M10 rangefinder or focusing not working randomly (Help!)

[LotharZhou]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

I have own my original M10 for 3 years now, since earlier this year, when I took out my M10 from the bag, when I rotate the lens (CV Nokton 40/1,2), the rangefinder doesn't focus,, nothing happens in the focus window, when I turned on the live view, you can see the camera start to focus but no focus peeking info. It happens very randomly but it gets more frequently now. Sometimes the camera heals by itself, but I don't know when this sticky rangefinding issue would happen again.  

Thanks a lot for any help before I send it to Leica.

[LotharZhou]

Found a similar case from this post

 

 

[mdt2]

I thought I was having this issue as well until I realized it was my own fault for periodically covering the Rangefinder Viewing Window with my finger 😡

[Good To Be Retired]

2 hours ago, mdt2 said:

I thought I was having this issue as well until I realized it was my own fault for periodically covering the Rangefinder Viewing Window with my finger 😡

Glad to hear I'm not the only one who's done that

[mdt2]

7 minutes ago, Good To Be Retired said:

Glad to hear I'm not the only one who's done that

LOL.... Ah the joys of rangefinder photography! 😀

[mujk]

Yes, the rangefinder coupling may become sticky so that the rangefinder works only for part of the focusing range. With some lenses you can get a similar effect by turning the lens beyond the locking position when mounting, which often also causes problems in lens detection. Neither of these problems should have any effect on live view/Viso operation, including focus peaking.

Edited December 19, 2020 by mujk

[LotharZhou]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

Merry Christmas to you all! I changed to 28/2A lens and the coupling seems ok so far, maybe it's an lens dependent issue, I am not sure, but the issue definitely exists in my 40/1.2 Nokton.  

[jaapv]

On 12/10/2020 at 2:36 PM, LotharZhou said:

when I turned on the live view, you can see the camera start to focus but no focus peeking info.

Which proves that the problem is not in the rangefinder mechanism but in the lens. Live View streams directly from the sensor, bypassing all mechanical parts. Focus Peaking is based on maximum contrast in the sensor output.

[LotharZhou]

Thanks a lot Jaapv, that's what I was wondering. 

[mujk]

On 12/26/2020 at 9:17 PM, jaapv said:

Which proves that the problem is not in the rangefinder mechanism but in the lens. Live View streams directly from the sensor, bypassing all mechanical parts. Focus Peaking is based on maximum contrast in the sensor output.

Agree. There could e.g. be something that has come loose inside the Nokton. But it may still work in some positions.

Lenses for Leica M are purely mechanical, so you should be able to check out the basic functionality just by turning the control rings with the lens off camera. When turning the focus ring there should be some movement of lens elements. With most M lenses the lens gets longer when focusing towards shorter distances. At the same time, also the cam in the lens mount that couples to the rangefinder mechanism in the camera should move. If this doesn't move in and out when focusing, the rangefinder will not work. Compare with your other lens.

[Dhritiman B]

The rangefinder in my M246 Monochrom has recently started giving me a problem at close focus distances - it only focuses beyond 1.5 metres or so, and the split image just freezes and doesn't move closer than 1.5m even though I'm turning the focus ring all the way. Live View focus works just fine at all distances with peaking and magnification, which means it's not a lens issue. I have tried with a 28 Elmarit, 90 Summicron, and Voigtlander 50 APO and same behaviour across all lenses so it's confirmed that it's a rangefinder issue. Any advice or tips would be much appreciated!

[jaapv]

Have it sorted by Leica or a Leica workshop willing to work on digital bodies. This is a simple mechanical problem. 

[Lee S]

17 hours ago, Dhritiman B said:

The rangefinder in my M246 Monochrom has recently started giving me a problem at close focus distances - it only focuses beyond 1.5 metres or so, and the split image just freezes and doesn't move closer than 1.5m even though I'm turning the focus ring all the way. Live View focus works just fine at all distances with peaking and magnification, which means it's not a lens issue. I have tried with a 28 Elmarit, 90 Summicron, and Voigtlander 50 APO and same behaviour across all lenses so it's confirmed that it's a rangefinder issue. Any advice or tips would be much appreciated!

Where are you based? If in UK send it to these guys, there’s a known issue with stiction of metals on the later Digital M cameras, it causes the rangefinder mechanism to not follow the focus cam on the lens. They are very knowledgeable on this issue. 

Costs around £120 and includes rangefinder calibration. They will have it back to you within a week if UK based.

https://www.cameraworks-uk.com

 

Edited March 12, 2023 by Lee S

[Dhritiman B]

I'm based in India where this kind of expertise is limited. I contacted Leica India who were a bit slow getting back to me, but they're saying it's a rangefinder calibration issue that can only be sorted out in Singapore and will take a while. So it looks like I'll have to use live view until then.

