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*4* New Summarits

jflachmann

By jflachmann
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earleygallery

earleygallery

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35mm: Summarit vs. Summicron ASPH

6/4 vs. 7/5 elements/groups;

220 vs. 255 gr;

34 vs. 34.5 mm. length;

51.4 vs. 53 mm diameter;

0.8 vs. 0.7 m. min focus distance;

1250 vs. 2000 euro

 

35 f2.5 Skopar is 7 elements in 5 groups. Clearly Leica have not 'copied' VC designs! (I haven't compared the other designs) It will be interesting to find how they perform.

 

I can't see any benefit in Leica producing 'digital only' lenses - they have a reputation for product longevity after all.

 

This can only be good news. Certainly the 35 would appeal to me (I currently use the Skopar) but it depends on how it compares of course. The Skopar is a very good lens.

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luigi bertolotti

luigi bertolotti

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Bad news for me, I recently bought a 75/2 - could have bought two of these new ones for that price... The 75 Summicron is a wonderful lens, but I don't expect this new Summarit to be shabby.

 

That's the point that let me a little surprised seeing the announcement: announced NOW, available in at least 4 months... curious marketing strategy..it's OBVIOUS that many customers will put themselves in the "wait and see" mood... 35 to 90 lens sales will sink... apart for the thousands of people who want anyway a Noctilux :p ...me too was seroiusly thinking of the Cron 75... I'll wait, you bet.

The only explanation is that the lens department has a significant backlog (28 2,8, WATEs) so (if management knows well his job) they can manage such a plan to keep production running full capacity:

- Summer vacations + backlog orders = full capacity to half/end September

- 1 month from then : manage the FEW lens orders of August/Sept and start first batches of Summarits, so betatesters (and Puts ;) ) have items before end of October...

- November : ramp up production of Summarits, so revenues ramp up before end 2007.

 

We'll see...

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masjah

masjah

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This is very interesting news. As has been alluded to earlier, an obvious comparison to make is with the 40/2.4 Summarit found on the fixed focal length Minilux and CM. Also a classic double Gauss design, of very high quality, and economical to produce without aspherical surfaces and overly-exotic glass types. I wouldn't be surprised if the "look" of the new lenses (at least the 35 and 50) isn't a million miles from the Minilux/CM Summarits - which have always been very highly rated as being somewhat more "classically" Leica, and not quite so ruthlessly sharp as some of the aspherical exotica.

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hankg

hankg

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:)

 

Excellent that this topic has been merged, but as the new lenses are supposed to work also on film M, why is it then that this is a M8 topic :cool:

 

Boen

 

Wow, just blinked my eyes and the topic has been moved, Kudos :)

 

Really it would have been better as separate topics as these are very different lenses from the perspective of a 1.33 crop sensor and the requirements of digital then they are for film. On the M8 the 75 and 90 are 100 and 120 and 2.5 gives a very shallow depth of field making these very attractive lenses that give up little to the faster models and gain a lot in compact size and price.

 

The 35 Summarit has a lot of competition from excellant cheaper, faster CV and Zeiss 35's and for M8 users looking for a small fast wide like the preASPH 35 there is no option. The 28/2 is a superb (albeit pricey) lens on the M8 but not that wide and a 24/2 or 21/2 would be huge and horrendously expensive if made to a 24x36 image circle.

 

The only way that digital users will have the same option on the wide end as film users is with a digital only fast/wide. Leica is already a digital company judging from it's sales figures - it's a bit absurd to leave such a hole in the lens line up of it's best selling high end camera. The M8 was meant to bring the film M into the digital age but it's missing the film camera's most used component -a fast wide lens. It might be obsolete if a bigger sensor comes out? How long should we do without a mainstay lens -5 years?, 10 years? What might or might not happen years from now can't do anything for making photo's today.

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Venkman

Venkman

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Look on this forum alone and see how many own Zeiss and CV lenses owners. If leica can capture the budget market share than that is revenue they need.

 

Won't happen - for the price of a single new Leica "Cheapo", I still get three CV lenses easily. If you want cheap, you won't buy them.

 

Dirk

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HetDraakje

HetDraakje

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Really it would have been better as separate topics as these are very different lenses from the perspective of a 1.33 crop sensor and the requirements of digital then they are for film.

 

Everyone knows the theoretical effect of cropfactors.

 

What in the future will defend a separate thread for either M8 and film is the cropfactor effect on vignetting, cyan fringing, and more general bokeh. This can only be established by live testing and, because probably no one has these lenses, one combined thread seems sufficient for now.

