Leica and Bolex

[Connie7]

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I realise this may be somewhat off topic but, leaving the Leicina aside, are Bolex cameras not the moving image equivalent of Leica screw cameras in terms of beauty, quality and design? 

Asking for a friend...

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[pfoto]

i think its arriflex

[willeica]

54 minutes ago, Connie7 said:

I realise this may be somewhat off topic but, leaving the Leicina aside, are Bolex cameras not the moving image equivalent of Leica screw cameras in terms of beauty, quality and design? 

Asking for a friend...

Bolex cameras are beautifully made and have magnificent lenses. A friend of mine who teaches film making swears by them. They have magnificent clockwork motors. The Arriflex became an industry standard for professionals, but for small (well smaller) and beautifully made cine cameras Bolex is a good comparison as the Leica of the cine world. Rolleiflex also comes to mine. Alpas were also fitted with lenses made by Kern Switar, the same company that supplied lenses to Bolex Paillard.

http://www.bolexcollector.com/lenses/50kern.html

This is a lovely site with plenty of details 

http://www.bolexcollector.com

The photos below should help any comparison. There were some Kern Switar lenses with this set.

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William

 

 

[luigi bertolotti]

I agree 100%...my experience with film is limited to an honest Kodak Super 8 i got as a Christmas gift at 16...(*). just to discover soon that filmimg wasn't for me (same as video... never made one  with my M 240...🙄) : but when speaking of GEAR, i admit that i am frequently tempted to acquire some Bolex 8mm, because simply I perceive it as a fine piece of optical/mechanical engineering... in a "small format" context (Arriflex ? Looked at some time to time... my rough idea it's that it's comparable to a Bolex 8mm as a Linhof Technika is comparabòe to a Leica... 😉) 

(*) even don't know where it ìs exactly now... somewhere at home, anyyway... only remember it had a zoom lens... 

 

Edited April 18, 2021 by luigi bertolotti

[ironringer]

As a veteran Bolex collector and self-trained service technician for the small 8mm cameras, I agree that Bolex is the best equivalent of the Leica for consumer and "pro-sumer" market cameras. Beautifully made, highest Swiss quality and still serviceable. The Arriflex is more of a high-end professional movie camera, not the same market.

Decades ago I had the opportunity to visit the small remains of the Bolex factory in Yverdon, near the original home base of Bolex Paillard in Sainte Croix. It was fun to "talk Bolex" with oldtimers who still hand assembled 16mm cameras, and had worked at Bolex Paillard in its glory days from the 1950s. I also visited the long-retired R&D director at his home, and saw a wide array of prototype Bolexes; many were never made into products (like an 8mm 3D system). A fascinating company with a history from the 1930s with its founder, a Ukrainian inventor-engineer named Jacques Bogopolsky (later Jacques Bolsey).

My son used my Bolex Rex-4 16m camera (and excellent Kern lenses) to film his first serious film project, that won awards at film festivals in New York and Vienna. Super camera, lovely to look at and use. I wish there were an equivalent Bolex Forum where our Bolex stories could be shared - I have many.

[Connie7]

Thank you all for your thoughts. I have actually been asked by a university colleague to create some visuals for an electronic music art installation he has been commissioned to compose. I have a growing sense it should be 16mm and abstract and the Bolex is becoming a leading contender. Any advice Ironmonger gratefully received. Will, as always, your images tempt..

[Connie7]

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And apologies to Ironringer for my damn autocorrect...

[willeica]

1 hour ago, Connie7 said:

Thank you all for your thoughts. I have actually been asked by a university colleague to create some visuals for an electronic music art installation he has been commissioned to compose. I have a growing sense it should be 16mm and abstract and the Bolex is becoming a leading contender. Any advice Ironmonger gratefully received. Will, as always, your images tempt..

That camera is now in the Darkroom in Dublin where I delivered it on the same day last August that we developed the 'Swiss Photos' FILCA cassette images which went all the way around the world afterwards. They have another Bolex H16 at the Darkroom which came from the Irish Film Base in Temple Bar when it closed down. They have some nice Kern Switar lenses to go with the cameras. When my late father retired in 1981 we bought him a Bolex 8mm from Conns Cameras off Grafton Street. He loved using it particularly to make little cine films of his grandchildren. As far as I can remember his camera had no sound recording facility. I have no idea where that camera is now. I am still using my father's still camera, a Super Baldina.

Is your friend in Ireland ? If he is, I can PM you the details of an outfit in Galway who specialise in cine cameras and accessories.

William

[romualdo]

Would have to agree with Connie's original comment (aesthetically up there with screwmount leicas) - also there are marked similarities with my Alpa camera (was an offshoot of the Pignons S.A. company - Swiss made too) - there is cross over regarding origins here ie.

