chrismuc Posted October 3, 2014 Share #1 Posted October 3, 2014 Advertisement (gone after registration) At the Photokina Leica booth I tried the new Leica S with the S 100f2 lens. The combination feels very balanced in the hand, the viewfinder is big and bright and the autofocus feels quick. But ... neither me nor the Leica sales guy were able to make sharp pictures at open aperture. Why? Two reasons: 1. That particular camera body - lens combination had significant back focus. And the S (007) - in contrary to every current 24x36 or APS-C mirror reflex camera - still does not offer af micro adjustment, so no way to compensate this misalignment. Do Leica S users face this problem and is Leica able to re-adjust the af? Is this typically a camera or a lens issue? 2. If focussed on the eye of a person with the center af area and then recomposed the portrait, the focus must be out of focus at f2 due to the changed distance during recomposing. The Leica S is lacking a multi-point af like the Pentax 645 Z or a recomposing-compensation-feature like "true-focus" offered in Hasselblad H cameras since several years. This lack makes such fast lenses much less attractive in real use IMO. (For example using the Fuij X-T1 with an outside center focus point and the very shallow depth of field Fuji X 56f1.2 lens, it always astonishes me how precisely the autofocus works even at open aperture.) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted October 3, 2014 Posted October 3, 2014 Hi chrismuc, Take a look here Photokina: Leica S (007) + 100f2. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Likaleica Posted October 3, 2014 Share #2 Posted October 3, 2014 I would like to see a "true focus" feature on the S as well, and it seems like it could be done with a firmware update because the 006 and 007 have motion sensors in them to indicate horizon. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alejandro AR Posted October 3, 2014 Share #3 Posted October 3, 2014 I also tested that combo at Photokina and had no issue. In your case it may have been an issue with your pre-production camera. I also talked to a Leica technician about exactly the same true focus idea as Hasselblad has. The answer was that the distance to the focus plane for the S is even at f2.0 and the 100 not big enough to cause an out of focus at recomposing. Nevertheless he listened to exactly the same idea you mentioned (using the electronic level control). Regarding the micro adjustment of the autofocus to the lens: again, we also discussed that topic and the answer I got is that this is not needed as every lens auto-adjusts when connected to the camera. You can observe a quick focus/refocus when you connect the lens. In that moment it does an internal measure vs. a reference and readjusts if needed. That's probably one of the reasons for the extreme precision of the autocus. Furthermore the focus motor - according to Leica- can use way more positions than those of the competition. Hope that helps. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrismuc Posted October 3, 2014 Author Share #4 Posted October 3, 2014 I also guess it was a preliminary camera - lens issue with the back focusing. But: The root cause for that kind of af imprecision is a difference in distance between lens mount to AF sensor and lens mount to CCD/CMOS sensor. How should the camera be able to calibrate itself - it would have to reposition the AF sensor, does the S really do such thing? Regarding the true focus topic: At a distance of the portrait person of let's say 1.2m and the eye might be 40cm higher than the center of the image, the distance difference between the image center to the sensor and the eye to the sensor is 6.5 cm. At f2 the depth of field at 100mm focal length and a circle of confusion of two pixel = 12um is only 0,6 cm = 1/10 of the distance shift, so the eye would be easily out of focus and the statement of the Leica representative is simply not true. (I face that problem all the time with my Contax 645 with a high resolution digital back and center focus point.) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arif Posted October 3, 2014 Share #5 Posted October 3, 2014 I tested the same combination in Tokyo and there were no issues at all in focussing. In fact it was very sharp and sharper than the HC 100 that I tested side-by-side. The eyes stayed in focus in my case. I really liked the lens and ordered it. Was hoping to test go out and shoot today but seems there is a typhoon coming ;( Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
John McMaster Posted October 4, 2014 Share #6 Posted October 4, 2014 What other lenses do you have? I would have bought a CS version of the 100mm but with 70mm and 120mm (both non-CS) I am not sure what it offers.... john Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ynp Posted October 4, 2014 Share #7 Posted October 4, 2014 Advertisement (gone after registration) What other lenses do you have? I would have bought a CS version of the 100mm but with 70mm and 120mm (both non-CS) I am not sure what it offers.... john I am afraid there will never be a CS version of the 100mm. At least the Leica rep at Photokina said that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
John McMaster Posted October 5, 2014 Share #8 Posted October 5, 2014 I know, which is why I asked what the 100mm Summicron would offer primarily over the 120mm APO-Macro.... john Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arif Posted October 5, 2014 Share #9 Posted October 5, 2014 I know, which is why I asked what the 100mm Summicron would offer primarily over the 120mm APO-Macro.... john For me the 80 focal length and and the size was a big plus. I also have the 70 and 120 but the 120 is a non-CS version so was thinking of selling. Am attaching a picture taken yesterday (natural light, handheld, F2.8, Leica S2). PM me if you want a bigger version. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/234942-photokina-leica-s-007-100f2/?do=findComment&comment=2683538'>More sharing options...
