Puzzling service from Camera Electronic

[jonogilmour]

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Sent a few lenses (non-Leica, but I use them on my Leica) to camera electronic's service centre in Western Australia few weeks ago as I didn't want to deal with Camera Clinic in Victoria (they'd stuffed me around a lot previously). Went with CES based on recommendations on this here forum, but I'm left confused to say the least.

 

So I enquired about the cost of a lens repair/CLA, and got a response that said I could send them in and the tech could check them over. I quote from that reply:

 

"You can send them in to us and as soon as we receive it our Tech will have a look and then we will give you a Quote on the cost of the CLA."

 

So I sent them over as this seemed reasonable. Worst case scenario I'm out $15 for shipping. A few weeks have passed and with no email stating that they had been inspected or anything, I sent them an email.

 

Today I received a reply:

 

"Apologies for the late reply. Your lenses have been cleaned and Serviced. It will be $165/Lens for a total of $495 and then $15 shipping. Do you want to do a Credit Card Payment over the phone or Direct debit?"

 

Needless to say I was extremely alarmed. Not only did they not give me a quote, they went ahead and did the whole service without even telling me. I'll pay the cost, as it seems a fairly reasonable price for three lenses, but at the same time this seems to completely contradict their first email to me above.

 

What if it ended up being several hundred dollars more? How would I escape that sort of situation.

 

Not only this, but when I asked why they had done the repair without first consulting me, they replied:

 

"It's sometimes difficult to give an Quote on older lenses, as some parts/lenses needs to be opened up 1st to see how much work is needed and then we do Quotes if major repairs/cleaning is need. "

 

First of all, I gave a description of the lenses, and how old they were before I even sent them. Why couldnt he tell me that he couldn't give me a quote because they were old lenses initially? Secondly, it seems a fairly rude response with no apology for misleading me in the first place.

 

Can anyone tell me if this is a normal practice and if what he says (old lenses = hard to give a quote without doing the job entirely) is at all true?

 

Seems I'm a magnet for poor service.

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[jaapv]

I think that legally you can refuse to pay and demand that the lenses be returned in the original state.

[rirakuma]

Did you fill out a form before you sent the lens to them? I can't remember if that form has a box for "quote only" or not. Anyway I still think they should've given you the quote before they went ahead with the repair because when I sent lenses to them they gave me a rough estimate on the repair cost before I committed. If you signed the form for a repair there's a good chance you will have to pay the bill before getting the lens back. That being said I don't know what kind of work they did on your lens but $165 "repair" per lens seems like a good deal.

[jonogilmour]

I think that legally you can refuse to pay and demand that the lenses be returned in the original state.

 

Good to know, however I don't think that reapplying funghus to a lens is feasible here

 

Did you fill out a form before you sent the lens to them? I can't remember if that form has a box for "quote only" or not. Anyway I still think they should've given you the quote before they went ahead with the repair because when I sent lenses to them they gave me a rough estimate on the repair cost before I committed. If you signed the form for a repair there's a good chance you will have to pay the bill before getting the lens back. That being said I don't know what kind of work they did on your lens but $165 "repair" per lens seems like a good deal.

 

I didn't fill out a form, the only exchange was me asking what the process was, then them saying "We will look at them, quote you, otherwise we can just return them". I agree that $165 is fairly reasonable seeing as I had been quoted 300 dollars for one lens, and I'm happy to pay, however it's just alarming that they just went behind my back and did this without even a courtesy email.

 

My main concern is what if they had come back and said it was $350 per lens? I certainly wouldn't accept that, but they would give me no choice (bar going with Jaap's suggestion).

[MarkP]

But it wasn't $350 per lens.

 

I agree they probably should probably have contacted you.

 

It is not unreasonable for them to charge for the time taken to assess the lens. This may have cost at least $50 in labour and once open, if they only needed CLA with no parts or major repairs, they probably just did that and charged you for the labour.

 

Seems like a bargain if you are happy with the lenses when they're back.

[rirakuma]

Sorry silly me, I just realised you're talking about Camera Electronic in Perth and I got it mixed up with Camera Clinic in Melbourne. You could send an email to Saul Frank the owner of the shop, he's a very nice guy and I'm sure he would have a better explanation for you.

