luigi bertolotti Posted September 3, 2007 Share #21 Posted September 3, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) Ok... I admit than invented the term "Big Black Plastics" just to have a three words sentence... nothing against material in itself, that can be really well engineered and used. My point was primarly dimensions and global ergonomics : besides this, the hell of electronics functions and the general trends on zooms and AF in DSLR are imho the reasons for M8 can stand as a valid alternative for people beyond the Leicaphile breed (which, incidentally, I'm eager to be a part of) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted September 3, 2007 Posted September 3, 2007 Hi luigi bertolotti, Take a look here Changes in lens production to be announced. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
budrichard Posted September 4, 2007 Share #22 Posted September 4, 2007 At one time I worked as photojournalist for a major Midwestern newspaper. I also did wedding photography on the side. At the time I used two Nikon F's as the M3 was just too slow. Recently my best friends daughter got married and I attended the ceremony and took my own set pf pictures with M6 and M7 using Kodachrome. The Photographers hired for the wedding used Canon Digital. I know of no wedding photographers that use Leica M either film or digital. If you could supply a reference to a wedding photographer that does, please do so. Frankly, I think the Professional market for Leica M is zero and if a current Professional has and/or uses Leica M it is just an addition to his digital equipment that he counts on to make his money. Don't misunderstand me, I love my M Lieca's, but that was a different time than today. If I had to make my living as a photographer today it would be either Canon or Nikon digital for most applications and a larger digital format for studio work if needed. The M8 with its current problems is not for me. I will wait to see how Leica responds to slove the problems. There may never be another digital M if Leica is not financially stable but the product life/cycle of digital is just so short, that if they are profitable, I think they may produce a digital M I would be willing to purchase. Good luck to Leica.-Dick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hankg Posted September 4, 2007 Share #23 Posted September 4, 2007 Frankly, I think the Professional market for Leica M is zero and if a current Professional has and/or uses Leica M it is just an addition to his digital equipment that he counts on to make his money. Well it isn't zero but you have to put the numbers in perspective. Canon alone sold over 2 million DSLR's last year (total digital camera sales for Canon where more then 19 million units) add Nilkon in to the number and you have more then 3 million DSLR's sold in one year. If 3 percent of the sales of Canon/Nikon where to professionals that's more then 90,000 cameras in one year. Even if the percent of Leica's digital sales were the same proportion of total sales as Canon or Nikon -3% of the M8 sales in a great year would be maybe 380 cameras. The RF market is really tiny and even if it doubles or triples it will still remain miniscule compared to the DSLR market. But here on this forum there are wedding, event and corporate photographers who use the camera, some in conjunction with DSLR's for their work. I've shot ads, catalogs and products with it. I'm shooting some work for 2 of the most exclusive cosmetics companies in the world right now with an M8 (they have no interest in the camera I'm using only the results). I know a couple of PJ's who shoot Canon but also have always had a M mount RF with them. RF is never again going to be a mainstream product but it's got it's niche with both consumers and professionals. Leica is not going to compete with Canon or Nikon with the M but it could still experience steady growth and profitability in it's specialized niche if it does the right thing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted September 4, 2007 Share #24 Posted September 4, 2007 Well, I may be an amateur, but I shot about 120 keepers at my nieces wedding, keeping well out of the way of the pro, and the bride's reaction was, well, the pro was good, but yours look fantastic, much more lifelike.... She chose 30 of mine and 6 by the pro for her album - and I thought the pro's were more professional and better than mine, and he shot a couple of 1DSII's but it was the look that decided her...... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
thrid Posted September 4, 2007 Share #25 Posted September 4, 2007 I know of no wedding photographers that use Leica M either film or digital. If you could supply a reference to a wedding photographer that does, please do so. Camera Works: Photo Essay (washingtonpost.com) This guy does, but he's not exactly the norm... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ho_co Posted September 5, 2007 Share #26 Posted September 5, 2007 ... If you could supply a reference to a wedding photographer that does, please do so. ... SeanReid. Again, as P.G. implied, there are wedding photographers and wedding photographers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
peter_n Posted September 5, 2007 Share #27 Posted September 5, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) Camera Works: Photo Essay (washingtonpost.com) This guy does, but he's not exactly the norm... Jeff Ascough has been using Canon digital since the beginning of 2005. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hankg Posted September 5, 2007 Share #28 Posted September 5, 2007 In the end rangefinders are going to always be the choice of the odd few -pro or amateur. DSLR's dominate the market for good reason - they provide the feature set and working experience that is best suited for the vast majority of photographers. If you base your buying decision by how many white lenses you see at a sporting event or what Carier-Bresson or some Magnum photographer used or uses then buy accordingly. You can point to this or that photographer and have your buying decision affirmed. If you just prefer working with the M8 whether you are a pro or an amateur, you really aren't going to give a crap about what other photographers use or whether others consider it an odd choice or not a 'pro' camera. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffascough Posted September 10, 2007 Share #29 Posted September 10, 2007 Jeff Ascough has been using Canon digital since the beginning of 2005. ...and he has just bought an M8.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hankg Posted September 10, 2007 Share #30 Posted September 10, 2007 ...and he has just bought an M8.... Will be looking forward to see what you do with it. Really great work on your web site. The images transcend the genre. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie Roberts Posted September 12, 2007 Share #31 Posted September 12, 2007 ...and he has just bought an M8.... Jeff--that's just fabulous news! I'm hoping you like it as much as I do. And I have to say here, (because folks here may not know) just how much I love your work. (FWIW, I tried to buy Jeff's noctilux from him at one point Still waiting on mine...) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