John McMaster Posted October 5, 2014 Share #10 Posted October 5, 2014 Thanks, I use the close-up features of the 120mm too much to sell it. Any chance of a shot with 100mm and 120mm wide open and trying to get subject about the same size? Just to see sharpness, DoF comparison etc.... john Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arif Posted October 6, 2014 Share #11 Posted October 6, 2014 Thanks, I use the close-up features of the 120mm too much to sell it. Any chance of a shot with 100mm and 120mm wide open and trying to get subject about the same size? Just to see sharpness, DoF comparison etc.... john Hi John, Would love to oblige but have a typhoon running around so will have to wait a little. Arif Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
John McMaster Posted October 6, 2014 Share #12 Posted October 6, 2014 Thanks, no great rush ;-) john Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sortvitt Posted October 6, 2014 Share #13 Posted October 6, 2014 Two shots with the Summicron-S 100/S006 from a workshop yesterday, - very sharp and fast to work with. The combo still hunts in low light, but a lot less than previous FW on a 120mm. This lens is a keeper for me, it slots in nicely between 70 and 120. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/234942-photokina-leica-s-007-100f2/?do=findComment&comment=2684137'>More sharing options...
hoppyman Posted October 6, 2014 Share #14 Posted October 6, 2014 Just stop it you guys posting samples from the Summicron I had convinced myself that I only need the 120 and it is wonderful..... but so is that Summicron apparently. Managing to make do with the APO 120 in the meantime Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/234942-photokina-leica-s-007-100f2/?do=findComment&comment=2684685'>More sharing options...
John McMaster Posted October 7, 2014 Share #15 Posted October 7, 2014 This lens is a keeper for me, it slots in nicely between 70 and 120. I guess it does, I use 50/75/85/90 on M and have 50/60/80/100 for the R, just the S stuff costs more ;-) Oddly, no MTF or distortion details have been released yet... john Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Likaleica Posted October 10, 2014 Share #16 Posted October 10, 2014 Each S lens has published MTF and distortion curves Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
erlingmm Posted October 10, 2014 Share #17 Posted October 10, 2014 Each S lens has published MTF and distortion curves I have not seen the MTF for the 100mm f/2 published yet (but I love the lens) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
John McMaster Posted October 12, 2014 Share #18 Posted October 12, 2014 It is not designated as an APO, are you seeing CA like the 70mm gets? john Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
basse Posted October 12, 2014 Share #19 Posted October 12, 2014 I would say Yes Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/234942-photokina-leica-s-007-100f2/?do=findComment&comment=2687542'>More sharing options...
basse Posted October 12, 2014 Share #20 Posted October 12, 2014 ... one more example: Original size and 100% crop Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/234942-photokina-leica-s-007-100f2/?do=findComment&comment=2687554'>More sharing options...
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