 

I recall him mentioning that he has an independent technician. There may be a chance of miscommunication between the phone attendant and the technician because the details wasn't written in form. They probably deal with large volumes of request and this one could have accidentally slipped through. I shouldn't answer for them but my past experience with Camera Electronic have been pleasant so I'm just giving my thoughts.

 

Good to know, however I don't think that reapplying funghus to a lens is feasible here

 

 

 

I didn't fill out a form, the only exchange was me asking what the process was, then them saying "We will look at them, quote you, otherwise we can just return them". I agree that $165 is fairly reasonable seeing as I had been quoted 300 dollars for one lens, and I'm happy to pay, however it's just alarming that they just went behind my back and did this without even a courtesy email.

 

My main concern is what if they had come back and said it was $350 per lens? I certainly wouldn't accept that, but they would give me no choice (bar going with Jaap's suggestion).

[MarkP]

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I think that legally you can refuse to pay and demand that the lenses be returned in the original state.

 

Great- they can sprinkle some dust from one of the 'charming' Gina Rinehart's Western Australian mines back into those nice clean lenses.

[jonogilmour]

But it wasn't $350 per lens.

 

I agree they probably should probably have contacted you.

 

It is not unreasonable for them to charge for the time taken to assess the lens. This may have cost at least $50 in labour and once open, if they only needed CLA with no parts or major repairs, they probably just did that and charged you for the labour.

 

Seems like a bargain if you are happy with the lenses when they're back.

 

Here is the email I sent to them originally:

 

"Hello,

 

I was wondering what it would cost to clean and lubricate lenses. Having sent my Leica in to Camera Clinic here in Melbourne, and having waited months and months for the repair to complete, I have second thoughts about sending my lenses to them for repair, and would even rather send them to you guys in Perth as I've heard quite a few glowing recommendations online of CES.

 

...Descriptions of the lenses...

 

I can send photos of the lenses if need be. If you could give me a possible ballpark figure for each repair that would be great (provided that's possible). I'd also like to know what the process is with sending the lenses from Melbourne to Perth and back again. Do you need to take a look at the lenses first in order to give me a quote? And if so, is there a charge for this?"

 

So I did ask if there would be a charge for inspecting them, which typically if the repair goes ahead is simply mixed into the total charge for the repair (based on other repairers I've looked up). I would have happily paid this charge if this was the case. I asked as many questions as I could, and their response was just "Send them in, we will look at them and give you a quote. It's $15 to return them to you."

 

They didn't "charge for the time taken to assess the lens". They could have, and they could have said they would prior to me sending them (and I would have been fine with it), but they didn't. I was sending them over under the premise that they would follow the process outlined in their reply, which was send, inspect, quote, repair. Instead it was send, repair.

 

I think it isn't unreasonable to expect even a little communication; as I said, I had to email them in order to get an update.

 

I'm not ungrateful for what appears to be a pretty cheap CLA job on all three, and in fact I've already paid for it, but I think that if this is their standard process it needs a bit of rethinking.

 

Sorry silly me, I just realised you're talking about Camera Electronic in Perth and I got it mixed up with Camera Clinic in Melbourne. You could send an email to Saul Frank the owner of the shop, he's a very nice guy and I'm sure he would have a better explanation for you.

 

I recall him mentioning that he has an independent technician. There may be a chance of miscommunication between the phone attendant and the technician because the details wasn't written in form. They probably deal with large volumes of request and this one could have accidentally slipped through. I shouldn't answer for them but my past experience with Camera Electronic have been pleasant so I'm just giving my thoughts.

 

Thanks Rirakuma.

 

All communication was done via email. By "said" I meant "wrote"

 

I read a lot of recommendations for them on here, and they seem pretty popular (Ernest in particular) and based my decision on that. Look, I'm not complaining about the price or the time taken to repair them (I'm happy with those parts), I would have just appreciated at least some communication from them. Glad to hear this is not the normal process.

[hoppyman]

It does sound like a communication slip up. However the price charged sounds like an absolute bargain. On the single dealing I had with that technician I just rang and spoke with him and then sent an M3 for a routine CLA (no identified actual faults I had seen). The camera was inspected and then returned to me at no charge because everything was operating to specification (the previous owner must have had it serviced).

 

 

I'd take that slip up up as a bonus I think, saving some time on approval of quotes ;-)

I hope that the lenses perform very well for you.

[iphoenix]

Hi Jono; If Ernest did the CLAs, I'm sure you will be happy with the results.

