bono0272 Posted April 25, 2007 Share #1 Posted April 25, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) Please allow me to ask this dump question again, although I know in this forum there must be some members did it sometime before: Despite the price, the IR issue, the frame line issue and the pixel issue, what other key features does M8 beat the Epson R-D1s? Can any one share their experience on using the R-D1s or R-D1? Thanks. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted April 25, 2007 Posted April 25, 2007 Hi bono0272, Take a look here M8 and R-D1s. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
j. borger Posted April 25, 2007 Share #2 Posted April 25, 2007 - Quality of the files is much better with the M8 ..... sharpness, clarity & resolution - Better buioldquality of the Camera body - Longer RF Base makes focussing longer and faster lenses easier and more accurate with the M8 - Better customer service I did not use my R-D1 anymore since i got the M8 6 months ago .. except during the 2 weeks the M8 was in Solms for "the fix"! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bayerische Posted April 25, 2007 Share #3 Posted April 25, 2007 I don't have the M8 yet, planning on buying it this summer. I do have the R-D1 (updated to R-D1s) and I love it! It's a remarkable little camera. It was way over my expectations. I have nothing bad to say about it. The M8 looks nicer, it is better, but for the money you can buy an R-D1 you get A LOT of great quality camera. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Mondello Posted April 25, 2007 Share #4 Posted April 25, 2007 The R-D1 is a terrific camera which got me back to RF shooting which led to an M8. I decided that a fair comparison was between the R-D1 at its original price of $3k USD vs the M8's $4,8K USD and taken in context those prices make absolute sense. While I was able to get a re-furb R-D1 for less than $1400 USD, it has a stuck pixel which the new firmware does a decent job of mapping out (but not perfect) and I have to send it off to have the RF calibrated (I am way too ham fisted to try it myself). That said, the R-D1 is a very fun camera and is now my back-up body to the M8. There are some things about the R-D1 that are unique and wonderfully done; the analog gauges are a trip and the flip LCD screen is a great touch. I prefer the R-D1's manual dedicated controls on the top deck to the M8s controls via the menu as well. But guess what? the M8 RAW files are just far far better (even with the quirks) and the 1.33 crop factor rather than the R-D1's 1.54 crop factor means wide lenses are "wider". HTH. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laki Posted April 25, 2007 Share #5 Posted April 25, 2007 when i bought the r-d1 i paid just 700.- euro less than i paid for the m8, considering this i have to say that i paid too much for the r-d1. build and photoquality are with the m8 on a different level. for sure the r-d1 is a very nice camera, but the m8 took over as it became available. the only 2 things i miss on the m8 compared with the r-d1: the flipable display (i mean the ability to hide it away) and the manual winder. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sirvine Posted April 25, 2007 Share #6 Posted April 25, 2007 As long as you never touch an actual M8, you will be perfectly satisfied with an R-D1s. The problem is that once you have that Leica in your hands, you won't want to let it go. On the other hand, the Epson is a beautiful machine in its own right, and far from being a cheap substitute. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
kidigital Posted April 25, 2007 Share #7 Posted April 25, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) I'd agree with the comment about missing the flippable screen and manual winder in moving from the R-D1 to the M8. Overall, the R-D1 is a very nice camera. However, I was never completely happy with the color of the images I was getting with the RD-1...personal preference as I was using the DMR (unfair comparison) at the time. Also, the rangefinder alignment on my R-D1 had an unfortunate habbit of wanting to misalign at the most unopportune times which I found to be very, very frustrating. IMO the image quality of the M8 is a step above of the R-D1. Kurt Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bono0272 Posted April 25, 2007 Author Share #8 Posted April 25, 2007 I use R8+DMR and a M6. And I am planning to visit Tibet the coming June, where I consider bringing the DMR and 3-4 lenses will be comparatively tough. So I am thinking a digital RF camera together with my existing M6 as a back up, from which I can share the lenses between these 2 cameras. However, M8 is out of my budget.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillBrittain Posted April 25, 2007 Share #9 Posted April 25, 2007 I sold my R-D1 to finance the purchase of my second M8. I had originally planned on using the R-D1 as a backup but after using the M8 for a few weeks I knew that I should get a second. The image is far nicer and the M8 has a nice substantial feel to it. One item the others haven't mentioned is battery life. It's dreadful on the R-D1, but not too bad on the M8. Also, genuine Epson batteries are hard to come by in the US. I did prefer the manual shutter and analog controls of the Epson. They were functional, more than simply charming, and Leica would do well to consider emulating them in the future. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
