How to price used Leica M lenses?

[Peter K]

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Hi,

If this question has been asked already, I apologize in advance.

But I was wondering: Are there any general rule of thumb when prizing used Leica M Lenses? 

Of course, there are dozens of factors affecting the price such as general wear and tear, cosmetic imperfections and, most importantly, anything that will affect the optics. And then, of course, there are special collectors items.

But I find that most Leica users take good care of their equipment. And I am not interested in collectors items. So I am thinking more of well-kept 'standard' and non-rare lenses no matter speed and focal length.

Personally, I always search the internet to see what the same lens of approximately the same age is being sold for. But for a newcomer like me, it can be difficult because of all the many different versions that exist for many of the lenses.

So I was wondering if there is a better and/or more precise method to set a fair price? Maybe some kind of standard depreciation?

Thanks in advance.

- Peter.

[Gelatino]

Law of supply and demand at the end, and brand new price at the beginning, that's my experience. Actually several other factors may interfere, passing trend is one of them.

Edited April 15, 2021 by Gelatino

[earleygallery]

Search for your lens on dealers websites (used gear) or if you want to sell and don't know what price to ask, list it on ebay with a detailed description and lots of good photos and let the buyers decide.

[pippy]

2 hours ago, Peter K said:

...I was wondering: Are there any general rule of thumb when prizing used Leica M Lenses?

......is a better and/or more precise method to set a fair price? Maybe some kind of standard depreciation?

No and No, I'm afraid, Peter. All you can really do is see what the market-price for any lens is at any particular time.

If you are buying then all you can do is ask yourself whether the seller's asking price seems fair. If you are selling then all you can do is ask yourself if your selling price seems fair. There are no rules and no 'method' that I know of which could be applied to the buying and selling of Leitz lenses.

FWIW this, roughly, has been my experience of buying a lens on the used market;

Buy the lens which offers the best possible optical condition, a very good cosmetic condition and for a price which is fair to both parties. Following this route you are most likely (IMX) to recoup the majority your outgoings if, further along the road, you decide to sell-on. Who can tell? if the the current market state is any indication you might even make a profit into the bargain.

Philip.

[Peter K]

Thanks to you all for replying.

That sounds reasonable. Just wanted to make sure before entering the wilderness of buying and selling Leica lenses.

I will make sure to do my homework and search for current market prices first.

Thanks,
- Peter.

[Casey Jefferson]

There are dealer used prices, ebay used prices, and direct deal (fb, forum buy&sell) prices.

Do join Leica buy and sell group on fb to keep an eye on prices, and search on forums like here and fredmiranda.com buy & sell forum which is quite active and well moderated.

And lastly if your lens doesn't get any inquiry, usually the price is a little on the high side, and vice versa - killer deals will be gone very quickly...

[Peter K]

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10 minutes ago, Steven said:

Go to eBay, find Gorlitz's store, look for your lens, see the price he asks, divide it by two, and boom, you're done 😇

Hi Steven,

Cool, I’ll do that 😂

Thanks, Peter.

[Peter K]

25 minutes ago, Casey Jefferson said:

There are dealer used prices, ebay used prices, and direct deal (fb, forum buy&sell) prices.

Do join Leica buy and sell group on fb to keep an eye on prices, and search on forums like here and fredmiranda.com buy & sell forum which is quite active and well moderated.

And lastly if your lens doesn't get any inquiry, usually the price is a little on the high side, and vice versa - killer deals will be gone very quickly...

Hi Casey,

You're right. There are different price categories to be aware of.

Unfortunately, I'm not on FB. But I will definitely search both this forum and fredmiranda.com like you mention.

Thanks,
Peter.

[fisheess]

1 hour ago, Steven said:

Go to eBay, find Gorlitz's store, look for your lens, see the price he asks, divide it by two, and boom, you're done 😇

This seems a bit overkill. I assume you are half joking...

Recently bought a summilux 50 apsh silver from Dec. 2019 for 2600 EUR. The price the seller paid was 3880 EUR. I find my buying price more than fair.

Foto Gorlitz asks for 3100 for a lens in a little bit inferior state, which is also fair considering the manditory 1 year garantie and MwSt they have to pay.

