Mandler: Lux 75 VS Cron 90, legend or reality ??

[the warrior]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

For two years I owned a 75 lux II mounted on a M8.8, have great photos that lens and I love, has something special, is the favorite son of Mandler for its balance between size and quality.

He had never had much chance to try the 90 Cron Mandler until I bought two, one black and one solid brass that is my toy right now, with this lens as with the lux I very close pictures of people in the street, my flickr is full of them.

The truth is that now I have a criterion to judge both my personal opnion about these two sacred monsters Mandler.

The price of both are Lux: 3000 - 3500 Euros only in black color, and 900 - 2000 euros for the black and leg respectively brass and three in very good condition, mint.

There is a very significant difference between brass and 90 lux for the price.

Size and weight are similar, are big and heavy but I like that a lot.

Of the three lenses I much prefer the 90mm solid brass.

The optical quality unrevised three in a laboratory is simply very similar, the DOF "apparent" lux at F1.4 75 to 1 meter and the DOF "apparent" Cron 90mm to 1 meter and f2 are the same.

Bokeh of both is spectacular, very beautiful, beautiful.

 

The 90mm allows me to "fill" taking over foreground to 1 meter, I like a lot.

I have no problem view to focus people when walking down the sidewalk with these objectives to 1.5 meters F1.4 - f2, a lot of training has made this possible.

If today I had to choose between the two I prefer the 90mm f2 ASPH Pre-E55, the solid brass for my M3 or for Monochrom is supernatural.

 

I would like to know what you are saying about these lenses ?.

 

Regards.

[Advertisement]

The Leica Q3 is available for pre-order at B&H Photo Video and Adorama

[otto.f]

I don"t know the Cron90 from experience, I own the Summilux 75 and the 35 cron iv. It seems to me that the Mandler lenses have an ideal match with the Monochrom

[lct]

The three versions of the Summicron 90/2 pre-apo are Mandler lenses. V1 and v2 are bulky, v1 has a bit of focus shift and v2 is said to be a very fine lens but i have no experience with it. V3 is significantly smaller. It has the same size as the current 90/2 apo, it is one of my favorite lenses for portrait due to its softer rendition at f/2 but it has a lot of chromatic aberration contrary to the current version..

[adan]

The 90 Summicron non-ASPHs are definitely "the poor man's 75 Summilux."

 

The v.3 (E55 compact version) has a bit more contrast than the earlier two, once one drops below f/2 (fewer elements, fewer air/glass surfaces, more modern coatings, thus less veiling flare). And more CA and distortion, from being a "telephoto" construction to achieve the smaller size.

[russell]

Of the three lenses I much prefer the 90mm solid brass.

I also have the v3 in chrome (brass).  Why do you like this over the black version?  I often wish I'd gotten the black version to save the heavy weight.

[the warrior]

I like the lenses are heavy, it is because they stabilize better in my hands.

Rusell:  I am a long distance shooter with firearm (police) and weight of the weapon achieves best stop in the hands and therefore better efficiency shot with cameras and I feel the same.

I also like solid brass lenses.

Adam, I have had the lux 75 and now would not change the lux 90mm, it closely resembles.

I do not know if it is the target or maybe it's who handles, but I love the result to f2 and louder, to f5.6.

 

Yesterday:  M-Monochrom CCD - "Super-Cron 90mm E55 Mandler Desing" in f2 - 2 meter.

 

[Poki]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

The 90mm Summicron pre-APO (v3) always seems to have a bad reputation for not being ultra-sharp wide open. That reputation was almost enough to push me over to the APO one back when I bought the lens. However, I didn't regret it a second - the 90mm Summicron v3 has a wonderful rendering! Beautiful bokeh wide open, and apart from the corners it's already easily sharp enough for portraits. I also use it wide open for sport events and concerts - both of which are ultimately limited by either motion blur or high ISO noise, not by lens sharpness.

On the other hand, by f/5.6 it's insanely sharp and detailed across the whole frame! I love to use the lens for landscapes at 5.6. So yeah, I can wholeheartedly recommend this lens to everyone looking for a 90mm M-lens. The biggest downside, to me, is the weight of the lens. 485 grams feels like on the very edge of being acceptable. Still, I need the fast aperture, so there's no way around the weight.

[the warrior]

This lens for me is not very usable from those openings where sharpness makes eye damage.

A f2 I feel great, I want these goals that others do not want, I'll take all that "are not hard".

I think a bokeh as 75 lux and what I get cn this lens is magnificent in my opnion.

We must remember that not everyone has the patience to meet these long lenses and fear not draw all to focus on large openings is great, another common problem is that the vision of people can not be right and are not able to hit with the approach.

It is easier to f8 all with an angular, all in focus, but I I do not like anything.

 

I tried the cron 500 APO ASPH, my eyes hurt ..... with those photographs.

