Observations on the demise of the black paint Leica

[Guest BlackBarn]

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10 hours ago, wizard said:

Do you treat your own car like that? I don't think so.

Well......I own an old Land Rover Defender as a workhorse and I’m not too precious with its appearance but I have to say, it treats me slightly worse than I treat it.

[Ambro51]

I LIKE IT!  You’re enjoying “my” world of Photography, as a builder.  It’s pure delight and I wish  You the Best!  I too get that response when I use some of the Replicas I’ve built.••••••• I owned a 1958 Land Rover Series II for a decade and done plenty of tight woods driving. Damn thing never showed a scratch!

Edited July 24, 2020 by Ambro51

[wizard]

vor 9 Stunden schrieb BlackBarn:

... it treats me slightly worse than I treat it.

🙂. I know exactly what you mean. A friend mine sold his Defender (one of the last ones that were made) because he felt mistreated too much. He didn't lose any money in the process though.

[tranquilo67]

Due to vacations I'm arriving late to the party. There are references to black and grey paint as well as nickel, chrome and glossy chrome but have you ever seen something like the whole rangefinder housing like brass? (knobs still in chrome).

I've got the opportunity of having in my hands a couple of well documented export wartime IIIc and both have that yellowish finish, one duller, the other one slightly glossier.

Thanks in advance,

Augusto

[willeica]

29 minutes ago, tranquilo67 said:

Due to vacations I'm arriving late to the party. There are references to black and grey paint as well as nickel, chrome and glossy chrome but have you ever seen something like the whole rangefinder housing like brass? (knobs still in chrome).

I've got the opportunity of having in my hands a couple of well documented export wartime IIIc and both have that yellowish finish, one duller, the other one slightly glossier.

Thanks in advance,

Augusto

Not with a rangefinder, but see post 32 above. Jim Lager thinks that whoever had this was thinking of a re-paint, but then changed their mind when the paint was removed. Anyway, I like it that way. I would not have bought a re-paint.

I am not sure what you mean by yellowish finish on war-time IIIcs. Here are my two grey war-time models (one a IIIcK). Maybe there is a slight yellow there. I also have a chrome war-time IIIc with a red shutter.

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William

[tranquilo67]

Hi William,

Here you have one of them. The other one is pretty much the same color but less glossy. To my eye, both of them look like original.

Interesting, isn't it?

Augusto

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[willeica]

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There were some chrome IIIcKs and they are quite rare. I nearly bought one once, but dropped out of the bidding because its condition did not justify the price that had been reached. This one is chrome as far as I can see, although there are some blue grey tinges on the edges. My two are brass under under the grey paint.

William

[250swb]

1 hour ago, tranquilo67 said:

Hi William,

Here you have one of them. The other one is pretty much the same color but less glossy. To my eye, both of them look like original.

Interesting, isn't it?

Augusto

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Are you saying it's brass or nickel, because it has the warm yellowish look of nickel to me? Nickel is also the 'undercoat' for a chrome top coat so if chroming was hard to do during the war nickel is actually a lot easier.

Edited August 14, 2020 by 250swb

[willeica]

I have a nickel plated I Model A which looks like this and also one that is just brass as the black paint has gone. They look quite different to each other. You could be right about the nickel being an undercoat for chrome. Maybe someone was planning to chrome a grey paint camera and stopped after the ‘undercoat’. This is more likely than a chrome camera losing its chrome. Augusto might have a better idea about this.

William

[250swb]

No I was meaning that nickel is what you put on the brass before the chrome, it is what happens. But this is said to be a WWII camera so I just wondered if Leica stopped at the nickel stage. On the other hand if you strip chrome from a camera you then need to also go through another procedure to strip the nickel before you get down to brass.

[sabears]

We don't know what happened during the decades to this camera ( as all of us know,  belonging to a official gray paint Leica IIIC batch) and now... seemingly nickeled. 

What is sure is that it came out originally  as a gray one, as registered in official books...

[tranquilo67]

Hi all,

I know this was going to be interesting.

Just let me share with you a picture of the other one with the same finish but not so glossy.

It seems like nickel finish but not something stripped down.

Once more, it's interesting to note that both of them were exported though the Spanish Embassy during the war. It's also interesting that I personally own the first one from those exported through that way and it was repainted in black (during or right after the war), but interesting enough it doesn't have any major damage that could lead to the painting work.

So, to me, too much coincidence 3 out of 3 cameras known to have gone that way, that have such a different finish work, and to me once more, they don't seem to have de-chromed.

Best regards,

Augusto

 

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[250swb]

Well a camera that was meant to be painted would never have had the nickel coating so I don't understand how it was 'repainted in black'?

[tranquilo67]

37 minutes ago, 250swb said:

Well a camera that was meant to be painted would never have had the nickel coating so I don't understand how it was 'repainted in black'?

My guess is that there were some samples that were not completely finished or at least not finished in the standard way (chrome or grey). The one in black repaint can be seen in the Ugly duck thread

The alternative is just a coincidence that 3 (the only three that are known at least by me) out of the 38 cameras that took that way have odd finish or have been reworked.

Best regards,

Augusto

Edited August 14, 2020 by tranquilo67

[willeica]

Just to complicate the picture here is my I Model A with nickel finish. This would originally have had black paint and the black paint would presumably have been removed before the nickel finish was supplied. As to why, I have no idea. Maybe someone liked the look or was thinking about chroming the camera. The camera is 92 years old and I only received it 4 or 5 years ago when it was already like this. It looks like it was used with a telephoto (probably a 135) given the swinging mask holder below the viewfinder.

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Collecting Leicas often produces interesting curiosities like this.

William

 

[250swb]

9 hours ago, willeica said:

Just to complicate the picture here is my I Model A with nickel finish. This would originally have had black paint and the black paint would presumably have been removed before the nickel finish was supplied. As to why, I have no idea. Maybe someone liked the look or was thinking about chroming the camera. The camera is 92 years old and I only received it 4 or 5 years ago when it was already like this. It looks like it was used with a telephoto (probably a 135) given the swinging mask holder below the viewfinder.

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

Collecting Leicas often produces interesting curiosities like this.

William

 

Perhaps the answer is that nickel plating can be quickly and easily done at home, I nickel plate brass components in my kitchen. I suppose it could have been a service offered by camera repairers back in the day, the cameras in use would have had hand-made components made for them that would need plating. But they certainly wouldn't be chrome plating in the same workshop.

[willeica]

47 minutes ago, 250swb said:

Perhaps the answer is that nickel plating can be quickly and easily done at home, I nickel plate brass components in my kitchen. I suppose it could have been a service offered by camera repairers back in the day, the cameras in use would have had hand-made components made for them that would need plating. But they certainly wouldn't be chrome plating in the same workshop.

I have yet to ask the Leica Archives about the camera, but I doubt if the nickel plating was done in Wetzlar or Solms. Anything could have happened to the camera during its 92 years of life. The camera is a genuine Leica I Model A from 1928 and has all of its original features other than the black paint.

William