Edited April 16, 2021 by fisheess

[fisheess]

33 minutes ago, Al Brown said:

There is no MwSt. on used lenses with Alex Gorlitz. Also as you know, MwSt. in EU is a deductable affair for a VAT registered company. The fact is that his used prices for premium lenses are definitely at least 25% too steep.

Ok I didn't read the description about the MwSt.. I still think one cannot directly compare prices from the company sellers with those from private sellers. 

What I do is to look at ebay listings that are categorized as "sold items" in the last few months and get a general idea. In the case of summilux 50 apsh. There seems to be very few transactions.

[fisheess]

21 minutes ago, Steven said:

Oh, and if the buyer lives in the EU, I will also deliver it by hand to his door to make sure he pays no import tax and the lens is not lost during shipping. 

Good one! This means I might meet you in person someday 

[fisheess]

26 minutes ago, Steven said:

Half joking I don't know. Maybe 25% joking...

For the kind of lens you bought, they cannot put ridiculous prices because there is a clear market price for that. But for more rare, "collector's" lenses, they are pushing the market in stupid direction, because they kind of control the prices in Europe at least. 

They currently sell a Summilux 35 pre asph V1 (steel rim) for 22K euros. Actually, they have three of them, the only three available on eBay. So they decided on the price. They have one at 22K, one at 19K, and one in very bad condition at 15K. 

In Paris, they is a Leica store that sells one in top condition for 11,250, so half of what Gorlitz asks. Talking with forum friends who recently bought this lens, it seems like the fair price depending on condition ranges between 9 and 12K. Not 22! 

But hey, I'm not going to complain. I own two of these lenses, so now I can pretend to sell one for 22K, since Gorlitz decided to tell the world it's what it costs ! 

Well they do this because some chinese buyers will pay this price eventually (and sell at a higher price to someone either very rich or very stupid). When it comes to collectables, there is no more logic.

[Ouroboros]

Last year I called in at SoPerfect Images to buy some film as I usually do when in Plymouth (I like to do my bit to keep the small independent film dealers in business!). I was chatting with the owner as I was loading a roll in a Yashica T5 that I bought new sometime in the 1990's and he mentioned the ridiculous prices these plastic p&s cameras are selling for now.  I asked him what it was worth as a hypothetical trade-in against a nice black M4-2 with original box in the window and how he would price it, he simply took a selection of three T5's recently sold on Ebay, averaged the price and deducted 20%.  I could have bought the M4-2 for just over £600 plus the T5 in px if I'd wanted it.  I'm not a collector. 

I sold the T5 later elsewhere for considerably more money.

There is no 'Parker's Guide' to used camera gear prices as far as I know, but it's interesting how a lot of the items that dealers are selling is similarly priced.  Maybe they trawl each other's websites. 

If I'm selling stuff, I can't be bothered with Ebay and usually ask for quotes from 4 dealers; MPB, Wex, Peter Walnes and Aperture and will usually take the best offer.  

[a.noctilux]

Just a thought, I can NOT see any logic in prices of Leica lenses or bodies (or other things).

I made my logic for myself and be happy with that.

Prices of things are so variable

In my long trading/using Leitz/Leica, I only encountered lucky/unlucky tradings in either way.

If I was lucky to find what I searched for, I payed the price without thinking of increase/decrease price in future.

 

One example, Summicron-M 35mm IV that I had some units in great shape, sold at about 800-1000€ each ( what I paid for them ! ).

Now I don't care if I can sell for much more than that, even if those are not "collectable" as such.

 

 

[rramesh]

Leica is a luxury product. Like all such products, there is a loss when someone tries to sell it second hand. This ranges from 15-20% after about 6 months, warranty notwithstanding and even if condition is very good. Discount some more if there are cosmetic blemishes (scratches, paint loss etc.). 

Now this will not hold true for limited edition and hard to find lenses, where there could even be a premium above list. 

Research always helps. 

[rnl]

I rely upon "collectors" to acquire, hold and then sell their lenses usually in absolutely mint condition with boxes, cards and instructions - acquired  35 lux, 90 apo, WATES lenses that way usually for less than half retail new price.