Summicron 75mm - Not sharp/focus issues between f/2.0-f/8.0

[titan3025]

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Hi all,

 

I was happily shooting with and swapping between the Summicron 35mm and 75mm the last couple of days.

 

Today I came back from a photo walk and found out that all my photos taken with the 75mm Summicron were unsharp with low f-stops (between f/2.0 and f/8.0). It looks like the focus is completely off. I am shooting with a Leica M-D, that is why I only saw the issue when I was back at my PC to download the pictures.

 

Have you ever seen this behavior? What could cause a focus issue with low f-stops?

 

The suspicion I currently have is the new firmware 1.0.0.5 that I installed yesterday. That is the only change and the first time is a firmware upgrade on a leica.

 

Many thanks

Edited December 31, 2017 by titan3025

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[rsolomon]

I have both lenses, summicron 35 and summicron 75, enjoy them both very much. I was also having focus issues with my 75, I brought the lens and camera to leica NJ and they ‘re-calibrated’ them and again no problem, then about 2 years later the same. The lab technician explain the longer the lens the more sensitive and less tolerance it is. My guess is somehow the lens was bumped or jolted and only needs a minor , quick, simple adjustment- in fact some on this forum preform it themselves.

 

Due to a combination of my eye sight (really not bad) and desire to be able to shoot wide open and be spot on I invested in the EVF -2. At first I hated the bulk, BUT results improved to 100 focus hit , so I learned to like it - it’s increased my enjoyment tremendously.

 

The reason the evf-2 works is because you focus from the sensor and bypass the optical viewfinder. Of course you can use either with the evf-2 on.

 

A great test would be to try an evf from you local shop to compare focus accuracy between evf and Ovf- that test will confirm front / back / accurate focus.

[TomB_tx]

Also try shooting a test chart or sheet of newspaper at an angle to find where it focuses best, and how sharp it is at that plane. This will show if it is a focus issue or an optical issue. I've used a 1968 90 TeleElmarit since new, and after some years noticed the pictures I took with it looked dull and unsharp. Eventually I tried shooting a newspaper at an angle and found nothing looked sharp. A Leica tech diagnosed a rear element or group had shifted position, even though I was not aware of any knocks or jolts to it. He adjusted the optics, and it has been amazing since - at least the equal of my current 90 2.5 Summarit.

[titan3025]

Many thanks. Looks like I have to bring it in for calibration [emoji25] then as well.

 

The M-D does not support EVFs unfortunately.

 

Issues like these are serious because with a leica without a display I need to be able to rely on it 100%. There is no room for tolerance since I will only be able to find out about the results when back at my PC.

 

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[titan3025]

Also try shooting a test chart or sheet of newspaper at an angle to find where it focuses best, and how sharp it is at that plane. This will show if it is a focus issue or an optical issue. I've used a 1968 90 TeleElmarit since new, and after some years noticed the pictures I took with it looked dull and unsharp. Eventually I tried shooting a newspaper at an angle and found nothing looked sharp. A Leica tech diagnosed a rear element or group had shifted position, even though I was not aware of any knocks or jolts to it. He adjusted the optics, and it has been amazing since - at least the equal of my current 90 2.5 Summarit.

From what I hear bring it in is my only option at this point. I guess no more 75mm shots during this holidays [emoji24]

 

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[Stein K S]

Hi

 

I bought a used 75 cron a year ago from a Leica dealer. It did not focus accuarety on my M9 (front focus). Got a calibration (lens only) for free... somewhat better, but still not OK. Then an M10 arrived during last summer and the 75 is spot on. Part of story is that the M9 works spot on on a number of other Leica lenses incl a couple of 50s and a factory calibrated 90 elmarit. So this thing about focus accuracy is to me somewhat still frustrating... even if happy with my M10 now.

 

And... a happy new year to all!

Edited December 31, 2017 by Stein K S

[titan3025]

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Hi

 

I bought a used 75 cron a year ago from a Leica dealer. It did not focus accuarety on my M9 (front focus). Got a calibration (lens only) for free... somewhat better, but still not OK. Then an M10 arrived during last summer and the 75 is spot on. Part of story is that the M9 works spot on on a number of other Leica lenses incl a couple of 50s and a factory calibrated 90 elmarit. So this thing about focus accuracy is to me somewhat still frustrating... even if happy with my M10 now.

 

And... a happy new year to all!

Looks like.

 

Thanks, and happy New Year to you too.

 

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[MarkP]

 

 

If you search through the Forum for 75 APO-Summicron calibration you will find many posts from about 6 years ago regarding calibration problems with this lens. Seemed to be a fairly common problem. Mine was also off and recalibrated under warranty. No problems since then.

