michaelwj Posted November 6, 2014 Share #1 Â Posted November 6, 2014 Advertisement (gone after registration) Hi All, Â I recently picked up a v3 50mm cron from Tamarkin, The lens is in great nick, and works perfectly on a friends M2, but on my M6 it won't focus closer than ~1m. I've had a look from the back of the camera and the issue appears to be that it is mounting too far anticlockwise (from the back of the camera). The cam hits the steep side of the cutaway in the lens mount, limiting its outward movement. If I depress the lens release button and turn the lens the smallest bit clockwise, it focuses fine. Of course it can't be used that way as it falls off. Â I've used other lenses on the body from CV and Konica without problem, but this is the first Leica lens I've used. I'm thinking its a body issue since it works on an M2, but not sure what to do or if anyone has come across this before? Â If anyone has any idea on possible fixes I'd be really grateful. Tamarkin have offered for me to return the item, but its an otherwise really nice copy and I'd prefer to make it work. Â Cheers, Michael Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted November 6, 2014 Posted November 6, 2014 Hi michaelwj, Take a look here M6 50v3 cron close focus issue. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
michaelwj Posted November 7, 2014 Author Share #2 Â Posted November 7, 2014 Anybody?? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Printmaker Posted November 7, 2014 Share #3 Â Posted November 7, 2014 I have this same lens (1969 Tiger claw) and it works fine on my M9 as it did on my M8 and M4. The front of this lens unscrews. Check to see if the head is tight. You might want to check your focus at infinity as something might have gotten into the threads and is keeping the elements from seating properly. Â When focused at .7 meter, the brass should be flush with the lowest point of the flange cutaway. At infinity, the brass should be flush with the highest point of the flange. (The remaining 80% of the flange.) Â It is also possible that someone has filed the cutaway for some obscure reason. Â I've got a client meeting in a minute and need to break free from the computer. If this does not help, let me know and I'll photograph the lens mount over the weekend so you can compare. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaelwj Posted November 7, 2014 Author Share #4 Â Posted November 7, 2014 Thanks, what does "tiger claw" refer to? The lens is not loose, and works prefectly on an M2 on loan to me. I've developed some shots from the M6, and the focus is spot on - it just doesn't follow closer than 1m. The brass is exactly as you describe. I'm a bit flummoxed! Cheers, Michael Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bocaburger Posted November 7, 2014 Share #5 Â Posted November 7, 2014 Bizzare. I used that model lens (11817) with 4 different M6's from an early Wetzlar to one of the last before the TTL and it focused fine with all of them. The front part of it is not designed to be removable btw, although it can come unscrewed. Â I would understand if it didn't focus to infinity due to interference within the camera opening, but I don't see how it can prevent the lens from extending outward to close focus. Is it that the lens physically won't turn to .7m, or just that the rangefinder decouples after 1m? That is adjustable, although it makes no sense that it should work with other lenses and not this one. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaelwj Posted November 7, 2014 Author Share #6 Â Posted November 7, 2014 Hi, it is just that the rangefinder cam physically hits the steep side of the mount and no longer follows the brass. It's really only touching by a tiny bit. I actually think I could just shave the tiniest bit off the steep side and it would work okay. Going to try on another M6 today and see how it goes. Cheers, Michael Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
250swb Posted November 8, 2014 Share #7 Â Posted November 8, 2014 Advertisement (gone after registration) Are you sure this isn't a case of the lens being over rotated on the mount? The same problem people have with getting the wrong frameline, they have their finger on the lens release button and rotate the lens past the lens lock? So, are you letting the lens click into place? If it doesn't click into place it is not unknown for the locking notch machined into the mount to have become swaged over at the edges with wear. It is often just a case of taking a very sharp knife and running it around the edges of the notch to remove the burr. Â The other thing I would look at is to check if the lens mounting flange has rotated slightly. To re-centre it just loosen the screws that hold the flange to the lens and gradually tighten them opposite to opposite. Â Steve Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaelwj Posted November 8, 2014 Author Share #8 Â Posted November 8, 2014 Hi Steve, the lens locks quite securely in place on my camera and others. I was at a local store today and tried it on lots of other bodies. Only not working properly on mine. It could be the mount is worn on the body, but I've never had this problem with any other lenses, which I tried more of today. The shop staff gave me the number of their leica repairman and told me to call him directly. I think it's the best way forward at this stage. I'll report back when I know more. Cheers, Michael Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