leicaleica Posted April 25, 2007 Share #10 Posted April 25, 2007 Generic batteries for the R-D1 are available for $4 each on Ebay. They work just fine. I would see that as an advantage, even if you don't get quite as many exposures per battery charge. They are also extremely compact. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom0511 Posted April 26, 2007 Share #11 Posted April 26, 2007 I own both but do not use the rd1 much (if any) since I got the M8. where is the M8 better? -more MP -sharper pixels (rd1 needs quit some sharpening, probably strong AA-filter) -more usefull frames in the viewfinder (the widest in rd1 is 28mm x 1.5=42, only 28,35 and 50 in the rd1) -the rd1 shows quit more vignetting, even compared to the M8 wiothout lens detection -My feeling the M8 has more DR what I like better in the rd1: -manual shutter, less noisy -flip LCD -feels pretty good in the hand, IMO better "grip" than the M8 -IMO color is pretty good, no (not much?) IR-problem Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bono0272 Posted May 16, 2007 Author Share #12 Posted May 16, 2007 I always find that there are complains on the R-D1 rangefinder alignment. Does it mean the two images can only be vertically aligned, but not horizontally? For example, when you aim at a veritcal line, the two images in the viewfinder can be coincidented when the object is in focus, but this is not happen when aiming at a horizontal line, or say, a circle? Which means the 2 circle images can never be coincident? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
howard_cummer Posted May 16, 2007 Share #13 Posted May 16, 2007 Richard, The rangefinder alignement was the worst thing about the RD 1. I went through three cameras before I got one that worked reasonably well - and this was in Hong Kong - where you know how hard it is to get a replacement for any defective good. In some cases it was vertical alignment - in other cases horizontal - and none of the cameras would work with lenses like the 75 Summilux and 90 Summicron (did not engage the focus wheel properly). I also had trouble with clumps of dead pixels and misaligned needles on the dial. When I tested the prototype M8 for a day last August I immediately sold my RD 1. I loved and hated that camera all at once. Loved it because it let me use my M lenses and it forced Leica to start on the M8 and hated it because of the lack of Quality Control. It was like having a permanent headache but I did meet a lot of nice people at Epson! Cheers Howard (also in Hong Kong) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted May 16, 2007 Share #14 Posted May 16, 2007 I always find that there are complains on the R-D1 rangefinder alignment. Does it mean the two images can only be vertically aligned, but not horizontally?... Vertical misalignments are easy to adjust with the R-D1. I did it myself with no problem at all (meaning that anyone can do the same) but i had to send in the R-D1s to Epson as its RF guts are different. I haven't got any horizontal misalignments so far (touch wood) but they are more difficult to adjust AFAIK. See: http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?p=238929 Want to know my opinion about R-D1(s) and M8? Well... how could i say this... I have been an (unwilling) beta tester 2 years ago when i purchased the R-D1. Since then it's become my favourite camera to a point where i purchased a R-D1s in case the latter falls apart in my hands. Now i don't want to be a beta tester any more so i'll wait until the teething problems of the M8 are solved and Leica offers a .85x or higher mag. VF before i order a digital M. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sean_reid Posted May 16, 2007 Share #15 Posted May 16, 2007 I did some detailed comparisons between these two cameras in my first 2-3 reviews of the Leica M8 - ergonomics, file quality, etc. Cheers, Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
barjohn Posted May 16, 2007 Share #16 Posted May 16, 2007 I had an R-D1 and after I aligned the RF and I had no other problesm. It was a great little camera and I think the files are very clos to the M8's. I sold it because I could not justify two expensive cameras for a hobby The alignment was very easy to do. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnastovall Posted May 16, 2007 Share #17 Posted May 16, 2007 I have a R-D1 and attended the M8 all day at the Leica Workshop in Dallas last Friday and took my R-D1 for some side by side comparisons. I'm a low light street shooter when it come to using range finders. I like the feel of the M8 . It is a very dense feel, solid. Feels heavier than the R. I like the ability to pick the ISO off the top of the R unlike the M having to go to menu. At low ISO the M8 walks all over the R but at 1600/1280, I think the R wins but I can get usable imagew out of both with Noise Ninja. The M's veiw finder is brighter. I don't think the M8 shutter is that noisy but the R is quieter overall. The manual cocking may be the reason. I find the folded up LCD (which I never use) on the R-D1 very nice. I don't like seeing Leica's out there ready to be damaged unless one put on of Lugi's cases on. After having both side by side, for me the deal breaker is the IR. Where the R-D1 image has a touch of it, the M8 has just too much. I would suggest that Leica at future events make sure they have IR cut filters for all the loaner cameras or the rep's check out what their Leica Black shirts look like when shot with out the filter. I'm sure I'll get a Leica but just no compelling reason to rush to get the M8 now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bono0272 Posted May 17, 2007 Author Share #18 Posted May 17, 2007 .........I also had trouble with clumps of dead pixels and misaligned needles on the dial. When I tested the prototype M8 for a day last August I immediately sold my RD 1. I loved and hated that camera all at once. Loved it because it let me use my M lenses and it forced Leica to start on the M8 and hated it because of the lack of Quality Control. It was like having a permanent headache but I did meet a lot of nice people at Epson! Cheers Howard (also in Hong Kong) Howard, I just get a 2nd hand R-D1, it takes time for me to familiar with the camera. Thanks for your information and sharing your experience. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Mondello Posted May 17, 2007 Share #19 Posted May 17, 2007 Howard, I just get a 2nd hand R-D1, it takes time for me to familiar with the camera. Thanks for your information and sharing your experience. If you got a good one, you will enjoy it immensely. Congratulations! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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