 

Boen

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sdai

sdai

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Lets do some math here:

 

CV 35/2.5 II P: 319 US

LH-4 hood: 45 US

 

Subtotal: 364 US

 

Leica 35/2.5: 1700 US

optional hood: 200 US (guesstimate)

 

Subtotal: 1900 US

 

1 Leica 35/2.5 = 5 CV 35/2.5

 

Leica takes on CV? ... I see it a take on your wallet. LOL

 

Last version 50 crons and 90 Elmarit in GREAT condition can be had for less than 800 dollars. ;)

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sean_reid

sean_reid

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A few thoughts...

 

1) It's a bit early to know what the actual street prices of these lenses will be.

 

2) Leica has stressed to me their interest in producing lenses, accessories, etc. that are compatible with both film and digital M bodies. That might change over time, but it has very much been a priority for them thus far.

 

3) While the M8 uses a cropped-size sensor, future Leica DRFs (speaking hypothetically here) may not. Long term, lenses that cover the full 24 x 36 mm frame are more versatile for Leica.

 

3) The hot ticket CV 35/2.5 for the M8 is really the 35 Skopar with an LT-M8 adapter for hand-coding.

 

Cheers,

 

Sean

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hankg

hankg

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Leica takes on CV? ... I see it a take on your wallet. LOL

 

Last version 50 crons and 90 Elmarit in GREAT condition can be had for less than 800 dollars. ;)

 

I don't see this as Leica taking on CV or Zeiss. Rather they are providing their customers with more options at a lower (for Leica) price point. We will have to see how the 4 lenses draw. But if they have a more 'classic' Leica signature combined with modern sharpness, compact size and a lower price point then they will be a very attractive choice for many irregardless of what CV has to offer.

 

Choice is good.

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tom0511

tom0511

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the new lenses remind me a little bit of the Minolta CLE-lenses.

 

Now if being on budget but still wanting new Leica lenses they might be a very good compromise between price, size and performance.

 

On the other side who buys a 75/2.5 if you get the wonderful 75/.4 used for the same price?

Or a 50/2.5 if you get a 50cron for less?

 

In a long term however I think its a good move from Leica.

 

Cheers, Tom

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sdai

sdai

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We will have to see how the 4 lenses draw. But if they have a more 'classic' Leica signature combined with modern sharpness, compact size and a lower price point then they will be a very attractive choice for many irregardless of what CV has to offer.

 

Choice is good.

 

I agree, Hank ... but lens characters tend to reveal and be more pronounced when faster apertures are used, being stopped down these differences are diminishing. I doubt what people could see at f/2.5 and slower ... wish I am wrong.

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Jack_Flesher

Jack_Flesher

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You can bet this is Leica's answer to the lower priced lens options from CV and Zeiss -- and a move they really had to make, so again, good on Leica for this.

 

I think it is safe to assume that build-quality will be equal to the current M lens line-up, which is to say excellent and vastly superior to CV and to a lesser degree Zeiss. This in and of itself may justify the cost differentials between these lenses.

 

As for how they'll draw. Tough to say until we see them, but I suspect that at f5.6, you will have a tough time telling any of the modern lenses apart by looking at the images. The key will be how they perform wide open and how they render oof ares. Wide open performance is a trait Leica has excelled at for years and I doubt they will drift far from this philosophy with these lenses.

 

The really big pluses I see are the compact size and attractive price-point, both attractive options and especially so for a focal length i might not plan on using a lot. I already have my eyes on the 90 just to keep in the corner of my bag for the odd times I want a long lens.

 

So while I am giving them a bit of grief over their unfortunate naming conventions, I think this a great announcement from Leica and look forward to trying these babies out!

 

Cheers,

 

Jack

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HetDraakje

HetDraakje

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I don't see this as Leica taking on CV or Zeiss.

CV, I agree, but compared to Zeiss prices:

ZM 2/35 850 euro vs. Summarit 2.5/35 1250 euro

ZM 2/50 650 euro vs. Summarit 2.5/50 1000 euro

ZM 2/85 2200euro vs Summarit 2.5/70 or 90 1250 euro

 

Zeiss also does not deliver hood included

 

Choice is good.

Hear hear :)

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Kent10D

Kent10D

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You could be right in some sense, but the 1/3-stop detents is not an advantage in any way. The shutter speeds move in 1/2-stops, so when trying to meter, there is a distinct imbalance. I presume the Digital-Ikon, if and when it comes, will allow setting the shutter speeds in 1/3-stops, but for me, this is just too much detail. 1/2 stop is plenty accuracy, and I prefer focusing on the subject, pun and all, to fiddling around with 1/3 stops.

 

Oh I see. So you want to be able to adjust one parameter or the other while keeping the exposure precisely the same, right down to the half-stop. That's fair enough. Perfectly reasonable. But I tend to think in full stops for that, and then it's just a "smidge" less or more. Probably for the same reason that the M8 EV is adjustable in 1/3 stops rather than 1/2 stops. Just a different approach.

 

Very interesting.

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