[lct]

The 5000 asph is even sharper

[Poki]

I don't think a lens can be too sharp tbh. For landscapes, I want all the detail I can get. And while it can look very crisp online, on large prints it's just stunning. As for portraits, there are amazing skin smoothing algorithms out there, while the eyes, the hair and other important details still stay detailed. Also, softening a whole image is very simple. I don't really see any advantage about having a low-resolution lens.

 

Of course, different people have different tastes, and the portrait you posted here looks indeed very nice. Do you really think it would look any worse if shot with a 90mm APO Summicron or a Zeiss 85mm Otus with proper processing?

Edit: Here's another image shot with the 90mm v3 Summicron at around f/5.6. Even though the contrast is rather extreme, the detail rendition in the feathers still looks great! 

 

[lct]

Try to shoot your mother in law with a 90/2 apo

[Poki]

Try to shoot your mother in law with a 90/2 apo

 

 

Like I said, skin smoothing algorithms are truly a great thing in some scenarios.

[lct]

Great if one likes plasticky skins but otherwise... 

[pop]

Like I said, skin smoothing algorithms are truly a great thing in some scenarios.

We have a respectable number of members who prefer their images to be made with optics, warts and all: 

The view through older glass.

 

[Poki]

Great if one likes plasticky skins but otherwise... 

 

Have you ever tried any advanced skin enhancing techniques in post processing? Everybody hates plasticky skin, but that doesn't mean that you shouldn't do any portrait retouching at all. You can define which areas are affected, you can define how exactly the skin is changed, you can define how big a blemish needs to be before the software touches it at all. It's not about "too sharp" or "no pores at all" - it's about having a very fine tuned control of how you want your skin to look like. I think the portrait which was released in full size by Phase One to promote their 100 MP XF camera does quite a good job showing how it's done right - shooting a portrait with a 100 MP medium format camera and one of the sharpest lenses of all time does NOT mean it's a bad photo.

 

We have a respectable number of members who prefer their images to be made with optics, warts and all: 

The view through older glass.

 

 

 

I get that. I prefer my images as natural as possible too. But you simply can't do a fashion shoot without any skin enhancing. And just using a lens which is not super sharp is not an option, since you need all the detail in the clothing. For street photography, I don't touch the skin either.

[lct]

Been there thanks no thanks but YMMV.

[the warrior]

Well poki, there are different ways of seeing things, I prefer to bring what I like and bring it from the street, and not have to handle light PS inventing things that was previously not in reality.

They are dreams, but I think that photography is another thing though that you call photography.

We enter a world that defines the picture and should call otherwise perhaps, when the eyes of a girl open with the PS, or is made thinner, or the largest whiter skin or chest no longer we talk about photography, that is to invent another reality.

I do not like, it is for fashion magazines and for the gebte seem what in reality is not and never will be, is like silicone chest or lips, is something horrendous.

 

---

Yes ict my friend, is true, if you shoot a portrait of your mother with a 90 / APO no longer leave you never go home ......

 

----

 

To smooth the skin I use a steam iron   Poki, you do not get angry, I do not speak English and maybe I did not express well, but I'm joking a bit. I do not like ASPH ASPH, are unreal, no one except the eagles see it that way, my ma damage the eyes.

 

-----

 

Poki, you can see my gallery and see the reality of the people, do not you see people "invented" people plastic, people who are never going to look at those airbrushed and unreal pictures that some people prefer to look after seeing his picture in the mirror when you get up from bed.

The person is the person and a cartoon is a caricature of reality.

Every day more rubber mujeers the streets, and also men, a shame.

 

Many thanks.

[menos I M6]

From the 90/2 and 75/1.4 mentioned I prefer the 85/1.5 Nikkor ;-)

 

Apart from that the 75/1.4 does in my opinion have a somewhat more rounded look than the 90 Summicron pre ASPH - it does something special, both allowing for a more natural looking perspective for head + shoulders (I don't like too long lenses for portraits) and for it's qualities of sharpening up much more than the Summicron once stopping down.

 

To me the 75/1.4 is the more special lens of the two and I only choose the 90/2 when more reach is what I want. For portraits I rather use the 75 or simply use a 50mm instead.

[Advertisement]

Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[otto.f]

How well spoken.

 

But, the portrait in #6 is just one of a kind. You cannot explain what causes the beauty of it by breaking it down to lenses, subject, bokeh, etc.; the whole is more than the sum of single factors here. It is like a positive accident, real accidents could not have been prevented because there just this unexplainable extra combination of decisive moments coming together. 

 

So, I wouldn't buy or sell a lens on this image. 

[the warrior]

Very true, a photograph is the result of many factors, but among them is the factor of the lens itself.

I believe that among these factors is also the vision of the photographer.

The portraits on the street are special because they are all different, the pictures are there but only for those who look to the right place.

I do not find significant differences in the pictures with 75 f1.4 and 90 E55 pre-ASPH.

 

MMonochrom - Leica 90mm E55 pre-ASPH with UV Scratched Filter - 1.7 meters - f4

 

To me they are living images in this 3D, but the ASPH lenses that have lost, in my opinion.