onasj Posted January 24, 2020 Share #1 Posted January 24, 2020 (edited) Advertisement (gone after registration) Received my M10M tonight. In a nutshell, it's incredible—it handles beautifully, it's stunning, it works well as expected (except some of the image reviewing can suddenly slow down with randomness that makes me think it's not just the file size),, the frame rate shot continuous high speed seems at least as fast as my M10-P, and perhaps most amazingly, the M10M actually achieves about 2 full stops better high-ISO performance than my M10-P. I think ISO 50,000 on the M10M is usable (!), and probably more usable than color images at ISO 12,500 on the M10-P in my opinion. One odd potential bug I've noticed, in addition to some seemingly random lengthy image loading times: the ISO values of photos I shoot with the M10M appear fine when reviewing images in the M10M, but the DNG files transferred via the Leica Fotos app seem to show no ISO value, either in the Fotos app (shows ISO 0) or in an EXIF viewer on my iPhone or on my Mac. Hopefully something that can be fixed with either a FOTOS update or a M10M firmware update. Edited January 24, 2020 by onasj Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted January 24, 2020 Posted January 24, 2020 Hi onasj, Take a look here M10 Monochrome missing ISO value in EXIF data?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
SrMi Posted January 24, 2020 Share #2 Posted January 24, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, onasj said: Received my M10M tonight. In a nutshell, it's incredible—it handles beautifully, it's stunning, it works well as expected (except some of the image reviewing can suddenly slow down with randomness that makes me think it's not just the file size),, the frame rate shot continuous high speed seems at least as fast as my M10-P, and perhaps most amazingly, the M10M actually achieves about 2 full stops better high-ISO performance than my M10-P. I think ISO 50,000 on the M10M is usable (!), and probably more usable than color images at ISO 12,500 on the M10-P in my opinion. One odd potential bug I've noticed, in addition to some seemingly random lengthy image loading times: the ISO values of photos I shoot with the M10M appear fine when reviewing images in the M10M, but the DNG files transferred via the Leica Fotos app seem to show no ISO value, either in the Fotos app (shows ISO 0) or in an EXIF viewer on my iPhone or on my Mac. Hopefully something that can be fixed with either a FOTOS update or a M10M firmware update. I do not use Fotos app for transferring files. All M10M images imported to LR from an SD card have proper EXIF values. Can you share a DNG file that has damaged EXIF data? What kind of SD card are you using? I got my M10M today, and went shooting in the evening. Did not notice any lengthy image loading times. Edited January 24, 2020 by SrMi Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
onasj Posted January 24, 2020 Author Share #3 Posted January 24, 2020 The odd long-write issue appears to be caused by my use of Sony's flagship TOUGH 128 GB 300/299 MB/s read/write UHSII SDXC card. When I switched to an old 256 GB Sandisk 95 MB/s UHS-I SD card, the problem went away. When I return home I'll test if this particular Sony TOUGH SD card is at fault, or if the whole class is buggy with the M10M. If the latter, it would be great if Leica could fix the issue in their next firmware, as I have found the Sony TOUGH SD cards to be excellent on other cameras, and they are designed for durability. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SrMi Posted January 24, 2020 Share #4 Posted January 24, 2020 1 hour ago, onasj said: The odd long-write issue appears to be caused by my use of Sony's flagship TOUGH 128 GB 300/299 MB/s read/write UHSII SDXC card. When I switched to an old 256 GB Sandisk 95 MB/s UHS-I SD card, the problem went away. When I return home I'll test if this particular Sony TOUGH SD card is at fault, or if the whole class is buggy with the M10M. If the latter, it would be great if Leica could fix the issue in their next firmware, as I have found the Sony TOUGH SD cards to be excellent on other cameras, and they are designed for durability. I have used TOUGH 32 GB card without issues. Maybe it is only a problem with the 128 GB version, or it's a problem with your card. Let us know if the problem appears with your other 128Gb cards as well. I had no issues with Lexar 128Gb 2000x card. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
icon80 Posted January 25, 2020 Share #5 Posted January 25, 2020 10 hours ago, SrMi said: I have used TOUGH 32 GB card without issues. Maybe it is only a problem with the 128 GB version, or it's a problem with your card. Let us know if the problem appears with your other 128Gb cards as well. I had no issues with Lexar 128Gb 2000x card. I have just received my M10M and bought a new Sony Tough 64Gb card. Very long write times and occasional failure to write. No problem with Sandisk cards. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
onasj Posted January 25, 2020 Author Share #6 Posted January 25, 2020 I tried a second Sony TOUGH 128 MB SD card with my M10M and it seemed fine. But given icon80's observation, I suspect these cards, and possibly other, might require a firmware update from Leica to be reliable. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SrMi Posted January 25, 2020 Share #7 Posted January 25, 2020 Advertisement (gone after registration) Please report the issue with the Sony TOUGH cards to Leica. Thanks! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaemono Posted January 25, 2020 Share #8 Posted January 25, 2020 I highly recommend the SanDisk Extreme PRO SDXC 300 MB/s., UHS-II, Class 10, U3 with the M10M. The writing speed is lightening fast with it. I don't experience the slowness with the M10M that others have reported at all. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/305687-m10-monochrome-missing-iso-value-in-exif-data/?do=findComment&comment=3898926'>More sharing options...