philipus Posted November 8, 2014 Share #9 Â Posted November 8, 2014 Sorry you're having trouble with the 11817. I tried mine on my M4 and TTL. The focusing ring goes a little bit further than the 0.7m marking. On the M4, the rangefinder patch stops at 0.7m precisely and on the TTL the patch goes all the way to the closest focusing distance of the lens. Â I hope the service will correct this for you. Philip Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bocaburger Posted November 8, 2014 Share #10 Â Posted November 8, 2014 It sounds to me as if he's saying that as the optical cell moves outward for close focusing the rangefinder follower wheel contacts some part of the lens' rear flange and can't continue to move forward. If that's the case then the follower arm is somehow set too high (or bent upward on a slight angle). It might not happen with other lenses if there's a little more clearance between the flange and the cam. A service tech should be able to fix it easily. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaelwj Posted November 8, 2014 Author Share #11 Â Posted November 8, 2014 Hi bocaburger, that what I think is happening, this lens must just be a bit tighter with tolerances. Cheers Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Printmaker Posted November 10, 2014 Share #12 Â Posted November 10, 2014 Sorry I didn't get back to you sooner Michael. With 4 computers in front of me most of the week, I like to unplug over the weekend. Â This lens is called "Tiger Claw" because when you focus the lens your left hand mimics a Kung Fu move by the the same name. Â As for the head that unscrews, at the time of introduction you could purchase an 39 mm thread screw adaptor that let you use the lens assembly on an enlarger or bellows. Few did and the adaptor faded away. It was a long time ago and I forget if it was a Leica or Novoflex part. And I think I remember my old Dual Range 50 Summicron unscrewed as well. Â What sets this lens design apart from the other 50 Summicrons is this design maximizes contrast at the slight cost of resolution. Modern Zeiss designs perform this same way. However, at 45 years old, the slight bump in micro contrast has probably faded as the coatings have aged. Â This version of the 50 Summicron is one of those "Leica Glow" lenses with a sharp center and softer edges. I find it a wonderful portrait lens. It has a character all its own. Â Hope you sort this one out. It is a nice lens. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdlaing Posted November 10, 2014 Share #13  Posted November 10, 2014 Thanks, what does "tiger claw" refer to? The lens is not loose, and works prefectly on an M2 on loan to me. I've developed some shots from the M6, and the focus is spot on - it just doesn't follow closer than 1m. The brass is exactly as you describe. I'm a bit flummoxed! Cheers, Michael  Tiger Claw refers to the shape of the focusing tab that sticks out from the lens. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Printmaker Posted November 10, 2014 Share #14 Â Posted November 10, 2014 Tiger Claw refers to the shape of the focusing tab that sticks out from the lens. Â There is no focusing tab on a version 3 50 Summicron. Version 2 has a metal tab (I'm not sure you can call it a tab... more of a arm) and version 4 has a tab. Version 4 is optically the same as version 5 which is the current - non apo - 50 mm Summicron. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdlaing Posted November 10, 2014 Share #15  Posted November 10, 2014 There is no focusing tab on a version 3 50 Summicron. Version 2 has a metal tab (I'm not sure you can call it a tab... more of a arm) and version 4 has a tab. Version 4 is optically the same as version 5 which is the current - non apo - 50 mm Summicron.  This is a Tiger Claw focusing tab. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/236640-m6-50v3-cron-close-focus-issue/?do=findComment&comment=2704246'>More sharing options...
Printmaker Posted November 10, 2014 Share #16 Â Posted November 10, 2014 That is a version 4. Â Version 3 has a painted red dot and no tab. Â When I bought my first new 50 mm Summicron in 1969, it was just a 50 mm Summicron. When I rebought the same model 10 years ago, I was told that it was a Tiger Claw and given that story. Salesmen have been known to stretch the truth or be mistaken. When I have the time, I'll google it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Printmaker Posted November 10, 2014 Share #17 Â Posted November 10, 2014 Google says you are right. Version 4 and only from 1980 to 1983 is the Tiger Claw. Â Here is this source: Â http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=112121 Â Sorry to misinform. Good story though. I believed him. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdlaing Posted November 10, 2014 Share #18  Posted November 10, 2014 Google says you are right. Version 4 and only from 1980 to 1983 is the Tiger Claw. Here is this source:  http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=112121  Sorry to misinform. Good story though. I believed him.  He is a good salesman. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaelwj Posted November 10, 2014 Author Share #19 Â Posted November 10, 2014 Hi All, yep, mine has no tab. I don't like a tab on a 50. Â I use a 50 more like a considered portrait lens, which is why I sought out this particular model, the results so far, even with the focus following all the way are spectacular. Â I'm not flush with cash, I've got a young family and I'm a research physicist (not the highest paying job in the world), so I thought long and hard about this purchase. It's the most I've ever spent on a single piece of photographic equipment. Since a 50 for me is a person lens, I was going to get the ZM 1.5/50, I think it has a beautiful rendering. But, ever since I got a leica, I've always wanted a 'cron, and I knew if I got the ZM, I'd still want the 'cron. Since I can't justify both, I went for the v3 'cron, which from what I'd seen has a lot of the characteristics I liked in the ZM. So far, it doesn't disappoint, and I think I'll be happy for a long time with it once I get the focus issue sorted. Â Cheers, Michael Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomB_tx Posted November 11, 2014 Share #20 Â Posted November 11, 2014 It won't disappoint. I bought mine in '69 and it was my main lens for 40 years. After retiring and getting an M9, I added the current Summicron as a better match for digital, but the '69 still does wonderful images. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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