peter_n Posted September 12, 2007 Share #32 Posted September 12, 2007 ...and he has just bought an M8....LOL Jeff that's just a totally unexpected response! Did you keep your M glass? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffascough Posted September 13, 2007 Share #33 Posted September 13, 2007 Yep...I've also still got my 4 M6TTL's including my fave titanium one. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sean_reid Posted December 6, 2007 Share #34 Posted December 6, 2007 At one time I worked as photojournalist for a major Midwestern newspaper. I also did wedding photography on the side. At the time I used two Nikon F's as the M3 was just too slow. Recently my best friends daughter got married and I attended the ceremony and took my own set pf pictures with M6 and M7 using Kodachrome. The Photographers hired for the wedding used Canon Digital. I know of no wedding photographers that use Leica M either film or digital. If you could supply a reference to a wedding photographer that does, please do so.Frankly, I think the Professional market for Leica M is zero and if a current Professional has and/or uses Leica M it is just an addition to his digital equipment that he counts on to make his money. Don't misunderstand me, I love my M Lieca's, but that was a different time than today. If I had to make my living as a photographer today it would be either Canon or Nikon digital for most applications and a larger digital format for studio work if needed. The M8 with its current problems is not for me. I will wait to see how Leica responds to slove the problems. There may never be another digital M if Leica is not financially stable but the product life/cycle of digital is just so short, that if they are profitable, I think they may produce a digital M I would be willing to purchase. Good luck to Leica.-Dick The M8 is my primary camera body for weddings and various other pro work. I'm in a minority but am not alone. Cheers, Sean Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sean_reid Posted December 6, 2007 Share #35 Posted December 6, 2007 SeanReid. Again, as P.G. implied, there are wedding photographers and wedding photographers. Thank you Howard. <G> The picture below was made with the R-D1 which I started using for weddings in 2004 because there was not yet an M8. Cheers, Sean Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/31643-changes-in-lens-production-to-be-announced/?do=findComment&comment=421002'>More sharing options...
ho_co Posted December 7, 2007 Share #36 Posted December 7, 2007 Sean--Really a super shot! I like the girl at bottom left shooting the same thing; and the camera tilt works very nicely. A great picture to capture the fun and beauty and love of the day. I hope a lot of that stays with the people involved. --HC Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted December 7, 2007 Share #37 Posted December 7, 2007 Ruben, yours is the real point: if Summarits will be excellent performers, and if they'll attenuate the famed backfocusing issue, I think that the Leica Co. can foresee a decent future for itself: a product line based on a prestige camera that has the advantage of being a sort of unique in the market, so can be sold at high price, with a setof lenses of "reasonable" prices : this can be their mainstream market. Then.. they are famous for lenses, and Leicaphiles are just a part of the market they have on target : for them, lenses like the 28/2, the Nocti, the WATE, can go on, with their own pricing and manufacturing/availability schema... the possible problem of a "two quality levels" perception envisioned by ho_co shall not emerge if Summarits will be really good performers (and, mechanically, I do not think they will be worst than their "prestige" brothers): simply, there shall be the perception of "normal" and "extra luminous" lenses, with different costs... after all, Leica owes part of its fame to the Elmar 5 cm 3,5... the Xenon 1,5 was lot more costly...but I think none had the perception of Elmar as a "less quality" lens... and it continued to be sold for lot of years. Just add an "entrance level" digital M9 and they will draw many more customers into the system, who will partly eventually upgrade to the M8/M10 and Noctilux crowd Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wizard Posted December 7, 2007 Share #38 Posted December 7, 2007 Taking a swing back to the original theme of this thread - lens production - we were told at a recent official Leica meeting in Wetzlar that Leica have sold more M-lenses this year than ever before. If "ever before" was meant to include the Fifties and Sixties I am not quite sure, but it at least meant that they sold much more lenses this year than they used to in recent years. No doubt this is due to the M8 being a successful camera, at least judging by Leica standards. So don't draw wrong conclusions, if certain lenses are not readily available right now, that doesn't mean that Leica produces these lenses in low quantities only, it rather means that demand is so relatively high that the production can't meet the current demand. And with the way Leica produces lenses, production can't be doubled or tripled easily. Maybe that's where some of the intended production changes will help. That said, Leica has made significant cuts in their M lens line. According to their actual (German) price list, the Elmar 50 lens is gone as is the Elmarit 90 and the Tri-Elmar 28-35-50. Also, only two chrome lenses remain in the current line-up, the 2/35asph and the 1.4/50asph. All other chrome lenses have been axed, even the Summicron 50 lens and the rather recent Macro-Elmar 90mm lens (both lenses are still available in black though). Andy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddp Posted December 7, 2007 Share #39 Posted December 7, 2007 I know of no wedding photographers that use Leica M either film or digital. If you could supply a reference to a wedding photographer that does, please do so.Frankly, I think the Professional market for Leica M is zero and if a current Professional has and/or uses Leica M it is just an addition to his digital equipment that he counts on to make his money. I still shoot weddings with film and with M bodies when I can. Usually 2 M bodies and a couple of Nikon F5's for flash / rear curtain sync type stuff. I can actually focus faster with the M's in a dark hall than the AF does on the F5's, even with focus assist from an SB800 speedlight. As far as bespoke lens production goes....it seems to make sense. For Leica's high lines optics like the Nocti and various aspherics, it may be a special order type deal. Who knows...maybe you'll be able to get chrome ones....anything for money. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Richardson Posted December 7, 2007 Share #40 Posted December 7, 2007 Just to add to the chorus...there are certainly people still shooting weddings with M cameras. Granted, it is not as many, but they are there. David Oliver is a fantastic Australian photographer who has won a number of national awards for his wedding photography. He uses an MP with the 35/1.4 ASPH, 50 noctilux and 75/1.4. At least he did not long ago when I met him. David Oliver Photography - Personal Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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