Nick Bedford Posted December 27, 2015 Share #161 Posted December 27, 2015 Advertisement (gone after registration) Nick, these are really exceptional and the first and third shots are so very Australian (not sure about the second, maybe Brisbane?) Perhaps you would consider posting them a second time in the Australian Landscape thread which can be found in the Photo Forum under "Landscape and Travel"? Thank you platypus! Appreciate it and will definitely post them in that forum Yeah the second two were both in Brisbane, the landscape was on the way to Mount Maroon. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted December 27, 2015 Posted December 27, 2015 Hi Nick Bedford, Take a look here What's Special About An M?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
MarkP Posted December 27, 2015 Share #162 Posted December 27, 2015 Nick, these are really exceptional and the first and third shots are so very Australian (not sure about the second, maybe Brisbane?) Perhaps you would consider posting them a second time in the Australian Landscape thread which can be found in the Photo Forum under "Landscape and Travel"? Agreed :-) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgk Posted December 27, 2015 Share #163 Posted December 27, 2015 Why is ephemeral taken as a bad thing when in the long run the banal, short-sighted may possibly produce the richest view of the time it was created? Value of images is becoming inclined today to be toward series rather than a well framed, archival embalmed scene Imagine some time in the future where people discover some old media. Among the images are some 8x10" contact prints of the west, Adams and his emulators if you will. Then there are images identified as every-day images that, due to EXIF and deeper links can be attributed to what was important at the time and traced to the moment. I believe the AA kind of stuff will be tossed aside as the old stuff we know already. "He used a rangefinder" means something only to the optical athlete, a self-aggrandizemizing sort of thing. Nobody cares how you feel when you made the image. . Its due to AA and his emulators that we value places such as Yosemite as we do. National Parks and the like are a relatively recent phenomenon. AA's legacy is far beyond the aficiandos of his B&W photography. The continuing archive of such landscapes may be derivative but it shows areas which are valued and continues to ensure that they are valued. Living within walking distance of a National Park I can attest to the pressures on such areas and the need for continued pressure to be maintained to ensure that they are not infringed upon for unacceptable reasons. If the current photographic legacy is to be banal and short-sighted then its ephemeral nature is, in my eyes at least, a very good thing. The trouble with most images that I see of a 'general' nature, is that they are self-serving and introvert in that they say more about their creators than the world in general and whilst to a degree this is inevitable, their value as anything else vanishes to a large extent after a very short while unless archived (and I will be surprised if the most are having talked to friends and seen how most merely reside on their computer's hard-drive, often with no backup. And whilst the use of a rangefinder might mean little to anyone other than the photographer, it can mean something and offers an enjoyable alternative. Perhaps its like musical instruments - their specifics may mean little to a listening audience but their familiarity and precise nature may mean a great deal to each performer. Unless that is, you honestly believe that the performer could produce the same sound from any instrument - no, I don't think so. Perhaps we could extend the argument to cars - their make/model is irrelevant to anyone other than their driver - as long as they have 4 wheels and a working engine..... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exodies Posted December 27, 2015 Share #164 Posted December 27, 2015 What's special about an M? You don't have to listen to other people talk about their cameras. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
imants Posted December 27, 2015 Share #165 Posted December 27, 2015 You are trying to say that everything has got to be ephemeral and pointless. Not so. I never ever stated that imagery is pointless quite the opposite it has a new role in language and communication you just failed to read what i wrote It is all pretty exciting stuff That's like saying don't bother about Movies because we can all shoot clips. Yep the moving image is intertwined with language ............ thus a shift in movies as they merge with the game industry, multiple endings and plots abound the audience makes the choice These are taken on the M 240 with a 35mm Summarit using VSCO's Kodak Tri-X in Lightroom. see what is happening the strength of an image shared with an computer application lightroom, a preset simulating film and a m ................. all this is possible with a smartphone all be it low res at the moment but technology moves in a hurry and it will all merge as one. pgk there is a bus stop near you with a new bus service going to places you can only dream of , you can even take your M but it will be of little use . I have taken mine on occasions but found that I was just being selfish Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted December 27, 2015 Share #166 Posted December 27, 2015 OK Imants but what about Beauty in all that? You sound as if a Yamaha violin was the same thing as a Stradivari. True or false depending on the sort of music or photography. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
