

Hello，

I bought a new MP black paint finish, I found the pull-up rewind button is so tight and hard to pull it out.

Anybody same? Will this situation improve over time?

If it helps, it was my experience from the multiple MPs I've owned, that when you pull out the rewind knob, depending at which rotation it is, it might stop and not come out further until you rotate it a bit and find the right angle. There is one specific angle which will block it. If this is what you're referring too I don't think it's a defect (unless it was a defect on all my cameras).

[a.noctilux]

Not a defect.

Gabriel description is spot on 😉.

As long time M user of all types, I don't see this "defect" anymore.

My rewinding from knob of M Leica after hundred times became such a routine that I never bother to "see" this strange behavior.

 

Out of curiosity, I tried with my new M-A, same thing, at one point, I can not raise the knob fully, but turning a bit each way "cured" that.

Tried same thing on one of my old M2 ( thousands of frames through it ) now, same behavior, blocking raising knob at one point.

[250swb]

3 hours ago, a.noctilux said:

Not a defect.

Gabriel description is spot on 😉.

 

Maybe 'spot on' but Gabriel being the Jonah with his cameras I'm not sure that's a resounding recommendation.

[logan2z]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

16 hours ago, gabrielaszalos said:

In my experience, people who say that their MP/M-A's work well and reliably for many years, are much older from other batches which might've still been ok. I think 2003-2004 batches were likely the best, when Leica was even offering 5 years or warranty.

My M-A was manufactured in 2017 and (I almost hate to tempt fate) it has been problem free.  I just developed 8 rolls of film that I shot in the last couple of months and the frame spacing is very consistent. 

I know you're disappointed in the string of problematic MPs that you've received - and you have every right to be - but I don't think that Leica M-As/MPs made after 2003-2004 are all flawed.  Why you're having such a hard time getting a quality example is a bit baffling, however.

[ianman]

40 minutes ago, logan2z said:

I don't think that Leica M-As/MPs made after 2003-2004 are all flawed

You'd think someone might have noticed. What about all the M7s which after all was only fairly recently discontinued?

[logan2z]

22 minutes ago, ianman said:

You'd think someone might have noticed.

Indeed.

[Ouroboros]

17 hours ago, gabrielaszalos said:

I bought a new MP, and the rangefinder was misaligned...

Then I exchanged it for a new MP, and the frame counter broke, the frame spacing was uneven, and I discovered my lens was back focusing.

Then I exchanged that for a 3rd MP, which also has uneven frame spacing (seems to be the norm now with new Leicas, even though Leica themselves claim it's not normal if you ask them) and also scratches my film.

Now I'm probably waiting for a 4th exchange MP. It's the last chance I'm willing to give Leica.

I'm probably going to get a lot of hate for this, but: get your money back while you can In my experience, people who say that their MP/M-A's work well and reliably for many years, are much older from other batches which might've still been ok. I think 2003-2004 batches were likely the best, when Leica was even offering 5 years or warranty.

People will say that a broken analog M is not the norm, but that has not been my experience. And while it's true that on forums you will find all the problems ever, I know multiple people who have had multiple consecutive exchanges and each was broke every time in one way or another.

Just to be clear: I love Leica M. Nothing compares to the experience. I wish I was able to have a new working Leica M, but I'm losing all hope.

I can understand your frustration and disappointment and forgive me for being blunt, but plastering other people's threads with your tale of woe is becoming predictable.  You're still vastly outnumbered by those whose experience with these cameras is contrary to your own.  I do hope you can find some satisfaction eventually with a Leica M.

Edited April 28, 2021 by Ouroboros

[wattsy]

I don't think a tight rewind knob is unusual on a new camera. The OP might try giving his stiff knob a bit of a yank. 😮

[gabrielaszalos]

1 hour ago, Ouroboros said:

I can understand your frustration and disappointment and forgive me for being blunt, but plastering other people's threads with your tale of woe is becoming predictable.  You're still vastly outnumbered by those whose experience with these cameras is contrary to your own.  I do hope you can find some satisfaction eventually with a Leica M.

You are right. It was not a good move and I regretted it. I hope the OP has a good experience. I shouldn’t have posted that. At the same time, I also want it heard, hoping it helps others, which in this case might have not been true since he already made a purchase.

About being vastly outnumbered however, I do not agree with that. Neither you nor I have any proof that this is true, at least not for cameras produced 2019 and onwards. There is quite a lot of proof of the opposite, and plenty of experts opinions on the matter which say the same.

