Art-WooD Posted January 9, 2016 Share #1 Posted January 9, 2016 Advertisement (gone after registration) Hello, I have a nice little Leica IIIa from 1936, everything works just fine except the slow speed in cold weather. Inside and in summertime its no problem. When it gets cold, about 0°C, the setting 20-1 behaves like the setting Z. I press the shutter and the curtain opens and closes as soon as I let the shutter go. I guess this has something to do with the spring to control the tension of a lever wich hold back the first curtain. When it gets cold the tension seems to change and the first curtain has not enough force to move the lever hold by the spring. Its very difficult to explain. But has someone had a similar problem with temperatures and shutter issues? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted January 9, 2016 Posted January 9, 2016 Hi Art-WooD, Take a look here Leica IIIa slow speed not working in cold weather. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
david strachan Posted January 9, 2016 Share #2 Posted January 9, 2016 Old gummy lubricants? A CLA does wonders with Barnack cameras. It'll feel smoother and the slower speeds will work. cheers Dave S Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lleo Posted January 9, 2016 Share #3 Posted January 9, 2016 Hi Art, you should move your thread here: http://www.l-camera-forum.com/forum/35-leica-collectors-historica/ That section is more appropriate for your topic. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art-WooD Posted January 9, 2016 Author Share #4 Posted January 9, 2016 Thanks for your answers! Actually I did a CLA to this Leica IIIa, it needed a new shutter curtain, the old one had holes and was a bit stiff. To stay as close to original as possible it did the sewing too The only thing I could't clean and lubricate are the two rollers with springs inside for the shutter curtain tension. Could it be that the old grease gets stiff in cold environment? How can I move an thread? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. No Posted January 9, 2016 Share #5 Posted January 9, 2016 How can I move an thread? you cannot do it. the mods have to ... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. No Posted January 9, 2016 Share #6 Posted January 9, 2016 Thanks for your answers! Actually I did a CLA to this Leica IIIa, it needed a new shutter curtain, the old one had holes and was a bit stiff. To stay as close to original as possible it did the sewing too The only thing I could't clean and lubricate are the two rollers with springs inside for the shutter curtain tension. Could it be that the old grease gets stiff in cold environment? How can I move an thread? there are actually two "Hemmwerke" (escapements?) one for the slow speeds, one for the fast speeds. both need CLA! yes, the more cold the more stiffer the lubrication- makes sense to m! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pop Posted January 9, 2016 Share #7 Posted January 9, 2016 Advertisement (gone after registration) you cannot do it. the mods have to ... I have moved it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
david strachan Posted January 10, 2016 Share #8 Posted January 10, 2016 (edited) Thanks for your answers! Actually I did a CLA to this Leica IIIa, it needed a new shutter curtain, the old one had holes and was a bit stiff. To stay as close to original as possible it did the sewing too The only thing I could't clean and lubricate are the two rollers with springs inside for the shutter curtain tension. Could it be that the old grease gets stiff in cold environment? How can I move an thread? That's the whole point I was trying to make. No good an amateur doing the CLA. Get it done properly, get it done once. Then you are good for another 20 years, probably much more! It's not so expensive. But if you are a young broke student, just leave it alone until you have the spare cash to do so. I really wouldn't keep poking around in there. cheers Dave S Edited January 10, 2016 by david strachan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art-WooD Posted January 10, 2016 Author Share #9 Posted January 10, 2016 Thanks for moving the thread to the right place. Actually I do know how to repair cameras, last year I did a complete CLA to a totally broken M3 even the viewfinder prism was seperatet and I got it fixed well. It works until today like a charm and will for sure many more years I will make a documentation soon. I am even planing to build my own large format camera. In the IIIa there is a spring wich is extremly sensitive. A little too much tension and the 20-1 setting will act like Z, a little too low tension and the Z setting will flip through like 1/1000s. I think its not the grease as this spring is soooo sensitive. As the spring is sooo sensitive I can imagine well that great temperature differences might change the tension a little bit too, enough to be out of adjustment. As this part at the IIIf is differently constructed to the IIIa, I can belive this was a comon problem. Here is the spring: Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! And here is a video of this mechanical masterpiece in action. Its much simpler constructed than the speed selector of the M3. https://youtu.be/DGFA1wD2oTQ 3 Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! And here is a video of this mechanical masterpiece in action. Its much simpler constructed than the speed selector of the M3. https://youtu.be/DGFA1wD2oTQ ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/255426-leica-iiia-slow-speed-not-working-in-cold-weather/?do=findComment&comment=2965810'>More sharing options...
