Contemplating on buying a Q2 - Crop Modes?

[Snowman]

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Hello,

Currently I have a X-Pro2 with some primes, but really like the idea of the Q2. My work is a mixture of travel, street, architecture, some product photos.

I like the idea of the 28mm prime for landscape, but also shoot 35mm and 50mm (50mm being my favourite fuji prime). My question is the distortion of both 35 and 50mm, can this be removed in Lightroom, its it that noticeable without removable?

Interested what other users of the Q2 think. To me, it seems like the perfect camera, Leica build, Leica Lens, no fiddling changing lenses and something that will hold its value.

Thanks,

Nick, UK

 

[Leica Guy]

What distortion at 35 and 50 crops are you speaking of? I’m not aware of any noticeable or obvious distortion. The camera applies software correction real time. LR handles the DNG’s seamlessly. No distortion issues for me. 

[nicci78]

There is no distortion.

• 28mm looks like real 28mm
• 35mm crop looks like real 35mm.
• 50mm crop looks like real 50mm.
• 75mm crop looks like real 75mm.

So don't worry. 50mm and 75mm frame lines are really small though.

[jaapv]

I think that the OP means the geometrical rendering of a 28 mm lens in general. The misconception here is that the "distortion" is not caused by ( the focal length of) the lens, but by the perspective, which is in turn controlled by the subject distance. Thus an image from a 28 mm lens cropped to the field of view of a 50 mm lens will be identical to an image taken with a 50 mm lens. DOF is another matter. As the effective sensor format shrinks, DOF will increase. However, the subject distance change will offset the effect to some extent.

[Snowman]

1 hour ago, Leica Guy said:

What distortion at 35 and 50 crops are you speaking of? I’m not aware of any noticeable or obvious distortion. The camera applies software correction real time. LR handles the DNG’s seamlessly. No distortion issues for me. 

Good to know, thanks

[Snowman]

1 hour ago, nicci78 said:

There is no distortion.

• 28mm looks like real 28mm
• 35mm crop looks like real 35mm.
• 50mm crop looks like real 50mm.
• 75mm crop looks like real 75mm.

So don't worry. 50mm and 75mm frame lines are really small though.

Thanks. I hope a firmware update for the Q2 will add a zoom function for crop.

[Snowman]

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1 hour ago, jaapv said:

I think that the OP means the geometrical rendering of a 28 mm lens in general. The misconception here is that the "distortion" is not caused by ( the focal length of) the lens, but by the perspective, which is in turn controlled by the subject distance. Thus an image from a 28 mm lens cropped to the field of view of a 50 mm lens will be identical to an image taken with a 50 mm lens. DOF is another matter. As the effective sensor format shrinks, DOF will increase. However, the subject distance change will offset the effect to some extent.

Thanks for the reply.

[Anakronox]

The biggest difference since you shoot with an APS-C crop sensor camera now is that those 35mm and 50mm primes on Fuji equal 50mm and 75mm on full frame.  The Q2 is full frame.  Just want to make sure you’re aware of this since you won’t get the same reach.  The Q2’s 35mm crop mode is very usable, with the 50mm mode being... okay.  If you shoot it wide open at f/1.7 with the 50mm crop, you’re not going to get the super shallow depth of field like you would with a 50mm f/1.4 lens.  Not even close.  Sure, there will be some okay out of focus elements and the bokeh is nice, but it’s not even close to an actual 50mm prime.  So beware of that.  Also, since the 28mm is a wide angle lens, if you go in super close to your subject there is going to be distortion, as well as when framing your shots from a low or high angle.  Expect distortion outside the center of the frame.  
 

do you shoot a lot in low light?  That’s an entirely different discussion regarding the Q2...

[jaapv]

2 hours ago, Anakronox said:

The biggest difference since you shoot with an APS-C crop sensor camera now is that those 35mm and 50mm primes on Fuji equal 50mm and 75mm on full frame.  The Q2 is full frame.  Just want to make sure you’re aware of this since you won’t get the same reach.  The Q2’s 35mm crop mode is very usable, with the 50mm mode being... okay.  If you shoot it wide open at f/1.7 with the 50mm crop, you’re not going to get the super shallow depth of field like you would with a 50mm f/1.4 lens.  Not even close.  Sure, there will be some okay out of focus elements and the bokeh is nice, but it’s not even close to an actual 50mm prime.  So beware of that.  Also, since the 28mm is a wide angle lens, if you go in super close to your subject there is going to be distortion, as well as when framing your shots from a low or high angle.  Expect distortion outside the center of the frame.  
 

do you shoot a lot in low light?  That’s an entirely different discussion regarding the Q2...

As I pointed out - the distortion is not because of the wideangle lens, but because of the subject distance. So if you crop the "distorted"- by the perspective, not by the lens- image to 50 mm it will be exactly the same as an image from the same distance and from the same point of view  by a 50 mm lens.
The lens speed is  invariable and  unaffected by crop exposure-wise, so that does not enter into the discussion.

[Leica28]

I have not encountered any apparent distortion in my pictures.  I don’t stick my Q2 millimeters away from someone’s face when doing portraits.  I shoot from long distance and crop in LR for isolation.  For landscape, travel, and nature photography, I still have not seen any distortion in my shots.  Perhaps it is my shooting style.  I have played around with 35 & 50mm virtual settings, but prefer shooting full frame at 28mm and cropping as needed in Lightroom.  In any event, after using nearly every camera out there since 1970, I have found this camera to be the best - for me.  Everyone is different and art is a highly individualIzed pursuit.  I would not trade this camera for anything else.  It is small, lightweight, built like a tank, and makes stunningly beautiful imagery.  You are limited only by your imagination with the Q2.  

