Why the M240 (and its siblings) is still the best M platform

[colonel]

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Ok, its that time of year again for me to get all philosophical !!

The M240 seems to be gradually falling in price, with excellent examples available in the UK £2.1-2.5k and M-Ps £2.5-3k

Although not cheap for a second hand FF camera its not a million miles off a new A7, Z6 or EOS R and depreciates slower

The key thing is the love of M photography, manual focus, the best manual focus system in the world and those lovely little jewellery like super sharp lenses

Lets face it, everytime I think of my A7Rii I smile, and everything I lift it up with a Samyang 35 or 50mm f1.4 I groan. Those lovely little M lenses!

What I have noticed through years of wasting ridiculous amounts on cameras is that although the bodies cost different things, the 1.2/1.4 lenses are very similar in price, across M4/3s, APS-C, CSC and SLR, and therefore you must never choose a system from the body price. I always choose my favourite system from my favourite lenses, and with the cost I only consider lenses long term

Leica lenses are of course much more expensive, but recently the competition is producing excellent lenses. The Voigtlander 35mm f1.7 and 75mm f1.8 are spectacular and the 50mm f1.5 is a great every day sharp worker with lovely contrast. The Voigtlander 35mm f1.2's unique rendering, especially of people, is quite beautiful. Zeiss leapfrogged Leica for sharpness with the 35mm f1.4 and many of its lenses are great value and super sharp, including the excellent 50mm f2, 28mm f2.8 and 25mm f2.8

There are even a pool of excellent Leica lenses at reasonable prices, including stars like the 90mm Tele-Elmarit, older 50mm designs and second hand summarits.

Not to mention the cheap 7artisans series, various Lomo's reissues and general oddity pot, including Jupiter, etc...

Its quite possible to have a collection of solid metal, super rendering lenses at a relatively reasonable price. Especially if bought second hand the value hold and even rises over the years.

The M240 is the digital enabler. Its bulletproof reliable. I have used many over the years and have never had a problem with rangefinder being out of alignment. I am sure there are ones that are, but with the M9 is was at least 1 in 5 second hand.

The battery is the longest life battery for digital M created so far, the SD card compatibility is great and the sensor is perfect right up to 1600 with 3200 being restricted only when pushing exposure revealing banding.

I just love my M240

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Edited November 14, 2018 by colonel

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[oldwino]

Agreed.

 

Want to sell me your M240? 😉

[duoenboge]

And probably the silver one is  the most beautifuly digital M.

[colonel]

Silver is beautiful, black is subtle

as I get older I go with beauty

[colonel]

Silver is beautiful, black is subtle

as I get older I go with beauty

[darylgo]

Question:  have you had a chance to shoot or handle the Mp240 or M10?   There are subtle refinements that are not that different from cameras of the 60's, the change from M3 to M4, Nikon F to F2, subtle, evolutionary not revolutionary.  I can appreciate the thought that goes into each model upgrade but  I've stuck with the M240, it's a lifetime camera and the pictures continue to amaze.  Lenses first body (it needs to be a good body) second.  

[Peter Kilmister]

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The M240-P is certainly a better vehicle than the original M240. Not by a lot, but enough to warrant a change.

I tried out an M10 last year. Slightly thinner than the M240, a different viewfinder, basically the same with a new ISO knob stuck on top. I have yet to understand whether that affects the waterproofing of the M240. (Anyone used an M10 in the rain? I have used my M240-P in the rain with no problem.)

This year I tried the M10-P. Fantastic but very expensive. I loved how silent the shutter was. That is a major improvement.

If funds are available I would go fo the M10-P ... but only a second-hand and little used example. There is not much else to separate the M10-P from the M240-P.

[colonel]

45 minutes ago, darylgo said:

Question:  have you had a chance to shoot or handle the Mp240 or M10?   There are subtle refinements that are not that different from cameras of the 60's, the change from M3 to M4, Nikon F to F2, subtle, evolutionary not revolutionary.  I can appreciate the thought that goes into each model upgrade but  I've stuck with the M240, it's a lifetime camera and the pictures continue to amaze.  Lenses first body (it needs to be a good body) second.  

I had an MP240

It’s  nicer then the basic M240 but doesn’t justify the premium to me. The difference in the UK is about £500 so it depends on your funds but that’s a lens for me

i agree that lens is more important then body

the m10 is two steps back (battery life, video) and one step fwd (1-2mm off width)

the m10-P adds a slightly quieter shutter which is a big advantage but not enough for the premium of a new M10-p over a used M240.

i can see a m10-p or m11 in my future but the prices have a way to go .....