lleo Posted January 10, 2016 Share #10 Posted January 10, 2016 Vielen Dank, Pop. Art, is the video yours? It's marvelous seeing these piece of art working. Little OT: this morning I went to take some pics at a place where some Volkswagen Käfer have met. Once I was there, everybody was looking at the camera I'll post one as I'll have processed. End OT. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. No Posted January 10, 2016 Share #11 Posted January 10, 2016 In the IIIa there is a spring wich is extremly sensitive. think that is just for the fast speeds. the one for the slowones sits at the botttom of the camera. OLAF Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art-WooD Posted January 10, 2016 Author Share #12 Posted January 10, 2016 think that is just for the fast speeds. the one for the slowones sits at the botttom of the camera. OLAF Yes the real slow speeds are at the bottom, but the spring holds back the second curtain until the slow speeds in the bottom did their work. If the spring fails to hold back the second curtain it flips through and the slow speeds in the bottom have no chance to work. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art-WooD Posted January 10, 2016 Author Share #13 Posted January 10, 2016 Vielen Dank, Pop. Art, is the video yours? It's marvelous seeing these piece of art working. Little OT: this morning I went to take some pics at a place where some Volkswagen Käfer have met. Once I was there, everybody was looking at the camera I'll post one as I'll have processed. End OT. Yes thats my video I haven't seen a video of the working mechanism on youtube so far, so I made one. I know that problem with peopels looking at the camera, especially with my M3 they get big eyes, but I want to be unobstrusive on streets and for that the IIIa with the old Elmar lens is perfect. Its so tiny I can hide it away in one hand 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerzy Posted January 12, 2016 Share #14 Posted January 12, 2016 (edited) the spring marked on a photo has no influence on słow speed escape, which is located at the bootom of the camera as mentioned earlier. Slow speed escape is engaged by the rod which is under the black metal piece on the opposite side of the speed wheel. When you press the release button this rod shall move down and the small piece of metal mounted on the upper part of the rod, visible on the photo a bit right to speed wheel screw will block ten second curtain. Second curtain turns then the rod, which is latched at the bottom with slow speed escape. Blocking will happen only on 20 and Z, for all other speed not. At the bottom rod is being hold by the flat spring, not the one which is for shutter release rod, the other one. IN your particular issue the problem is with the tension of second curtain spring, it does not have enough force to release the latch, which is under the spring marked on the photo. There is no adjustment for this spring and I never had a problem with it. The cure for your problem is to do CLA on the shutter mechanism, old, stuck grease is a problem. Temporarily, you may bring to work by increasing tension for the s cond curtain, half a turn shall be OK, but mind that with it you will change the speeds, and especially on 1/500 1/1000 you may observe capping. Unless you have shutter speed tester I would not do it, rather leave the work for specialists. Edited January 12, 2016 by jerzy 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art-WooD Posted January 12, 2016 Author Share #15 Posted January 12, 2016 I am not to sure about this spring, because when I sligly alterated the tension the slow speed worked and another slight alteration resulted in not working. But now I had it open again and cleaned the big drum roller. Now it works great! I do have a simple speed tester for the slower speeds, 1/60s is the fastet it can measure. I test the really fast speeds with a CRT monitor at 60Hz, for me this is exact enough But if I hadn't have sucess at the end I had it given to CLA. I live neaby the Leica hometown Wetzlar, so go there knock the door and ask would be no problem Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomB_tx Posted January 13, 2016 Share #16 Posted January 13, 2016 The CRT method is very good, as it shows consistency all across the frame. I have testers that work to 1/8000, but still use a CRT most often. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gi0rgi0ba Posted March 8, 2023 Share #17 Posted March 8, 2023 On 1/13/2016 at 1:14 AM, TomB_tx said: The CRT method is very good, as it shows consistency all across the frame. I have testers that work to 1/8000, but still use a CRT most often. I usually compare two images/histograms, the first image is taken with a DSLR (100 mm lens in bulb mode) through the analog camera (set @x-peed), and the second reference image is taken with DSLR at the same X- Speed Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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