Must have Leica lenses for M8?

[hiphopopotamus]

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1 hour ago, otto.f said:

The title of your thread suggests that you’re looking for a lens with a special character....My very personal experience is that I liked the 50 Summilux asph very much on M8, but less so on my M9.

 

1 hour ago, pippy said:

The OP is hoping to spend roughly £2k for two lenses so that sort-of rules-out the 35mm Summicron ASPH or the 50 Summilux ASPH as being one of them.....

Philip.

Thanks again for the replies - you actually have both inadvertently raised an interesting question here for me. I was falling on the side of Elmar/Summarit for my 50, and Summarit for my 35. However, more food for thought it seems that probably requires me to clarify a few more things...

The lenses I have kept to use on my A7ii (or, at least, the ones I regularly reach for and love) are:

• 16mm 2.8 Zenitar fisheye
• Contax Zeiss 50mm 1.4 Planar T*
• Leica (collapsible) Summar 50 f2 (this in screwmount and really just still with me because I like to use it with my Leica IIF on occasion) - don't think I'd like to put it on the M8 due to sensor fears.
• Canon 85mm 1.2L II
• Pentacon preset (15blade) 135mm f2.8

The 16mm comes out of the bag for creative landscapes (which i rarely shoot, however), the other four are almost always people/portrait lenses when I use them - though the Contax gets the most "general" use of that lot. Leaving aside the M8/24mm for now, I would guess that of the lenses listed above approx. 70% of all of the shots I take would be with the Contax 50, 20% with Canon 85L, and the final 10% split between the other three. 

I have recently sold off a Zeiss "Hollywood" Distagon 28mm f2 (in CanonEF mount) and a Canon 35mm f1.4L because, although they are fantastic performers in their own right, I was using them as street lenses and I recently came to the conclusion that they are simply too massive for effective & comfortable street shooting - this one of the big reasons I made the initial jump to Leica M in the first place.

From what remains in my collection, I clearly have a preference for "people" lenses, but was missing some of the wider "street" end, which was why I opted for the 24 Elmarit first.

But from my above comments you will probably note - each of the lenses I have enjoyed tends to have a lot of character, while maintaining a minimum of very good performance; this is why I love them. So ultimately this is my current conundrum: if a lens like the 50 summilux just has a "wow" reputation, I'd probably rather go for that and look to fill out the 35mm another time as and when funds allow.

So my final (famous last words) question is - do the Summarits have the "wow" factor so often associated with Leica lenses? From what I've seen from samples online, they certainly seem to - but I remember similar conversations with people that told me the 50mm Contax Planar 1.7 had the same wow factor as the 1.4 version - and having owned both, it's simply not true.

As the 50mm is more important to me right now (the 35mm on M8 ends up being close to my favoured Contax Planar on A7ii anyway), the choice I think I'm going to decide between for the short term:

~£1500 for used 50mm Summilux 1.4 (slight dust), not 6bit/ASPH

~£1800 for used 35mm Summarit and 50mm Summarit, both mint or very near mint, both 6 bit

Obviously this could be an endless conversation but v interested to hear any strong thoughts on this... and hopefully I'll have come to a decision by the end of the day!

Edited June 3, 2020 by hiphopopotamus

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[a.noctilux]

"~£1800 for used 35mm Summitar and 50mm Summitar, both mint or very near mint, both 6 bit "

I think you mean Summarit-M 35/50, then.

I'd go for them, nice pair

or better yet, maybe another pair 35/75 in Summarit-M f/2.5 of course.

You can use the Summar 5cm on M8, no danger at all, I use this nice lenses (I have two one coated &another not) on my M (digital or film) for decades.

Edited June 3, 2020 by a.noctilux

[pippy]

32 minutes ago, hiphopopotamus said:

...Leica (collapsible) Summar 50 f2......don't think I'd like to put it on the M8 due to sensor fears.