 

[Jeff S]

The M10 has better weather sealing than the M240 variants according to Leica.  Some reasons include the EVF plug-in location,  removal of strap lug protectors and better sealing around the base plate.  It’s still not as weather sealed as the S or SL, including around the lens mount, so common sense still prevails.

Jono and others have reported success in rainy conditions, but that’s been true for me with every M I’ve used, including the M240 and M10...

https://lhsa.org/2017/05/testing-the-leica-m10/

Jeff

[darylgo]

A seldom mentioned change is the M10 no longer has continuous mode or self timer selection with power on.   I'd miss the self timer and would rather not dig into a menu to enable it.  

[charleswang]

As soon as you take price into consideration, I completely agree with you. For $2.5-3K M240 is so far ahead in terms of features/price ratio. And this is coming from someone who switched from a M240 to a M10 earlier this year...

However, if you disregard price (which is not a fair comparison, I know, price is everything), your statement is quite easily contested.

I'd actually argue that the M10 is better in every way at what it is designed to do (albeit very marginally in some regards) except battery life and lack of video.

Feel free to prove me wrong. Discourses welcomed 😀

 

 

[colonel]

6 hours ago, charleswang said:

As soon as you take price into consideration, I completely agree with you. For $2.5-3K M240 is so far ahead in terms of features/price ratio. And this is coming from someone who switched from a M240 to a M10 earlier this year...

However, if you disregard price (which is not a fair comparison, I know, price is everything), your statement is quite easily contested.

I'd actually argue that the M10 is better in every way at what it is designed to do (albeit very marginally in some regards) except battery life and lack of video.

Feel free to prove me wrong. Discourses welcomed 😀

 

 

Fair statement 

[keithlaban.co.uk]

I like the M240 so much I bought two.

[LucisPictor]

Interesting topic!

I cannot completely judge on the general statement, since I have not really shot much with both neither the M9 nor the M10.

But what I can confirm is that the M240 is amazing! It defnitely shares the genes with my M6 and M8 and I must admit that I prefer it to my Sony A7II (although I also think that the 7II is a great camera). I also have the Nikon Df and for a digital SLR it is not only beautiful but also sports a fantastic sensor. And still, my favourite camera is the M240.

With a set of Leica (2.8/21, 2.0/50, 2.0/90, 2.8/90, 4.5/135), Voigtländer (5.6/10, 4.5/15, 2.0/28, 2.5/75) and 7artisans (2.0/35, 1.1/50), Nikon (3.5/135) as well as some Russian lenses (2.8/35, 2.0/50) and a Schacht Travenon 3.5/35 in M-mount there is not much left to be desired. 

I just love the haptics and the "feel" of this camera and the compact and high-performing lenses and I'm ever so grateful that I have the chance to shoot with it. 

[sblitz]

doesn't the M10 have a newer, upgraded sensor vs M240?

[jdlaing]

16 hours ago, sblitz said:

doesn't the M10 have a newer, upgraded sensor vs M240?

Not really. Same specification envelope and pixel count/micro lens array but a different and improved image engine hence the better iso response, etc.

[Exodies]

Surely high ISO noise comes from the sensor not the processor.

[jdlaing]

2 hours ago, Exodies said:

Surely high ISO noise comes from the sensor not the processor.

The noise can be controlled with the image engine. Everybody thinks the sensor is some magical entity. It is but a mindless brick with capabilities that can only be brought out by the processing engine.

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[jaapv]

5 hours ago, jdlaing said:

Not really. Same specification envelope and pixel count/micro lens array but a different and improved image engine hence the better iso response, etc.

Actually the only things that the M240 and M10 sensors share are the basic specifications. For the rest the M10 sensor is a new design, made by a different manufacturer.

[sblitz]

2 hours ago, jaapv said:

Actually the only things that the M240 and M10 sensors share are the basic specifications. For the rest the M10 sensor is a new design, made by a different manufacturer.

TY, that's what I remember when it came out. While it might not be 100% true but I think the M10, Q and SL all have very similar if not the same sensors (Q and SL I believe are essentially the same). Anyway, not trying hijack the thread. If someone likes the M240 better, so be it, and having video capability is critical for me now that I have grandchildren 🙂 

 

 

Edited November 24, 2018 by sblitz