[Anakronox]

6 hours ago, jaapv said:

As I pointed out - the distortion is not because of the wideangle lens, but because of the subject distance. So if you crop the "distorted"- by the perspective, not by the lens- image to 50 mm it will be exactly the same as an image from the same distance and from the same point of view  by a 50 mm lens.
The lens speed is  invariable and  unaffected by crop exposure-wise, so that does not enter into the discussion.

Of course.  Maybe I wasn’t completely clear with my intent.  I simply meant that if you were to frame with the full 28mm perspective with a head shot or closer to someone’s face or body, you’re going to see distorted features.  You could always back up, frame using the 50mm crop For a headshot and see no issues.  

[jaapv]

5 hours ago, Leica28 said:

I have not encountered any apparent distortion in my pictures.  I don’t stick my Q2 millimeters away from someone’s face when doing portraits.  I shoot from long distance and crop in LR for isolation.  For landscape, travel, and nature photography, I still have not seen any distortion in my shots.  Perhaps it is my shooting style.  I have played around with 35 & 50mm virtual settings, but prefer shooting full frame at 28mm and cropping as needed in Lightroom.  In any event, after using nearly every camera out there since 1970, I have found this camera to be the best - for me.  Everyone is different and art is a highly individualIzed pursuit.  I would not trade this camera for anything else.  It is small, lightweight, built like a tank, and makes stunningly beautiful imagery.  You are limited only by your imagination with the Q2.  

That is just the point. People call it distortion, but it is not. It is just the way things look when one gets close. As for the rest of the "distortion": a lens and sensor in a camera use a different projection than our eye does. We have a curved "sensor" in our retina.

[Snowman]

12 hours ago, Anakronox said:

The biggest difference since you shoot with an APS-C crop sensor camera now is that those 35mm and 50mm primes on Fuji equal 50mm and 75mm on full frame.  The Q2 is full frame.  Just want to make sure you’re aware of this since you won’t get the same reach.  The Q2’s 35mm crop mode is very usable, with the 50mm mode being... okay.  If you shoot it wide open at f/1.7 with the 50mm crop, you’re not going to get the super shallow depth of field like you would with a 50mm f/1.4 lens.  Not even close.  Sure, there will be some okay out of focus elements and the bokeh is nice, but it’s not even close to an actual 50mm prime.  So beware of that.  Also, since the 28mm is a wide angle lens, if you go in super close to your subject there is going to be distortion, as well as when framing your shots from a low or high angle.  Expect distortion outside the center of the frame.  
 

do you shoot a lot in low light?  That’s an entirely different discussion regarding the Q2...

Thanks very much for the explanation here. No, not really I don't shoot in low light, although I will look forward to the IS on the Q2.

[Anakronox]

1 hour ago, Snowman said:

Thanks very much for the explanation here. No, not really I don't shoot in low light, although I will look forward to the IS on the Q2.

The IS is ok for really slow shutter speeds and I leave it disabled as the Q2 has a 28mm lens and my hands are fairly steady.  I was more referring to the high ISO performance of the Q2.  Everyone’s taste is subjective, but I don’t like the noise at 1600 ISO and above.  Best if you were to test it out in a store to see if you like it or not.  Otherwise I have no complaints about image quality - it’s really very good if you stay close to base ISO and the 28mm Summilux lens is fantastic.  

[Snowman]

On 6/24/2020 at 2:18 PM, nicci78 said:

There is no distortion.

• 28mm looks like real 28mm
• 35mm crop looks like real 35mm.
• 50mm crop looks like real 50mm.
• 75mm crop looks like real 75mm.

So don't worry. 50mm and 75mm frame lines are really small though.

I hope that a firmware upgrade would maybe allow a possible zoom option for when 35, 50 or 75mm is activated, in the viewfinder.

[nicci78]

It could be awesome. 
Especially if 35mm crop did not zoom at all. In order to keep out of field view. 
For 50 and 75mm crops, Q2 should zoom into APS-C size in full view.

It should be quite easy to do. Because SL2 is already able to zoom into APS-C crop full view mode. In this mode just lay out the 50 ou 75mm frame lines. 
28 and 35mm frame lines can still be displayed on full 24x36 image. 

[vedivv]

Good thing that distortion/perspective issue is resolved.  Q2 lens certainly has optical distortion that is corrected in camera, which is not an issue for all practical purposes.  

The 50mm and 75mm crop are both very usable, due to the sharp lens and 47MP sensor.  Like many members here, I would prefer to have the option of zooming for the crop mode.  75mm is too small, and it is also one of the reasons that I don't like 75mm on M bodies.  Perhaps Leica is listening and will add this option in the next firmware update.

[T25UFO]

If you think the 75mm crop frame lines are too small, try framing a 90mm on the M10.  Smaller frame than the Q2 at 75mm, but fine once you get used to it.  And you have auto focus to help on the Q2 😂 easy peasy!

[sfphoto]

This website might be helpful for you to understand:

https://www.cremerseele.de/perspektivische-verzerrungen-haben-nichts-mit-der-brennweite-zu-tun/

It is in German, but it is sufficient if you just look at the photos. It makes the point that there is no distortion going from 100mm to 24mm if you maintain the same distance...

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica Q

[Herr Barnack]

On 6/24/2020 at 9:53 PM, Leica28 said:

... I would not trade this camera for anything else.  It is small, lightweight, built like a tank, and makes stunningly beautiful imagery.  You are limited only by your imagination with the Q2.  

What @Leica28 said.

@Snowman Get yourself a Q2.  You won't regret it.

Edited July 8, 2020 by Herr Barnack