imants Posted December 27, 2015 Share #167 Posted December 27, 2015 Advertisement (gone after registration) OK Imants but what about Beauty in all that? There are a lot of people laughing and smiling whilst looking at their phones Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paulus Posted December 27, 2015 Share #168 Posted December 27, 2015 There are a lot of people laughing and smiling whilst looking at their phones Yes they are smiling. IMHO the most of them are smiling not at beauty, but because of happy thoughts, given to them by the person at the other end of the whats-app. I doesn't have to be a well made photo they are smiling at. I know at least two persons who can make wonderful pictures with their Iphone 6 and I value this pictures very much. But if I ask them , if they want to have my M instead. None of them will refuse... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JMF Posted December 27, 2015 Share #169 Posted December 27, 2015 Sold the Df ... kept the M2 ! by JM__, on Flickr Shot with a BP M2, a 50 Lux e43 ASPH and some film :-) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgk Posted December 27, 2015 Share #170 Posted December 27, 2015 I never ever stated that imagery is pointless quite the opposite it has a new role in language and communication you just failed to read what i wrote It is all pretty exciting stuff Yep the moving image is intertwined with language ............ thus a shift in movies as they merge with the game industry, multiple endings and plots abound the audience makes the choice see what is happening the strength of an image shared with an computer application lightroom, a preset simulating film and a m ................. all this is possible with a smartphone all be it low res at the moment but technology moves in a hurry and it will all merge as one. pgk there is a bus stop near you with a new bus service going to places you can only dream of , you can even take your M but it will be of little use . I have taken mine on occasions but found that I was just being selfish Language is a broad church and is now aided by countless images - still and moving - but these are the image equivalent of chatter for the most part. Shakespeare and small talk both use the same elements (words and grammar) - very differently and from very different sources. Both have their place and I wouldn't want to see either displaced by the other. There is still room for serious literary works alongside small talk - they are far apart but co-exist. Same with imagery. Exciting? Well depends on your view. I see a lot of poor, mediocre and occasionally some good imagery - but its posted and forgotten. Whilst technology moves fast it cannot displace the creative desire of pre-visualisation - computers cannot determine what a photographer 'sees' or imagines when viewing a scene and never will be able to IMO - we are too eclectic in our thinking and its improbable that all the influences determined by the human mind can ever be replicated with any degree of accuracy. The very fact that you accept there to be a need for higher res indicates that you foressee a need for higher' quality' and hence more appreciation of the image itself - we are back to better photography. I'm on the bus, perhaps not so much with my M as other cameras, and it is an exciting time but there is and will be a place for traditional imagery - like the M its survived for a long time and will continue to do so. Being selfish about what you use seems an odd concept - aren't people who shoot otherwise excellent images on a phone being just as selfish as they can't be used in many ways? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgk Posted December 27, 2015 Share #171 Posted December 27, 2015 [imagery] ..... has a new role in language and communication ..... It is all pretty exciting stuff pgk there is a bus stop near you with a new bus service going to places you can only dream of , you can even take your M but it will be of little use . I have taken mine on occasions but found that I was just being selfish Taken today just for you . Selfishly taken an M9 of course, whilst I'm not going to the places others are ! Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/254447-whats-special-about-an-m/?do=findComment&comment=2956781'>More sharing options...
Tailwagger Posted December 27, 2015 Share #172 Posted December 27, 2015 Maybe I'm missing the point, but if someone is a devotee of minimalism, I'm struggling to understand why they would summarily reject an image's legitimacy simply because it was made with a cell phone. Is a photograph made better because the tool employed is more or less difficult to wield? If a device is ubiquitous it must follow that everything it produces is commonplace as well? From an artistic skill POV, it strikes me that anyone who can elevate an iPhone jpeg to the level of a fine image is doing something that only a very few of us know how to do. I think that's worthy of not only of celebration, but of respect and study to see if it points in directions that allow the rest of us to elevate our own game regardless of the equipment employed. OTOH... this is a technique I doubt I'll ever attempt, let alone master with my M (apologies couldnt resist posting this shot, taken a couple weeks ago at a Celtics game prior to becoming Leic-a-fied) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgk Posted December 27, 2015 Share #173 Posted December 27, 2015 Try: http://www.juliancalverley.com/books/iphoneonly/ so phone imagescan be good, just that few aim to be anything more than a momentary record. and I have no problem with phone images Tailwagger, but they aren't the only way that images are taken nor distributed, nor utilised and most are anything but memorable. Just trying to persuade imants that his view of imagery is not the only one, nor is it shared by all. Doubt I'll succeed but its worth a go . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Posted December 27, 2015 Share #174 Posted December 27, 2015 Ubiquitous and unique. Can we say more of life? Port Townsend - iPhone 4s by Rick-Leica, on Flickr Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Bedford Posted December 27, 2015 Share #175 Posted December 27, 2015 I honestly don't care how an image was made as long as it engages me, though I do like the technical details. I often leave my M at home and just shoot with my phone, or I take a cheap compact film camera or something. Our ability to compose doesn't disappear if we don't have a full frame rangefinder on us, we are just given more constraints to work within. For example, there won't be depth of field to play with on a phone, and the lens might be limited to a wide 28mm equivalent. But what you lack in large sensor benefits, you make up for in composition, colour and tone. Nevertheless, those large sensor aspects shouldn't mean you can forget these general photographis aspects. My example photos are all deep depth of field anyway. They could have been taken on a phone and made to look close enough, albeit without the refinement of a full frame body, high quality lens and raw processing. I guess what I'm saying is that I follow a lot of photographers on social media who post beautifully refined images that are made with a smartphone, and I love it. The technical details of how an image was made shouldn't change how "good" it is. As far as the M goes, I use it because it's a beautiful thing to hold and look through, and it's shutter sound is wonderful. It's a lovely bonus that the image quality is great to boot. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
imants Posted December 27, 2015 Share #176 Posted December 27, 2015 pgk I never said that high res was vital just that it wil come and with some phone apps it is here and sits nicely on small screens ............. but you view the world is solely from a western perspective . most are anything but memorable Enjoy and may your coffin be full of prints you made with your m for all to see Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgk Posted December 28, 2015 Share #177 Posted December 28, 2015 ............. but you view the world is solely from a western perspective . You might be very surprised, if that is, we could discuss things at greater depth than through the inevitable superficiality of the internet. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hepcat Posted December 28, 2015 Share #178 Posted December 28, 2015 New to the party, my M arrives in a few hours. Thought I'd chime in that I don't seem to fall into any of those groups. For many years, I've greatly admired the images I've seen come from M cameras when in capable hands, but up to this point I've resisted largely due to the hefty entry fee, the percieved or otherwise difficulties of precise framing and manual focusing with an aging pair of eyes and, to a lesser degree, a desire to keep my distance from the kind of folks that comprise the second group mentioned above. What's changed? Nothing really, accept for an unexpected windfall coniciding with a renewed level of curiousity. Perhaps, I'll matriculate to group one eventually, time will tell. But in all honesty I'm no purist, I just want to make the best photographs I'm capable of producing. If the M works in that regard its a win, if not I'll move on, but not without continuing to admire the work of others for whom it does. I highly value simplicity, but in the end its all about the image. My return to a true rangefinder after many, many years is really an educational experiment. We'll see how it works out and whether or not I too find the M to be special. Regardless, I look forward to finally joining the Leica fraternity after all these years. Welcome to the Forums. It sounds to me, from reading your posts, that you're in the group of folks who buy a Leica to use it to make images, and figure out a way to make images even when you're doing things that may not be a forte of the rangefinder camera. When it comes down to it, there is nothing you can't do with a Leica that you can do with any other camera... some things are just a little more difficult. As I've gotten lazy in my old age about some of those, I've gotten a DSLR body that has live-view because it's brighter than my Visoflex III; that said, it's merely for convenience, not need. And FWIW, the DSLR I have has manual controls similar to the M... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hepcat Posted December 28, 2015 Share #179 Posted December 28, 2015 ............. but you view the world is solely from a western perspective . Can you explain what a "western perspective" is, exactly? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hepcat Posted December 29, 2015 Share #180 Posted December 29, 2015 pgk there is a bus stop near you with a new bus service going to places you can only dream of , you can even take your M but it will be of little use . I have taken mine on occasions but found that I was just being selfish Who are you trying to impress with your images? If you're making images to impress someone other than yourself, then you're off the bus anyway. And here's the deal... after being on the bus for years... and chasing the bus when I wasn't on it, I've figured out that the neither the bus nor where it's going matter. They don't matter at all any more. The bus is owned by manufacturers who are taking consumers for a ride. I have chosen to get off the bus at the stop I wanted, and I'm actually doing what I want now... and I don't really give a d*mn who is on the bus, who is chasing the bus, and whether or not any of those folks even care that I'm not there any more. Imaging is imaging, whether you're using wet plates or an iPhone 6s. There's no way to tell just by looking what equipment made any particular print. If I'm comfortable using the equipment I own to make the images I want to make, then does anything else really matter? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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