Thanks for the responses! I'm still fairly new to the world of Leica M so I will likely be roaming these forums even more in the future.

[Lee S]

On 3/13/2023 at 4:55 PM, Dhritiman B said:

I'm based in India where this kind of expertise is limited. I contacted Leica India who were a bit slow getting back to me, but they're saying it's a rangefinder calibration issue that can only be sorted out in Singapore and will take a while. So it looks like I'll have to use live view until then.

Thanks for the responses! I'm still fairly new to the world of Leica M so I will likely be roaming these forums even more in the future.

Don’t know how you feel about it but might be cheaper to send to the UK and get it serviced by camera works.
 

Welcome to the forum and sorry you are having issues with the M10, I’ve had mine for many years and it’s been solid but the rangefinder does need some TLC sometimes.

[mujk]

On 3/11/2023 at 6:14 PM, Dhritiman B said:

The rangefinder in my M246 Monochrom has recently started giving me a problem at close focus distances - it only focuses beyond 1.5 metres or so, and the split image just freezes and doesn't move closer than 1.5m even though I'm turning the focus ring all the way. Live View focus works just fine at all distances with peaking and magnification, which means it's not a lens issue. I have tried with a 28 Elmarit, 90 Summicron, and Voigtlander 50 APO and same behaviour across all lenses so it's confirmed that it's a rangefinder issue. Any advice or tips would be much appreciated!

Something in the rangefinder mechanism stops the cam follower from moving all the way "out" (towards the lens) . There are a few things you can check out yourself as long as you are careful and do not use excessive force.

The first is to, with the lens off, gently exercise the spring-loaded cam follower roller, located just inside the top of the camera mount, by pushing it inwards and then releasing it so that it moves out again. After a few times it may get "unstuck" and start moving all the way out to its correct close-focus position. This is a temporary fix.

The other thing to check is that the roller does not touch anything that causes it to jam. If it does, the roller arm has probably been bent (upwards). 

Edited March 15, 2023 by mujk

[Dhritiman B]

On 3/15/2023 at 10:46 PM, Lee S said:

Don’t know how you feel about it but might be cheaper to send to the UK and get it serviced by camera works.

I'd definitely be open to it but the problem would be getting it back from the UK. Customs in India has been an absolute mess since the Covid lockdowns, with shipments from all over the world getting delayed, damaged, or pilfered without any accountability. Even regarding the Singapore solution, I wouldn't be shipping it there because of the same problem - a Leica rep I interact with is travelling to Singapore and offered to carry it on his person to get it fixed!

[Dhritiman B]

On 3/16/2023 at 1:29 AM, mujk said:

Something in the rangefinder mechanism stops the cam follower from moving all the way "out" (towards the lens) . There are a few things you can check out yourself as long as you are careful and do not use excessive force.

The first is to, with the lens off, gently exercise the spring-loaded cam follower roller, located just inside the top of the camera mount, by pushing it inwards and then releasing it so that it moves out again. After a few times it may get "unstuck" and start moving all the way out to its correct close-focus position. This is a temporary fix.

The other thing to check is that the roller does not touch anything that causes it to jam. If it does, the roller arm has probably been bent (upwards).

Thanks for the tip. I did try this and was careful not to apply too much pressure. It didn't seem like the roller was obstructed or jammed, as I pressed it inward the movement was smooth enough. But the problem persists and there's now a tiny movement in the viewfinder window. As I turn my lens toward minimum focus distance, the optics in the window appear to move slightly to the right and then back again into place. So I've left it alone for now. I will keep this in mind for future reference though. Will update on this thread as and when. Thanks!

[stephen.w]

Cameraworks-uk fixed this sticky rangefinder problem on my M10. It's a lubrication issue they've seen on a lot of M10-variant cameras specifically.

As @Lee S  said above, the camera was back and fixed in under a week. I'm glad I didn't send it to Wetzlar.

[Advertisement]

Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[Malabito]

I had this issue on my m10.

If you press the little knob on the lens mount it woudnt go back up. 

Had to send it to leica Germany,  took 3 weeks to be repaired,  (luckily I am in Europe, so shipping was no issue).

The initial quote for repair was quite expensive, like 900 euros, thankfully they said that they will do it for free as a sign of goodwill. 

I had them do a complete clean up of my canera,  and even got rid of some scratches on my rangefinder window, (those i had to pay), camera came back like new.

Edited April 22, 2023 by Malabito