Edited April 28, 2021 by gabrielaszalos

[Ouroboros]

1 hour ago, wattsy said:

I don't think a tight rewind knob is unusual on a new camera. The OP might try giving his stiff knob a bit of a yank. 😮

 
Maybe Jonah should start an ‘I Love Yanking’ thread.  At least all the experts will be in one place ....

[maxfairclough]

22 minutes ago, gabrielaszalos said:

You are right. It was not a good move and I regretted it. I hope the OP has a good experience. I shouldn’t have posted that. At the same time, I also want it heard, hoping it helps others, which in this case might have not been true since he already made a purchase.

About being vastly outnumbered however, I do not agree with that. Neither you nor I have any proof that this is true, at least not for cameras produced 2019 and onwards. There is quite a lot of proof of the opposite, and plenty of experts opinions on the matter which say the same.

Bought my Leica MP in 2020 September. Absolutely flawless.

People who have nothing to complain don't usually verbalise their opinions.

[gabrielaszalos]

53 minutes ago, maxfairclough said:

Bought my Leica MP in 2020 September. Absolutely flawless.

People who have nothing to complain don't usually verbalise their opinions.

Please trust me when I say that I wanted to believe that too. And I partially agree. But when you get to your 3rd exchange MP with consecutive ones being broken after having it checked by multiple people and looked after by various managers at Leica, you start questioning things. Even so, I could consider myself to be super unlucky, but I've seen other cases where multiple exchange cameras were broken (one case with 5 consecutive cameras all broken, another with so far 2 consecutive M-A's broken). I really would not say that this was unlucky. One time, yes, multiple times in a row, no. Especially not when doing this through Leica and them being aware you are on multiple exchanges.

I can understand that some people on this forum don't like me complaining, but I am, for good reason. I don't think it's right. I am happy your MP is working, because I wouldn't wish my experience on anyone.

[ianman]

22 minutes ago, gabrielaszalos said:

I really would not say that this was unlucky. One time, yes, multiple times in a row, no.

I would call getting 2 or 3 faulty cameras extremely unlucky, especially as so few are being made.

We've seen multiple reports that only one person at Leica builds film cameras now, and these reports now date back a few years. I don't doubt you are having issues and indeed you are right to expect a perfectly working camera. But I also find it very strange that a single, highly trained in a specialized job, persons work would be so inconsistent.

[gabrielaszalos]

53 minutes ago, ianman said:

I would call getting 2 or 3 faulty cameras extremely unlucky, especially as so few are being made.

We've seen multiple reports that only one person at Leica builds film cameras now, and these reports now date back a few years. I don't doubt you are having issues and indeed you are right to expect a perfectly working camera. But I also find it very strange that a single, highly trained in a specialized job, persons work would be so inconsistent.

Ian, the fact that one person assembles the camera doesn't make that person responsible for everything. The camera is made of many parts and one single person can not check everything on their own. There are just too many variables. The problem is not with one specific person, it's an organisational and possibly financial issue. Making a camera the quality of an M3 (or whatever the pinnacle was) requires many people involved in this process, including quality checks at multiple points in the manufacturing process which is a huge investment into what is basically a niche today and there is no way it can be profitable. Furthermore, the knowledge and experience is mostly retired (or even dead) today. Simply look back at the certificates of quality that came with older cameras, which contained up to 3 signatures of full names, whereas today's certificates come back with one signature made up of one or two letters.

Lastly, do not ignore the part where I mentioned another incident of 5 consecutive cameras being broke in a row, and also 2 M-As being broke in a row.

Edited April 28, 2021 by gabrielaszalos

[gabrielaszalos]

Here is the example of a certificate on an M3.

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

Edited April 28, 2021 by gabrielaszalos

[Advertisement]

Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[wattsy]

1 hour ago, ianman said:

We've seen multiple reports that only one person at Leica builds film cameras now, and these reports now date back a few years. 

I don't think that has been claimed, Ian. It has been stated somewhere that each individual film camera is put together by a single person but not that only one person is employed to do this in Portugal and Germany. I have written here a few times that there is only one technician (part-time) at Wetzlar for repairing film cameras but that is separate from the production process. I was told about the single repair guy by a well informed individual at Leica UK so I have no reason to doubt it is or was true. Leica may have since trained up additional staff.

[Ouroboros]

1 hour ago, gabrielaszalos said:

I can understand that some people on this forum don't like me complaining

I think most people would agree that you have good reason to complain, as I do, but you seem intent on dominating every thread about  MP/MA cameras with your own personal agenda.  It’s becoming obsessive and not likely to achieve much that’s going to be helpful to you.