 

Having had a similar experience with Camera Clinic as you, I've used Camera Electronic for the last 2 years; servicing an M2, M4 and an M4P. The first time (in 2012) I asked for, and received, a "guesstimate". Since then I haven't bothered. I've found that they are not cheap, but you certainly get a good job done and it is well worth the money.

 

By the way, I see you are in Melbourne. My experience with sending cameras from Rosebud to Perth is that Aust. Post takes between 6 and 10 days to deliver. The return journey on each occasion has taken well under 24 hours!!

 

Regards,

David

[Echo63]

By the way, I see you are in Melbourne. My experience with sending cameras from Rosebud to Perth is that Aust. Post takes between 6 and 10 days to deliver. The return journey on each occasion has taken well under 24 hours!!

 

Regards,

David

 

thats normal, it takes forever to get anything to Perth

I have had express post packages (next day delivery) take a week to arrive, at the office, which is inside the "next day delivery" area, I just expect express post to take 3 days minimum now (and normal post takes even longer)

[jonogilmour]

Hi Jono; If Ernest did the CLAs, I'm sure you will be happy with the results.

 

Having had a similar experience with Camera Clinic as you, I've used Camera Electronic for the last 2 years; servicing an M2, M4 and an M4P. The first time (in 2012) I asked for, and received, a "guesstimate". Since then I haven't bothered. I've found that they are not cheap, but you certainly get a good job done and it is well worth the money.

 

By the way, I see you are in Melbourne. My experience with sending cameras from Rosebud to Perth is that Aust. Post takes between 6 and 10 days to deliver. The return journey on each occasion has taken well under 24 hours!!

 

Regards,

David

 

Thanks for your comments David!

 

I agree, the package took ages to get to Perth...

[trojancast]

Life is short, too short to worry about what might have happened. There are ways to protect yourself in the future, but for now, go out and enjoy your refurbished lenses. Peace.

[paulsydaus]

Since they did the work without quoting first, you have every right not to pay and ask for your lenses back...

[Ivar B]

Since they did the work without quoting first, you have every right not to pay and ask for your lenses back...

 

Asking to get something for nothing is a rather red attitude and may not be the best policy in the long run

[paulsydaus]

Umm, hmm, okaaay...

 

Asking to get something for nothing is a rather red attitude and may not be the best policy in the long run

[ALD]

What I can say about Camera Electronic is this:

 

They are the best camera store in the Southern Hemisphere. You can trust them to not screw you over. B&H photo is my other favourite in the northern hemisphere. Pros.

 

Perhaps the transaction was not perfect, yes you are right, communication was not perfect. But pick up the phone and have a chat with Saul or his Dad and you will get great service. I suspect they were busy and pragmatic. Western Australia is an expensive place run by small minds that are greedy and think short term. it's what happens when the only initiative is to sell bulk resources cheap, keeping good employees is hard in that messed up economy. A good tradesman there in Perth can charge what he wants basically because tradesmen are rare in general and getting a guy to look and quote at your blocked toilet without screwing the rest of your plumbing will cost you about $150 and add another couple of hundred to fix anything, that is about as cheap as actual cleaning of your lens. A lens is a complex object opening one up to clean it or quote on it is not a 5 minute job. Camera electronic does repairs perfectly.

 

If you want to get abused after making a query or lied to or ripped off or have a shoddy repair I can name a store or two for you in Germany, Australia or New Zealand. I think you should just accept that things never went well according to your plans but that your lens have been done properly. If you chat to them about it , next time they will try harder. I would prefer to just deal with them if I could, but I move around internationally and the customs charges always screws me around.

 

I just know how genuine they are with their customers, Saul or his dad are great guys.

[Echo63]

Was speaking to a mate who dropped his canon 24-70 at a gig a few weeks back.

 

He took the lens into Camera Electronic, and asked for a quote for his insurance company, they had the lens fixed instead (a $400ish repair).

 

So it isn't the first time this has happened.

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[algrove]

Not Aussie Mate, however miscommunication or not, if YOU did not attach a note requesting a quote from them in writing then you have opened yourself to this issue.

 

BUT if you asked for a quote prior to work being done, then they are at fault and personally I would never do business with this place again since in this case they have no respect for customer wishes. All CLA's I have had done I knew precisely the amount each lens would cost prior to work being performed irregardless of its age or condition.