naturephoto1 Posted December 18, 2014 Share #4661 Posted December 18, 2014 Advertisement (gone after registration) Rich, thanks for the encouraging news.Flare behavior of the A7 II seems to have been improved. I never noticed these kinds of flares on my A7R. Maybe I should try to look for them! K-H, I do not think that those of us with A7r cameras noticed anything like the flare and reflection issues of the A7, These observations and differences between the A7 and A7r cameras have been discussed by their owners on a number of occasions.. Rich Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted December 18, 2014 Posted December 18, 2014 Hi naturephoto1, Take a look here The Sony A7 thread [Merged]. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
JimKasson Posted December 18, 2014 Share #4662 Posted December 18, 2014 These Leica exit pupil distances seem fairly short indeed as compared to a few Nikon lenses...It would be interesting to know the exit pupil distances for Leica R-lenses) I haven't tested any Leica R lenses on the alpha 7x, but I have tested a lot of Nikon F-mount glass on those cameras. No problems. My working assumption is that lenses designed to clear a swinging mirror will all be OK. When you test with the Otii and try to get the last bit of MTF50 out of it, you'll probably see some differences. Nikon had -- and I suppose, has, since they still sell a few film SLRs -- the same problem as Leica, in that there whole line of lenses was designed for film when they announced the D1. The mirror box's effect on the flange focal distance sacved them. I wonder if their modern lenses are designed for the Dxxxx sensor stack. If I were making the decisions, they would be. I wonder if Leica will eventually introduce a line of M-mount lenses optimized for the Mxxx sensor stack, or go to a thicker stack and less-tricky lenses and introduce a line of lenses for that. It would be a tough product management call. The existing M users would feel abandoned. Apple had a similar decision when they went from the Motorola 680x0 processors to the IBM/Motorola PowerPC ones, and again when they went from PowerPC to Intel x86 and x64. Their customers grumbled, but eventually went along. BTW, here's a summary of Leica lens performance on the a7S. Rangefinder lenses on the Sony a7S — summary | The Last Word I agree with you about the WATE. Jim Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimKasson Posted December 18, 2014 Share #4663 Posted December 18, 2014 I haven't tested any Leica R lenses on the alpha 7x, but I have tested a lot of Nikon F-mount glass on those cameras. No problems. My working assumption is that lenses designed to clear a swinging mirror will all be OK.Jim The flange focal distances of the R-mount and the F-mount are within half a mm of each other: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leica_R_bayonet Nikon F-mount - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia I would guess that lens designers for the two lines would not systematically choose wildly different exit pupil distances given the FFD similarities. Jim Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Posted December 18, 2014 Share #4664 Posted December 18, 2014 Here is a comparison of the 50 'lux on the M240 with the 55 Zony on the a7: Leica 50 ‘lux on the M240, Sony 55 FE on the Sony a7 | The Last Word Both 24 MP cameras. The a7 has an AA filter, and the M240 does not. Jim Hi JIm, I read your blog spot on the A7 vs the M240 and will address your comments on this over the weekend when I have time to explain the some of the terms you use in your article and what causes them. Also, I need a chance to dig out some shots of my own and the actual corner line pair measurements of these lenses. Cheers, Rick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimKasson Posted December 18, 2014 Share #4665 Posted December 18, 2014 The latest version of pre-ASPH 50 Summicron works well on A7R too. https://www.dropbox.com/s/o5lniggmuucr7n0/_DSC2055.JPG?dl=0 Although I don't have a 50 'cron of any description, I have a set of raw files with test images made with the ASPH version of the lens on the alpha 7S camera. It does very well. Given that, I am surprised the 'lux doesn't do better on the a7S, which is a less-demanding sensor than the a7R. I don't know the exit pupil distances for the two lenses. Jim Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
naturephoto1 Posted December 18, 2014 Share #4666 Posted December 18, 2014 I haven't tested any Leica R lenses on the alpha 7x, but I have tested a lot of Nikon F-mount glass on those cameras. No problems. My working assumption is that lenses designed to clear a swinging mirror will all be OK. When you test with the Otii and try to get the last bit of MTF50 out of it, you'll probably see some differences. Nikon had -- and I suppose, has, since they still sell a few film SLRs -- the same problem as Leica, in that there whole line of lenses was designed for film when they announced the D1. The mirror box's effect on the flange focal distance sacved them. I wonder if their modern lenses are designed for the Dxxxx sensor stack. If I were making the decisions, they would be. I wonder if Leica will eventually introduce a line of M-mount lenses optimized for the Mxxx sensor stack, or go to a thicker stack and less-tricky lenses and introduce a line of lenses for that. It would be a tough product management call. The existing M users would feel abandoned. Apple had a similar decision when they went from the Motorola 680x0 processors to the IBM/Motorola PowerPC ones, and again when they went from PowerPC to Intel x86 and x64. Their customers grumbled, but eventually went along. BTW, here's a summary of Leica lens performance on the a7S. Rangefinder lenses on the Sony a7S — summary | The Last Word I agree with you about the WATE. Jim Hi Jim, There is a problem trying to link to your findings for the WATE. The link does not go to the performance of the WATE. Rich Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimKasson Posted December 18, 2014 Share #4667 Posted December 18, 2014 Advertisement (gone after registration) Hi Jim, There is a problem trying to link to your findings for the WATE. The link does not go to the performance of the WATE. Fixed now. Thanks. jim Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
