pgk Posted July 11, 2014 Share #1 Posted July 11, 2014 Advertisement (gone after registration) Whilst not strictly relevant as a Leica item, I wonder if anyone can tell me what era this dates from? I picked it up for a pittance and it intrigues me. Would Leicas have ever been used with such illuminants and if so how would they have triggered the ribbon? (I did photograph it with Leica lens;)). I've posted on the RFF too but any info would be interesting. Amazingly, though not in good condition its in (most of) its original box, and is complete with rather fragile instructions which seem to indicate that its a storage mechanism and a holder for burning the ribbon (surely not?) and claims sufficient ribbon inside for 300 exposures. Its marked Kodak, Holborn, London (Kodak was still there in the late seventies, early eighties). Anyone? Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/230347-magnesium-flash-ribbon/?do=findComment&comment=2628239'>More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted July 11, 2014 Posted July 11, 2014 Hi pgk, Take a look here Magnesium Flash Ribbon. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Orient XI Posted July 11, 2014 Share #2 Posted July 11, 2014 I would imagine it dates from the 1920's. Why one would need to buy it when a pair of pliers would do the job shows the power of Kodak at the time! It would be used in the technique known as "open flash" the camera is placed on a tripod and the shutter opened on a B or T setting. If the photographer or his assistant walked around the subject whilst the ribbon was burning the lighting could be made fairly even. Obviously the use of ribbon would be confined to static subjects as all spontaneity would be lost on animate subjects. Exposure could be determined by "experience" or guesswork. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted July 11, 2014 Share #3 Posted July 11, 2014 It provided Al Jolson with the inspiration for the Black and White Minstrel Show :D Although it was not as bad as Flash Powder, which could literally blow up in your face. (And yes, I am old, but not so old as to have used this ) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gyoung Posted July 11, 2014 Share #4 Posted July 11, 2014 Such things were still in occasional use when I started in professional photography in the 60s. And even by 1970 I worked with an old stager who wouldn't use these newfangled PF60s. He used an (original) Gandolfi and looked scathingly at my Sinar. He once set fire to a stand at Earls Court with flashpowder. Gerry Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgk Posted July 11, 2014 Author Share #5 Posted July 11, 2014 Someone on RFF provided this link: http://www.photomemorabilia.co.uk/Il...h_History.html which bears out the late usage of such items. I also notice that (somewhat surprisingly in today's risk averse culture;)) you can still buy magnesium ribbon on ebay, which could make for interesting imagery...... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted July 11, 2014 Share #6 Posted July 11, 2014 Magnesium flash was first used in 1864. . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wda Posted July 11, 2014 Share #7 Posted July 11, 2014 Advertisement (gone after registration) I remember my father used exactly such a device with magnesium ribbon, in the 1930s, which had to be measured according to the flash output desired. Health and Safety officials would have had a field day, had they existed at the time. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
semi-ambivalent Posted July 11, 2014 Share #8 Posted July 11, 2014 Such things were still in occasional use when I started in professional photography in the 60s. And even by 1970 I worked with an old stager who wouldn't use these newfangled PF60s.He used an (original) Gandolfi and looked scathingly at my Sinar. He once set fire to a stand at Earls Court with flashpowder. Gerry He was an artifact of a now lost era; count yourself lucky to have made his acquaintance. The fire makes for excellent icing! s-a Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted July 12, 2014 Share #9 Posted July 12, 2014 I could imagine that magnesium ribbon might still be a practical way to shape light in interior photography, compared to multiple flash. More smooth and more control. Not that I am aware of anybody using it... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
erl Posted July 12, 2014 Share #10 Posted July 12, 2014 I have a faint memory of watching and 'old photographer' use magnesium ribbon for 'instant flash'. A smokey affair. I have clear memories of using expendable flash bulbs that I believe were (still are) filled with magnesium ribbon. More reliable than the first electronic flashes that I used! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pop Posted July 12, 2014 Share #11 Posted July 12, 2014 I have a faint memory of watching and 'old photographer' use magnesium ribbon for 'instant flash'. A smokey affair. I have clear memories of using expendable flash bulbs that I believe were (still are) filled with magnesium ribbon. More reliable than the first electronic flashes that I used! The reliability was, of course, due to rigorous QC at the factory. They tested each bulb before it was shipped. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
erl Posted July 12, 2014 Share #12 Posted July 12, 2014 A habit they picked up from match manufactures, no doubt. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgk Posted July 12, 2014 Author Share #13 Posted July 12, 2014 I also notice that (somewhat surprisingly in today's risk averse culture;)) you can still buy magnesium ribbon on ebay, which could make for interesting imagery...... In a fit of madness I've ordered a small (25g) roll. This could either be fun or..... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pop Posted July 12, 2014 Share #14 Posted July 12, 2014 In a fit of madness I've ordered a small (25g) roll. This could either be fun or..... Do not use during take off or landing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgk Posted July 12, 2014 Author Share #15 Posted July 12, 2014 Do not use during take off or landing. Just don't go there;). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
erl Posted July 12, 2014 Share #16 Posted July 12, 2014 I have a faint memory of watching and 'old photographer' use magnesium ribbon for 'instant flash'. A smokey affair. I have clear memories of using expendable flash bulbs that I believe were (still are) filled with magnesium ribbon. More reliable than the first electronic flashes that I used! Thinking back, maybe it was 'flash powder' I saw him use? Don't even know what that is! What I do know is that magnesium ribbon does not 'flash', but slow burns very brightly. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted July 12, 2014 Share #17 Posted July 12, 2014 [...] I have clear memories of using expendable flash bulbs that I believe were (still are) filled with magnesium ribbon. Magnesium in flashbulbs was phased out; replaced with zirconium which is brighter. I have cases of large flashbulbs, including some I'm a little frightened of such as the Mazda 75 used from aircraft for night recon, and some that have an ignition duration of almost two seconds. That's a lot of light! And heat. Image (not mine) shows Mazda 75 at far right, 1.75 second bulb just left of Mazda. The 1.75 is in a flash holder. It is not really that long. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pop Posted July 12, 2014 Share #18 Posted July 12, 2014 Thinking back, maybe it was 'flash powder' I saw him use? Don't even know what that is! What I do know is that magnesium ribbon does not 'flash', but slow burns very brightly. When anything burns, its constituents atoms or molecules attach to oxygen. The ribbon has a small surface, hence it takes a while until each atom is exposed to the air and can bind to an oxygen atom. Bulbs are filled with magnesium shave which has a rather large surface area. The same weight in the form of powder has an even larger surface area, such that the number of magnesium atoms which can find oxygen atoms at the same time is much larger, too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted July 12, 2014 Share #19 Posted July 12, 2014 When anything burns, its constituents atoms or molecules attach to oxygen. The ribbon has a small surface, hence it takes a while until each atom is exposed to the air and can bind to a oxygen atom. Bulbs are filled with magnesium shave which has a rather large surface area. The same weight in the form of powder has an even larger surface area, such that the number of magnesium atoms which can find oxygen atoms at the same time is much larger, too. Flashbulbs are filled with oxygen, not air which is mostly nitrogen. Does that make a difference? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pop Posted July 12, 2014 Share #20 Posted July 12, 2014 Flashbulbs are filled with oxygen, not air which is mostly nitrogen. Does that make a difference? It certainly should. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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