In the late 1930s, Pignons invited engineer Jacques Bolsky (Bolsey) to design a camera for them - became the Alpa Reflex

About 6 years ago I was given this beautiful Bolex 8 camera PLUS an M8 projector - it was purchased (late 50s) by my partner's recently deceased father who being an electrical engineer, was into high quality equipment. It's still working well - had it serviced (by a technician who had worked with these cameras) soon after I received it. Lens caps still present plus an original Bolex shutter release cable was in the case. The Kern-Paillard lenses are also made by the same company that made the lenses for the Alpa cameras.

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[Connie7]

Thank you all again for this thread. Will, my colleague does indeed work with me here in Ireland. The details of the Galway business would be excellent to have although I suspect a purchase may still have to be made....

[willeica]

53 minutes ago, Connie7 said:

Thank you all again for this thread. Will, my colleague does indeed work with me here in Ireland. The details of the Galway business would be excellent to have although I suspect a purchase may still have to be made....

Will send you a PM later today.

 

William

[Guest Nowhereman]

By coincidence, I've just read a review by Richard Brody in the New Yorker of a remarkable 1973 Indian film shot with a Bolex that is being shown free online from April 28th to May 8th in connection with the fiftieth edition of the New Directors/New Films series, co-sponsored by MOMA and Film at Lincoln Center.

Brody writes that the limited financial for the fils means drove the director to great creativity: Kaul’s bold challenge to cinematic convention has a practical aspect, which is revealed in accounts of the film’s production. “Duvidha” was financed outside the system by a friend of Kaul’s, the artist Akbar Padamsee. His scant funding provided only amateur equipment: just enough 16-mm. film for one take of everything, and wind-up cameras (the venerable Bolex), which can’t be used to record synch sound; his starkly elaborate approach to dialogue, which is entirely dubbed, is an inventive workaround. (Kaul also had access to an optical printer, and he made free use of it, in scenes adorned with extended freeze-frames and double exposures.) 

The link within the quote above has a link to an informative 12 minute video on Bolex cameras. Years ago, I shot several time with a Bolex that belonged to my wife's cousin, a painter who shot some experimental short films with it. It was a dazzling camera, with the, shall we say, "aura" or "soul" or "charismatic" appeal of a Leica IIIg or M3.
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[ironringer]

On 4/18/2021 at 5:23 PM, Connie7 said:

And apologies to Ironringer for my damn autocorrect...

No problem and we all have experience with the bothersome "auto-correct" features on modern devices. In my view the Bolex "hardware" is not an issue - there are plenty of 16mm cameras and lenses around, and they can be serviced to be reliable for years of projects. Similar to a Leica you can tell if they need service by winding and running them; if they sound "dry" or hesitant at slow shutter speeds then they need service, which is not easy to find or inexpensive for any H16 camera. Ideally you can find an H16 Reflex that is still working well, without servicing. The best and most cost-effective models are the later Rex-4 and Rex-5 springwound cameras, which (like earlier models) can also work with electric motor drives for longer sequences. In my experience I found the most useful Kern lenses to be the 16mm and 10mm wide angle (the 10mm Switar is a fine lens), and with the Reflex cameras you can also use quality Kern or Pan-Cinor zoom lenses.

"Software" i.e  film, processing, and editing will be the most costly elements of most projects.  Current overall materials costs work out to about $50 per filmed minute, before scanning and editing costs. Real "film cutting" editing is more difficult, and pretty rare these days.

Like Leica, Bolex made a wide array of equipment and accessories, and most of it is reasonably affordable for serious film makers. A capable 1960s H16 Reflex camera with two Kern lenses, pistol grip, and electric motor drive can be purchased for about $2,500 - $4,000 these days, same cost as a quality digital DSLR. Lovely machines, they look and sound good while delivering excellent results.

[ph.]

I agree with the hagiography above.. In my experience the Leicas always worked even iwhen knocked about and carried around in anorak pockets cross county skiing in Norwegian minus 20C conditions and so did my Bolex 2x8, . The viewfinders of the IIIc and early  Bolexes were similarly small, and dim, but the IIIg and the M3 made framing far easier.

Somewhat late in the Bolex historry Kern Aarau made the standard f 0,9 lens. My summicron f2 could use faster film rather than Kodachome.2x8, so light wa s no problem- As a matter of principle I have stored the Moeller anamorphic "vorsatz" but not used it.The later Bolex K versions maintained the superb  mechanics, but had much improved viewfinders where (rather lkike the M3 ) you could see what was outside the frame-. I presume Paillards demise (badge engineered into Eumig) was caused by the shift to  their modish and  mechanically complicated S-8 cameras as well as their curious and possibley unreliable  multi-projector adventure. At the time I switched to Leicina and gave up on Bolex-

A  small corection to the text above ad Alpa. The factory in Villorbe\Ballaguies bought in lenses from K)noptik ,Angenieux, Spectros etc. in addition to the normal leses from Kern . While Kern Aarau offered a large selection of focal lenghts under  names as Genevar, Switar and Pizar , they did not offeer full frame lenses for Alpa besides the Switar (in several versions). Bolexes were also avalable with Schneider and Angenieux optics.and i presume that due to French customs rules at the time they must have been available with Berthiot optics if not with Hermagis.

p.