 

~£1500 for used 50mm Summilux 1.4 (slight dust), not 6bit

~£1800 for used 35mm Summitar and 50mm Summitar, both mint or very near mint, both 6 bit

First-off there's absolutely no reason not to use the Summar on the M8. The tube is NOT long enough to touch anything at the back of the body. The only thing which is always advised is to mount and dismount the lens in the extended state. This is not for fears of damage to the shutter but in case the tube knocks anything on the way in. Once the lens is mounted it is perfectly safe to collapse the lens. The Summar is also a good performer even today and has loads of character so my advice (FWIW) would be to pick up a LTM to M adapter for 50mm / 75mm lenses (it brings up the correct framelines) and try out the Summar before discarding the idea.

This is the brand I bought for use with my own Summar!

https://mygobe.com/uk/gobe-lens-adapter-m39-mount-lens-to-leica-m-mount-camera-body-50-75mm-frame-lines.html?kk=a4c62ee-16fba38fb94-5827d&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIqpei09jl6QIVROvtCh3MlQ-9EAQYBSABEgIVOPD_BwE

Philip.

EDIT : I see Arnaud was also reassuring you as I was typing the above!

And I forgot to answer your question. I, too, would choose the pair of Summarits. The older Summilux is a gorgeous lens but, well, IMO you would only really get the benefit when shooting at f1.4. Stopped down at all then you would be better off with a Mandler-era Summicron...

..."...and that's how the fight started..."...

Edited June 3, 2020 by pippy

[hiphopopotamus]

1 minute ago, a.noctilux said:

"~£1800 for used 35mm Summitar and 50mm Summitar, both mint or very near mint, both 6 bit "

I think you mean Summarit-M 35/50, then.

I'd go for them, nice pair

or better yet, maybe another pair 35/75 in Summarit-M f/2.5 of course.

Yes! sorry - still getting my head around these naming conventions!! Editing now, thanks for pointing out. 

excellent, thanks for your thoughts - interested why you think 35/75 the better pairing (actually comes in cheaper than the 35/50, from current availability)

[pgk]

The Summarits are fairly 'conventional' designs although I think that they may make limited use of aspheric surfaces. I had both the 35 and 50 but have moved over and use Summiluxes now (thanks to trading up - its rare to lose money on M lenses and more likely they give a return). The Summarits though were nice performers, perhaps without the absolute bite of their more expensive current relatives. The problem is that 'character' is an elusive property and what it means to some it does not mean to others. I doubt that you would regret buying a pair of Summarits, but then again I doubt that you would regret the Summilux. Just remember though that the 50 Summilux can be tricky to focus on the M8 wide open. Personally, I would only buy a fast lens if I intended to use its speed (which I do).

[hiphopopotamus]

Thank you all. This is a tremendous result. It appears I already have a workable 50mm Leica for the M8 then! 

With that in place, I think I'm going to lean on the collective wisdom here and pick up the 6bit 35 and 75mm Summarits that are currently available online at good prices.

It also leaves the door open for me to properly put in the time to think about (and to save for) a truly wonderful 50 for the M system.

Thanks again for the input, it has been extremely valuable.

[Arrow]

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The Leica glass I had used with the M8 initially, were the Elmar 24 3.8 and the Summicron 50. I did add a Zeiss Biogon 50/2 ZM. The Biogon sits on the M8 up until today. The reason being the Zeiss coating. The colours are true strait out of the camera. Leica Glass produced a yellowish tinge. 

Edited June 3, 2020 by Arrow

[pippy]

1 hour ago, hiphopopotamus said:

Thank you all. This is a tremendous result. It appears I already have a workable 50mm Leica for the M8 then!...

Stating the obvious, I know, but one upside of the 1.3x crop-factor of the M8 is that you will be utilising the greatest strength of the Summar which is its overall general sharpness - especially in the centre - the edges being, in effect, cropped-out.

He's not everyone's cup of tea but good ol' Mr. Rockwell has posted a review of the Summar. I read it when I was considering using my Summar on my own 8 and I think you will find it both entertaining and reassuring in equal measure;

https://www.kenrockwell.com/leica/50mm-f2-summar.htm

Philip.