digitalfx Posted January 25, 2020 Share #9 Posted January 25, 2020 could be wrong, but I don't think the M10M has UHS-II support...so the Sandisk UHS-I cards will be just as fast. You would see a gain on the backend copying to a PC assuming your SD reader supports UHS-II, but in camera there will be no advantage at all. Im using older cards (Sandisk Extreme Pro and Lexar) and getting exceptional results Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaemono Posted January 25, 2020 Share #10 Posted January 25, 2020 I was told at the store where I picked up the M10M yesterday to use an UHS-II card. I didn't even question it as I was trying to recover from having spent so much money on a camera that doesn't even take pictures in color. 😂 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
digitalfx Posted January 25, 2020 Share #11 Posted January 25, 2020 yea, well generally the guys at the store know less than we do. Ive seen nothing to convince me otherwise...none of the previous M10s had a UHS-II port, and if that is the case you would gain no advantage with that card other than on the transfer side assuming you use the correct reader. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SrMi Posted January 26, 2020 Share #12 Posted January 26, 2020 (edited) 4 hours ago, digitalfx said: yea, well generally the guys at the store know less than we do. Ive seen nothing to convince me otherwise...none of the previous M10s had a UHS-II port, and if that is the case you would gain no advantage with that card other than on the transfer side assuming you use the correct reader. There is still the advantage of transferring files faster to the computer with UHS-II. That advantage may vaporize, since there is a significant speed difference between SD card readers. Edited January 26, 2020 by SrMi Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
XRayGuy Posted February 4, 2020 Share #13 Posted February 4, 2020 On 1/24/2020 at 9:23 AM, onasj said: The odd long-write issue appears to be caused by my use of Sony's flagship TOUGH 128 GB 300/299 MB/s read/write UHSII SDXC card. When I switched to an old 256 GB Sandisk 95 MB/s UHS-I SD card, the problem went away. When I return home I'll test if this particular Sony TOUGH SD card is at fault, or if the whole class is buggy with the M10M. If the latter, it would be great if Leica could fix the issue in their next firmware, as I have found the Sony TOUGH SD cards to be excellent on other cameras, and they are designed for durability. I just wanted to chime in and say that I experienced the exact same issues as onasj did using a 128GB UHS-II Sony TOUGH SD card. I think you are correct that this is a problem with the M10 Monochrom and this specific card. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SrMi Posted February 4, 2020 Share #14 Posted February 4, 2020 (edited) Leica M10M technical specification says: SD cards up to 2 GB/SDHC cards up to 32 GB/SDXC cards up to 2 TB Since Sony TOUGH cards are SDHC cards, only SDHC cards up to 32 GB are supported. Sony TOUGH cards 128GB are therefore not supported. Edited February 4, 2020 by SrMi Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
XRayGuy Posted February 4, 2020 Share #15 Posted February 4, 2020 (edited) 32 minutes ago, SrMi said: Leica M10M technical specification says: SD cards up to 2 GB/SDHC cards up to 32 GB/SDXC cards up to 2 TB Since Sony TOUGH cards are SDHC cards, only SDHC cards up to 32 GB are supported. Sony TOUGH cards 128GB are therefore not supported. I had wondered about that initially, but the UHS-II Sony TOUGH cards are definitely SDXC. It’s printed right on the card. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Edited February 4, 2020 by XRayGuy Added picture of card to demonstrate it is SDXC. Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/305687-m10-monochrome-missing-iso-value-in-exif-data/?do=findComment&comment=3905680'>More sharing options...
SrMi Posted February 4, 2020 Share #16 Posted February 4, 2020 (edited) 35 minutes ago, XRayGuy said: I had wondered about that initially, but the UHS-II Sony TOUGH cards are definitely SDXC. It’s printed right on the card. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Thanks for the correction. The Sony TOUGH 32 Gb cards are SDHC (just checked mine) so I assumed incorrectly that all of them are SDHC. Edited February 4, 2020 by SrMi Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bo-Sixten Posted February 4, 2020 Share #17 Posted February 4, 2020 (edited) The Lexar 1000x SDXC II 150Mb/s 128GB does NOT give ISO values on M10M. It works fine with my M10. No writing speed problems though. Edited February 4, 2020 by Bo-Sixten Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SrMi Posted February 4, 2020 Share #18 Posted February 4, 2020 No issues with Lexar 2000x 128Gb SDXC card. I assume that everyone has updated their firmware to 2.12.8.0, right? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bo-Sixten Posted February 4, 2020 Share #19 Posted February 4, 2020 Yes. Done that. 2.12.8.0 it is.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
onasj Posted February 4, 2020 Author Share #20 Posted February 4, 2020 I've since confirmed that the M10 Monochrom is NOT currently compatible with at least some Sony TOUGH 128 GB 300 MB/s SD cards. Writing and reading will sporadically and frequently take much longer than usual. It's stochastic, so you need to use the camera for at least a dozen shots or so, power cycling, shooting, and reviewing images, before you can be sure to see the bug, but it's also very clear when the bug is present. I've tried three Sony TOUGH 128 GB cards now and all three show the bug. Those were my favorite SD cards so hopefully Leica issues a firmware update that can fix the issue, assuming it is software rather than physical fit incompatibilities (the Sony TOUGH cards can fit a bit tighter than most cards into SD card slots). [Mods, please feel free to merge this thread with the other one, and retitle it "M10 Monochrom SD card issues" or the like. Thank you!] Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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