IWC Doppel Posted April 9, 2014 Share #1 Posted April 9, 2014 Advertisement (gone after registration) No this isnt a fair comparison, but interesting all the same from a post processing point of view, it's what's in built in camera and any thoughts on the B&W Leica jpgs... Here's the deal, with the Leica I record fine jpg in B&W and RAW, I often use the jpg if I'm short of time or not looking for the ultimate quality, I like the rendering of the B&W jpg and I use it more than I should...I have picked up an X100s as a point and shoot for the fiancé and for Macro (I'd love the 90 f4, but cant justify...) Anyhow in a direct comparison, hand held at f5.6, low ISO (160 Leica and 200 Fuji) it was clear just how good the 35 summilux aspherical is at f5.6 (I know it very well at f1.4 and f2.0 where it spends most of its time), but what came apparent was how much 'better' the jpg conversion is on the Fuji, vs the Leica with no adjustments in LR. Looking careful the Fuji raw is a little over sharpened, but the Leica jpg looks notably soft. Any thoughts here as to how I might improve the Leica jpg would be appreciated as Im sometimes too lazy to take the RAW all the way through to B&W The full image with RAW Leica JPG Leica crops followed by Fuji RAW, Fuji jpg. This was quick hand shots to see detail from a distance and I have cropped quickly, sorry for a less than perfect scientific test. Just a real world quick check revealed something worth investigating with the Leica jpg Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/224942-leica-ma9-vs-fuji-x100s/?do=findComment&comment=2565378'>More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted April 9, 2014 Posted April 9, 2014 Hi IWC Doppel, Take a look here Leica Ma9 vs Fuji X100s. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
250swb Posted April 9, 2014 Share #2 Posted April 9, 2014 Sharpen it more? Unfortunately talking about 'real world' tests is the problem, because the 'real' real world is full of variables, and you introduced the biggest straight away with the term 'hand held', which I think automatically consigns possible solutions as pure guesswork. However 'what post processing steps have you already tried?' may be an alternative way in Steve Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
IWC Doppel Posted April 12, 2014 Author Share #3 Posted April 12, 2014 Steve, hi The shots were at 1/2000th, a tripod wont change the difference between the Leica jpg and RAW, I was hoping to save time and experiment with developing preset sharpening if someone already has. I'm not a fan of sharpening as digital artefacts usually distract quite quickly. I'll have a play and make up something appropriate if others haven't Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted April 12, 2014 Share #4 Posted April 12, 2014 Sharpening artefacts? That is pilot error. Sharpening is not an art or black magic, it is a science. I would suggest Schewe and Fraser Real World Sharpening or failing that the simplified synopsis in our own FAQ. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
250swb Posted April 13, 2014 Share #5 Posted April 13, 2014 Yes I'd agree, artefacts caused by sharpening are purely user error. There is no reason at all a photograph can't be sharpened right up to the point that artefacts occur, but by the time you've gone that far the image will already look over sharpened anyway, so there tends to be a self limiting point at which taste overrides finger trouble. I'm not convinced a tripod wont make a difference even at 1/2000th, tests are about removing variables and looking at the facts, but there are a few things that can be tried to level up the images. The first thing is to recognise Fuji camera's put a vast amount of processing into the images, which is why it is often the case that photographers question why their attempts with RAW images can't match the Fuji JPEG's. So in ACR you can start with some slight sharpening to work with, I leave it at the ACR default. The Fuji images have a lot of depth to the detail, a 3D feeling brought about by micro contrast or the local contrast between tones, and you can get this with the 'Clarity' slider in ACR. Another way, which I think better as it is more responsive is the 'Structure' slider in Nik Software's 'Viveza' (for colour) or Silver Efex Pro (for B&W). There is yet another similar tool in Color Efex Pro called 'Tonal Contrast'. These local contrast tools should be used in conjunction with adjusting the overall contrast. Finally after adjusting the colour and brightness you can add the final sharpening depending on the final image size. In overall terms the M240 needs more sharpening than the M9, and far more than the MM which hardly needs any, so don't be afraid of the slider. For a large file I tend to stick the Radius at 0.5 and then the Amount varies between 90 and 130 depending on the image. Others will have their own values, but it all depends on what has gone before in the processing chain. For example the manipulation of micro contrast (the 3D effect) can itself have a sharpening or softening effect on the image, so there is no point in directly copying another photographers recommendations without recognising they are a starting point and not the answer. Steve Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
IWC Doppel Posted April 14, 2014 Author Share #6 Posted April 14, 2014 Sharpening artefacts? That is pilot error. Sharpening is not an art or black magic, it is a science. I would suggest Schewe and Fraser Real World Sharpening or failing that the simplified synopsis in our own FAQ. Pilot error in that case is evidenced in both RAW and jpg with the Fuji. I don't have a problem with the methodology, I have all the LR videos and have read a lot on this in the past, I was just hoping for some Leia jpg basic import settings to improve the slight jpg softness. My tweaking is usually focussed in other areas as I often find less is more with sharpening and prefer to leave alone with RAW. I always mask and sharpen with my iphone however, but with a home made preset. I'll start with Steve's suggestion and build one ! By the way I have a feeling that sharpening is responsible for image flatness in some cases, as real world image have softness at distance in my observations Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted April 22, 2014 Share #7 Posted April 22, 2014 Advertisement (gone after registration) In that case I cannot understand what serious photographers see in Fuji cameras. I would not want a camera that has its raw output precooked to the point of artefacts. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
IWC Doppel Posted April 26, 2014 Author Share #8 Posted April 26, 2014 In that case I cannot understand what serious photographers see in Fuji cameras. I would not want a camera that has its raw output precooked to the point of artefacts. I do agree, it does seem disappointing. even on the above compressed crops you can see the window frames with the Fuji showing an incorrect image of the center cross frame with some of the sashes, it's possible the tran sensor and mapping is responsible, but I can see other this bits that do appear to show sharpening in Raw By the way I have settled on 27, 0.8,17,55 (sharpen, pixel, detail, mask) as a very inoffensive B&W sharpening as a good start in LR 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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