Edited June 3, 2020 by pippy

[farnz]

54 minutes ago, Arrow said:

Leica Glass produced a yellowish tinge.

Were you using a UV/IR (blocking) filter?  Without the filter to counteract the weak IR blocking filter over the sensor, quite often M8 pictures of black fabric will appear magenta and green foliage will have a yellowish tint.

Pete.

Edited June 3, 2020 by farnz

[Arrow]

1 hour ago, farnz said:

Were you using a UV/IR (blocking) filter?  Without the filter to counteract the weak IR blocking filter over the sensor, quite often M8 pictures of black fabric will appear magenta and green foliage will have a yellowish tint.

Pete.

Hello Pete,

I was well aware of the IR filter issue of the M8. Who was not 😁 Yes, I used IR cut filters. The yellowish tinge refers to the overall appearance.

Maybe, there is a difference using coded lenses. My Leica lenses were not coded. However, the Zeiss coating produced better results. 

Cheers 😊

[otto.f]

6 hours ago, hiphopopotamus said:

do the Summarits have the "wow" factor so often associated with Leica lenses

No, they are very good allround lenses for a good price. The 75 is probably the most special. But it’s not that you cannot find this quality in Zeiss for instance.

Edited June 3, 2020 by otto.f

[tommonego@gmail.com]

I use a 35 Summicron, 25 Canon (24mm Leica lenses), then every once in a while a 50 Summicron V1 and a 90 Elmarit.

25 Canon on M8

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[tommonego@gmail.com]

Again 25 Canon M8 R72 filter for infrared

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[hiphopopotamus]

Currently have an almost new 75mm 2.4 winging its way to me - was about to pull the trigger on a nice copy of the 2.5, but spotted this 2.4 version was available from a UK Leica shop for less than 20% more. With the hood included, closer focus, and a year long warranty (as opposed to 6months with the 2.5) I decided it was worth the premium.

Will have a play with the 75 and 50summar before settling on the 35 order. 

Thanks again all

 

[wda]

.... Or a 28mm.

[hiphopopotamus]

1 minute ago, wda said:

.... Or a 28mm.

Haha - with a 24mm elmarit in hand I cant justify a 28...

(says the addict)

[pippy]

7 minutes ago, wda said:

.... Or a 28mm.

As I was typing the OP beat me to it!

Excellent catch getting the 2.4 for little more than the 2.5. I was fortunate in that the hood and caps were included with my 75mm f2.5 but not so fortunate with the 90mm f2.5 where I had to source them separately which adds quite a bit, percentage-wise, to the purchase price.

Philip.

Edited June 4, 2020 by pippy

[pgk]

1 hour ago, hiphopopotamus said:

Currently have an almost new 75mm 2.4 winging its way to me

I was loaned a 75/2.5 when I had an M8 - it was a great little lens and well worthy of it maker. I'm sure that you will enjoy it. Do keep your eyes open for a matching 35 - they can go for very reasonable prices. 

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[tom.w.bn]

Am 3.6.2020 um 15:57 schrieb Arrow:

The Leica glass I had used with the M8 initially, were the Elmar 24 3.8 and the Summicron 50. I did add a Zeiss Biogon 50/2 ZM. The Biogon sits on the M8 up until today. The reason being the Zeiss coating. The colours are true strait out of the camera. Leica Glass produced a yellowish tinge. 

Do you mean the Biogon 35/2 or the Planar 50/2 ?

I used both lenses on the M8 back then and especially the Biogon 35 with IR/Cut filter was really good.

[Arrow]

On 6/6/2020 at 1:22 PM, tom.w.bn said:

Do you mean the Biogon 35/2 or the Planar 50/2 ?

I used both lenses on the M8 back then and especially the Biogon 35 with IR/Cut filter was really good.

It is the Biogon 35/2. Freudian slip. I must have been thinking of the crop factor  50mm wise, I went for the Sonnar 50. Also a pretty good and special lens

Edited June 7, 2020 by Arrow