Edited January 1, 2018 by MarkP

[pgk]

From what has been posted elsewhere it appears that the 75mm Summicron is a complex mechanical design. Everything has to be accurately adjusted in order for it to work correctly. It sounds as though something has gone out of adjustment. I'd suggest checking it carefully at a number of distances and if it is not working correctly it will need to be recalibrated by Leica.

[rsolomon]

The M-D does not support EVFs unfortunately.

 

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I have a m240, but surprised since you have a sensor and a hot shoe but I guess no way to tell the Camera to ‘switch ‘ to evf-2.

[LocalHero1953]

I have a m240, but surprised since you have a sensor and a hot shoe but I guess no way to tell the Camera to ‘switch ‘ to evf-2.

The EVF for the M240 and derivatives slots into the hotshoe, but also into a secondary rear connector which I assume is absent on the MD.

 

Nevertheless, it is a simple test to focus the rangefinder on a target in a continuously receding scene (e.g.a mark on a fence or brick wall seen at an angle, or on a series of paving slabs) and see whether the lens is consistently front or back focusing, and by how much.

 

It's tedious on the MD because you can't see the results on the rear screen immediately after taking the shots (one reason why I would never get an MD), but you can see them after downloading.

[rsolomon]

The EVF for the M240 and derivatives slots into the hotshoe, but also into a secondary rear connector which I assume is absent.

 

Makes sense!

Was looking for a simpler way to test. Ofcouse as mentioned any good chart, or the right fence will work

[Gregm61]

The focus throw is so short on the 75 Summicron, I've focused at distance where I felt like I should just be able to set the thing to infinity at a mid-aperture and it was slightly off, so I would re-focus, being careful to stop just short of infinity, right where the images coincide with the rangefinder, and the focus was perfect, so it doesn't take being off but by just a slight amount. I took it with me on a trip to Canada this past September and had no problem obtaining tack sharp images.

[titan3025]

From what has been posted elsewhere it appears that the 75mm Summicron is a complex mechanical design. Everything has to be accurately adjusted in order for it to work correctly. It sounds as though something has gone out of adjustment. I'd suggest checking it carefully at a number of distances and if it is not working correctly it will need to be recalibrated by Leica.

Yeah. I checked various distances. Consistently out of focus on low aperture values. Will have to bring it in.

 

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[titan3025]

I have a m240, but surprised since you have a sensor and a hot shoe but I guess no way to tell the Camera to ‘switch ‘ to evf-2.

Exactly [emoji85]

 

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[titan3025]

The focus throw is so short on the 75 Summicron, I've focused at distance where I felt like I should just be able to set the thing to infinity at a mid-aperture and it was slightly off, so I would re-focus, being careful to stop just short of infinity, right where the images coincide with the rangefinder, and the focus was perfect, so it doesn't take being off but by just a slight amount. I took it with me on a trip to Canada this past September and had no problem obtaining tack sharp images.

I checked that as well. It's really more than just a bit unsharp. Not a focusing issue. I am using the lens since 6 months and this happened from one day to the other.

 

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[hoppyman]

Hi all,

I was happily shooting with and swapping between the Summicron 35mm and 75mm the last couple of days.

Today I came back from a photo walk and found out that all my photos taken with the 75mm Summicron were unsharp with low f-stops (between f/2.0 and f/8.0). It looks like the focus is completely off. I am shooting with a Leica M-D, that is why I only saw the issue when I was back at my PC to download the pictures.

Have you ever seen this behavior? What could cause a focus issue with low f-stops?

The suspicion I currently have is the new firmware 1.0.0.5 that I installed yesterday. That is the only change and the first time is a firmware upgrade on a leica.

Many thanks

It’s impossible for any firmware to affect what is an entirely mechanical function of the lens and RF mechanisms though. At wide open or nearly so settings the DoF is very unforgiving of course, most particularly at close range. I would suggest some careful testing when you can to establish if either the camera RF or the lens does require adjustment.

I still have my 75, having used it on multiple M cameras. I didn’t ever see an issue with my example at least.

Good luck getting this sorted out. I think that it is an excellent lens

http://www.pbase.com/hoppyman/image/101824440

Edited January 1, 2018 by hoppyman

[pico]

It’s impossible for any firmware to affect what is an entirely mechanical function of the lens and RF mechanisms

 

I double-down on what hoppyman wrote. Something in the process is missing if you have not dropped or damaged the 75mm.

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[hoppyman]

mine's 9 years old and still problem free. Solms looked at it and volunteered to service it in 2009 (forum visit) although I never saw a problem with it.
I like the focus throw and I found the RF to be fine. The current RF mechanisms ones are the best Leica has ever made too.
Sarcophagus detail,  Imperial Crypt, Vienna, low light hand held minimum distance 1/60th f/2 or very close, ISO 2000 M Typ 240, very small crop


 

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

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Edited January 2, 2018 by hoppyman

[Gregm61]

I like your processing of that image, hoppyman.