k-hawinkler Posted December 18, 2014 Share #4668 Posted December 18, 2014 Fixed now. Thanks. jim Jim, Thanks. When I do these tests with something like the Expodisc I tape up the cut out in the hood of the WATE with black electrician's tape. That prohibits light entering from behind through the cut out and being reflected onto the lens and sensor. Doing this generates better, i.e. symmetrical, Lens Cast Corrections (LCC). When actually taking a photo that doesn't seem necessary though. I think the pattern you see in the LCC image is caused by a reflection from the Expodisc. I don't see such a pattern at all in my tests with a disk from C1Pro. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimKasson Posted December 18, 2014 Share #4669 Posted December 18, 2014 When I do these tests with something like the Expodisc I tape up the cut out in the hood of the WATE with black electrician's tape. That prohibits light entering from behind through the cut out and being reflected onto the lens and sensor. Doing this generates better, i.e. symmetrical, Lens Cast Corrections (LCC). When actually taking a photo that doesn't seem necessary though. Yes, that's what I do now, on the rare occasions when I use lens/camera combinations that result in color casting. I think the pattern you see in the LCC image is caused by a reflection from the Expodisc. I don't see such a pattern at all in my tests with a disk from C1Pro. Makes sense to me. Jim Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimKasson Posted December 18, 2014 Share #4670 Posted December 18, 2014 I tape up the cut out in the hood of the WATE with black electrician's tape... I don't understand why the cutout is there in the first place. It's not like you can use the lens without an accessory finder or live view. Jim Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
naturephoto1 Posted December 18, 2014 Share #4671 Posted December 18, 2014 I don't understand why the cutout is there in the first place. It's not like you can use the lens without an accessory finder or live view. Jim You think that the opening is bad for the WATE hood, you should see the cut outs for the 67mm Filter Adapter for the lens. I taped both sides of my Adapter with Black Gaffers Tape so that when I use filters (including (UV) to keep the rear of the filters clean and to eliminate any issues due to the cut outs for my A7r I keep the 67mm Adapter with UV filter and a 67mm collapsible lens hood attached to the lens. I can use the hood for the 21mm setting of the lens. Beyond that I have to remove the hood and if I desire use my Lee Filter System with the lens. I think that I can use the lens set at 16mm with my special Singh-Ray Cokin Z ring filter and as many as 4 100 mm wide Grad or ND filters. Rich Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Chen Posted December 19, 2014 Share #4672 Posted December 19, 2014 has anyone any experience of the last pre aspheric version? Gerry Gerry, I have a latest 50 Summilux preASPH (Titanium version), however, never use it. I'll take some pictures when weather is clear. It's rainning now. All the best, Thomas Chen Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Chen Posted December 19, 2014 Share #4673 Posted December 19, 2014 I don't understand why the cutout is there in the first place. It's not like you can use the lens without an accessory finder or live view. Jim The cutout is perhaps for any M camera user who is reluctant to buy a multi-focal viewfinder. I hold the barrel of WATE on A7R by left-hand and make the finger to seal the cutout to prevent light leakage. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimKasson Posted December 19, 2014 Share #4674 Posted December 19, 2014 The cutout is perhaps for any M camera user who is reluctant to buy a multi-focal viewfinder. I hold the barrel of WATE on A7R by left-hand and make the finger to seal the cutout to prevent light leakage. Even before the M240, I didn't use the Frankenfinder much. I used 15mm or 18mm , or occasionally 21mm accessory finders and guessed a lot. Three finders in a camera bag were still smaller and lighter than the FrankenFinder. But the cutout doesn't help at all with those finders. the cutout's only justification, AFAIK, is so you can seen more of the frame when you're using the in-body viewfinder. But that finder is useless with the WATE. So what am I missing here? Jim Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Chen Posted December 19, 2014 Share #4675 Posted December 19, 2014 But that finder is useless with the WATE. I seldom use the WATE on M8 because of the big external finder. However, I use WATE a lot with A7R owing to the convenience of Live view fin the EVF. WATE is my only super wide lense and the hood cutout really makes trouble. The Leica 67mm filter-holder for WATE goes with two cutouts, but it also comes with a black plastic shim indicating "This side towards lens". Thus, I use the shim to prevent light from coming into lens when filter is in place. Just share my own use experience dealing with A7R + WATE. All the Best, Thomas Chen Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
k-hawinkler Posted December 19, 2014 Share #4676 Posted December 19, 2014 Frankly, really, I love using the Frankenfinder on the M9 and keep the cut out permanently taped up. I like the Frankenfinder's level bubble that works in landscape orientation and use it for all M-lenses 28 mm or below in FL. Of course, the Frankenfinder is not needed or wanted when I use the WATE or another lens on my A7R. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
k-hawinkler Posted December 19, 2014 Share #4677 Posted December 19, 2014 David (alias Viramati) found a firmware bug with the A7II. IBIS issue A7II - The GetDPI Photography Forums Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
k-hawinkler Posted December 21, 2014 Share #4678 Posted December 21, 2014 David (alias Viramati) found a firmware bug with the A7II.IBIS issue A7II - The GetDPI Photography Forums If you follow this link, there also is a work around, namely keep A7II powered on while dismounting an OSS lens and mounting a third party lens with adapter. Then IBIS keeps working. The key part is to have the camera powered on when taking off the OSS lens. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 21, 2014 Share #4679 Posted December 21, 2014 How many months until the A7IIS comes out? With IBIS and the hight-ISO sensor of the A7S. And also a near-future A7IIR ... What I like is, that SONY doesn't pay celebrites to use their cameras. They sell because they're good, and also no stories from many decades ago. Film Leicas are a different story, but to use their prestige in oder to distract from dormant R&D is not very convincing imo. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jankap Posted December 22, 2014 Share #4680 Posted December 22, 2014 Perhaps Sonyalpharumors? Jan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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