Original Black Paint Posted December 15, 2019 Share #1 Posted December 15, 2019 Advertisement (gone after registration) Hi, did Leica ever produce M4s without serial numbers on top? Trying to find out about this particular M4. Ever see anything like this before? Thank You Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/304439-no-serial-numbers-m4/?do=findComment&comment=3873555'>More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted December 15, 2019 Posted December 15, 2019 Hi Original Black Paint, Take a look here No serial numbers? M4. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
ianman Posted December 15, 2019 Share #2 Posted December 15, 2019 I've seen top plates without numbers for sale. Maybe a previous owner changed it for some reason. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Original Black Paint Posted December 15, 2019 Author Share #3 Posted December 15, 2019 2 minutes ago, ianman said: I've seen top plates without numbers for sale. Maybe a previous owner changed it for some reason. Thanks good to know. Never knew this,thanks. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Geschlecht Posted December 15, 2019 Share #4 Posted December 15, 2019 (edited) Hello Original, Welcome to the Forum. The photo that you provided seems to show a camera body without a self timer. Is it possible to see a photo of the camera from the front? If there is no self timer then this might also be an M4-2 with the hot shoe replaced with an earlier accessory shoe. Best Regards, Michael Edited December 15, 2019 by Michael Geschlecht Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frase Posted December 16, 2019 Share #5 Posted December 16, 2019 Not 100% but if its a m4-2 or m4p then it should say Leitz on the top, I think maybe its a un issued M4 top plate on a m4-2 or m4p body or maybe which I have seen on other forums a mda body shell used to repair a M4. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmradman Posted December 16, 2019 Share #6 Posted December 16, 2019 Only a guess; the top plate looks in a pristine condition, so probably original was replaced with spare but no serial number was transferred (engraved) onto the replacement top plate. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
250swb Posted December 16, 2019 Share #7 Posted December 16, 2019 Advertisement (gone after registration) Yes the top plate looks new but the rest of the camera looks a little 'worn'. So a cobbled together bitsa or unofficial repair. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frase Posted December 16, 2019 Share #8 Posted December 16, 2019 9 hours ago, mmradman said: Only a guess; the top plate looks in a pristine condition, so probably original was replaced with spare but no serial number was transferred (engraved) onto the replacement top plate. But it can't be an M4 shell as no self timer. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmradman Posted December 16, 2019 Share #9 Posted December 16, 2019 1 hour ago, Frase said: But it can't be an M4 shell as no self timer. I have no idea, I thought self timer is on the front of the camera. Top plate is limited to advance lever, rewind knob, shutter speed dial, hot shoe and shutter button. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Geschlecht Posted December 16, 2019 Share #10 Posted December 16, 2019 12 minutes ago, mmradman said: I have no idea, I thought self timer is on the front of the camera. Top plate is limited to advance lever, rewind knob, shutter speed dial, hot shoe and shutter button. Hello Mladen, You are correct. But the photo in Post #1 also seems to also show part of the front of the camera. This appears to not have a self timer where it would normally go. Like the body is with an M4-M. Best Regards, Michael 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmradman Posted December 16, 2019 Share #11 Posted December 16, 2019 (edited) 18 minutes ago, Michael Geschlecht said: Hello Mladen, You are correct. But the photo in Post #1 also seems to also show part of the front of the camera. This appears to not have a self timer where it would normally go. Like the body is with an M4-M. Best Regards, Michael Ok, I am not familiar with every M model but usually serial number is somewhere on the top deck. In this instance pristine top plate has none. As spare part is made for the batch or series of cameras it would be unlikely to come with unique number. I am guessing the DBP on the top plate engraving means something like Deutche Bundes Patent (BDR vs DDR days), M4 was German Made while later M4-suffixed Cameras were Canadian. Later Ms like M6 lost classic engraving. Grateful to any German expert on better explanations. Edited December 16, 2019 by mmradman Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Geschlecht Posted December 16, 2019 Share #12 Posted December 16, 2019 14 minutes ago, mmradman said: Ok, I am not familiar with every M model but usually serial number is somewhere on the top deck. In this instance pristine top plate has none. As spare part is made for the batch or series of cameras it would be unlikely to come with unique number. I am guessing the DBP on the top plate engraving means something like Deutche Bundes Patent (BDR vs DDR days), M4 was German Made while later M4-suffixed Cameras were Canadian. Later Ms like M6 lost classic engraving. Grateful to any German expert on better explanations. Hello Mladen, I think that a number of the M4-M cameras were made in Wetzlar. Best Regards, Michael Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frase Posted December 16, 2019 Share #13 Posted December 16, 2019 I think its a M4-2 as its got no front red dot like the M4p with a replacement un-issued/old stock M4 top plate also with a repainted hotshoe. Its also had the frame selector changed to old style M3/M2. Also it can't be an MDa shell as they don't have selector lever. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frase Posted December 16, 2019 Share #14 Posted December 16, 2019 Also noticed its not got m4p or m42 hotshoe. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
james.liam Posted January 2, 2020 Share #15 Posted January 2, 2020 Sounds like several parts cannibalized from other cameras for some reason. Does the creature function properly otherwise?. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Geschlecht Posted January 2, 2020 Share #16 Posted January 2, 2020 (edited) Hello Everybody, Happy New Year. It might also be a non Leitz/Leica conversion of an MDa from its windowless original into an M4 range/viewfinder model along with the addition a frame finder mechanism & lever. Best Regards, Michael Edited January 2, 2020 by Michael Geschlecht Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frase Posted January 3, 2020 Share #17 Posted January 3, 2020 I still think its a chrome repainted M4 with M2/3 frameline and self timer levers, or maybe the top plate is old stock original black paint but the hotshoe has been repainted and I maybe wrong but the surround around the shutter button should be chrome. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/304439-no-serial-numbers-m4/?do=findComment&comment=3884350'>More sharing options...
Frase Posted January 3, 2020 Share #18 Posted January 3, 2020 No I'm wrong I think its a M42 thats had a M4 top plate added either black chrome or black paint and had the frameline lever changed to M2/3 type but also had the hotshoe etc painted black. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frase Posted January 3, 2020 Share #19 Posted January 3, 2020 Also just noticed the frameline window with the ridges is different way round (I think wrong way). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
leicabug Posted January 3, 2020 Share #20 Posted January 3, 2020 It is also possible that it was made up from parts, probably by someone working at Leitz. If this camera has no inside # it was probably done by a Leitz worker. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now