Searching for a LEICA-R bellows 16880 or equivalent

[wlaidlaw]

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It is simply supply and demand that leads to the price differential. By the time the R8 and 9 plus ROM lenses came along, you could buy the very effective 100mm/f2.8 APO Macro-Elmarit for those cameras with the specially designed ELPRO to go with it. This really supplanted much of the requirement for a bellows and I would guess that 16880/BR-2 bellows sales were pretty low. A lot of folk will have bought the earlier bellows, either Leica 16860 or Novoflex R3 to go with the earlier 100mm/f4 Macro-Elmar, which needed a bellows to get the best from it. 

Wilson

[eilert anders]

I have the original Leica bellows-R (catalogue number 16860), and find it an excellent device for close-up photography.  I use it with the 100mm Macro Elmar short mount lens and the 65mm f3.5 Elmar visoflex lens.  They are both excellent.  The 100 is good for small objects and provides good "escape" distance for shy animals.  The 65 is excellent for copy work, such as pictures, maps, etc..  The bellows has a very valuable feature in that it can allow the rotation of the camera to enable vertical and horizontal formating.  This has to be used to be appreciated.  It also has a focusing rack, so that you can set the focus on a set magnification, and then move the whole bellows and attached camera to achieve focus, something that also has to experienced to be appreciated.  I use the bellows exclusively when doing photography on the Leica copy stand, even though I have the 100mm f2.8 APO Macro Elmarit-R and 60mm f2.8 Macro Elmarit-R lenses.

The comment that was offered above about the bellows being a flimsy device is not accurate.  It is very robust.  My only complaint is that it does not have a focus locking capability.  At extreme extension the bellows has a tendency to retract, and thus lose accurate focus.  The opposite is true when mounted vertically, where the weight of the lens has a tendency to extend the bellows, and thus lose focus.  The irony is that the focusing rack has a locking capability!  The competition, such as Nikon with the PB-4 bellows, have a locking focus capability.  I assume the later Leica Novoflex bellows has this feature.  I have the leica extension rings, and find them awkward to use.  Once I acquired the bellows unit, I never used them again for general macro photography, but do use them on the 400mm f6.8 Telyt lens, which by the way, is an excellent close focus lens!

[PetersPhotoChannel]

@eilert anders

Thank you very much for this very valuable information. Not only are the 16860 bellows cheaper and available, but even seem to have advantages over others (vertical/horizontal formating & focus on set magnification). I'd go for the 100mm f4 Elmar, for the use you describe for it, that's for me (shy animals).

And as I got the extension tubes already I will definitely try them out on my 400mm Telyt f6.8. Can't wait to see some results from that combo.

Is there anything else I'll need, or is it just the lens (100mm f4 Elmar) plus the bellows?
No other parts required, like adapters etc.?

Thanks again to all for the inputs in this thread 🙂

Take care - Peter

P.S.: If anybody else is curious about the 400m Telyt f6.8 - that is a very good tele lens at an incredible price. They go for as little as US$ 200 to US$ 400 on eBay. If somebody would like to see one or two images taken with it, just scroll half way down on this page.

 

 

 

 

Edited May 8, 2020 by PetersPhotoChannel
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[dkCambridgeshire]

1 hour ago, PetersPhotoChannel said:

@eilert anders

Thank you very much for this very valuable information. Not only are the 16860 bellows cheaper and available, but even seem to have advantages over others (vertical/horizontal formating & focus on set magnification). I'd go for the 100mm f4 Elmar, for the use you describe for it, that's for me (shy animals).

And as I got the extension tubes already I will definitely try them out on my 400mm Telyt f6.8. Can't wait to see some results from that combo.

Is there anything else I'll need, or is it just the lens (100mm f4 Elmar) plus the bellows?
No other parts required, like adapters etc.?

Thanks again to all for the inputs in this thread 🙂

Take care - Peter

P.S.: If anybody else is curious about the 400m Telyt f6.8 - that is a very good tele lens at an incredible price. They go for as little as US$ 200 to US$ 400 on eBay. If somebody would like to see one or two images taken with it, just scroll half way down on this page.

 

 

 

 

The Telyt R 400/6.8 is a good lens - a 2 element achromat. The Novoflex 400mm 'Noflexar T' is a better lens than the 400mm Telyt - it's a 3 element achromat made by Staeble Optic Altenstadt near Schongau and can be purchased for less than $100. Here is mine coupled to a Leitz R bellows, a Leitz APO 2x extender and a Leica SL 601 https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/300726-mating-common-blue-damselflies/?do=findComment&comment=3806858  The R bellows and 2x extender provides more 'reach'  for close-up imaging from a distance and also enables easier focusing.

dunk 

 

Edited May 8, 2020 by dkCambridgeshire

[pgk]

9 hours ago, eilert anders said:

I have the original Leica bellows-R (catalogue number 16860), and find it an excellent device for close-up photography.

The comment that was offered above about the bellows being a flimsy device is not accurate.  It is very robust.

Well, 16860 is not flimsy, but it certainly can have play in it, and the lack of being able to lock it doesn't help. I had two and both were the same - the reason I went for the extension tubes was because they are far more solid and robust. I couldn't find any way to adjust for the play either unfortunately.

[PetersPhotoChannel]

@dkCambridgeshire

I went for the NOVOFLEX 400mm f5.6 and found one that has a 2x extender and a bellows mounted on it:

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Would that one be o.k?

It has a LEICA R 3cam mount, so I could use right away with the LEICA R to SL adapter on the SL2.

They want a bit under US$ 400 for that combo.
 

[PetersPhotoChannel]

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[wlaidlaw]

Peter, 

I think the bellows above is part of the Novoflex PIGRIFF system. 

Wilson

 

[PetersPhotoChannel]

Giving it a long thought and looking at my very similar 400mm f4 (compared with the 400mm f5.6) I remembered that the main reasons to switch from FUJI Medium Format to LEICA were about size, weight, esthetics, simplicity and design. And, of course,  the rendering of the images. Exploring the bellows theme seemed attractive until looking deeper into the matter. Additional lenses required, also adapters and whatnot . . . too much for me right now.

I’ll stick to my 100mm apo macro f2.8, which - thanks to this thread - can now be equipped with the matching ELPRO. Furthermore I do have the extension tubes now (thanks again to this thread) and the 280mm and 400mm f4‘s to go with them.

I do seriously suffer from GAS, but have reached the point where I’d like to keep it simple.

Thanks to everyone here that helped me with their comments.

Peter

[jimbn]

There is a special intermediate ring for the 560 and 400 mm lenses. Leica 14182 60mm. The ring is placed between the objective head and the intermediate piece 11905, which is the same for both lenses. For the 400mm, the close setting is between 353-226 cm. Smallest object field 8x12 cm. The whole construction becomes almost unmanageable by moving the center of gravity further forward, especially with the 560 lens.