Nick_S Posted March 14, 2014 Share #4401 Posted March 14, 2014 Advertisement (gone after registration) It does seem like the closer rear nodal point of Leica M wide-angle lenses is not handled well by the A7, which lacks the sensor microlenses of Leica's digital rangefinder cameras. Perhaps it would be worth looking at small SLR wide angle lenses, which might work better on this sensor as their rear elements were designed with the additional distance needed clear the mirror of a reflex camera. Compact examples which come to mind are the current Voigtländer 20, 28mm Color Skopar II lenses for Nikon and Canon mounts, and the classic Olympus OM, Pentax SMC and some Nikon AI wide angles. Nick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted March 14, 2014 Posted March 14, 2014 Hi Nick_S, Take a look here The Sony A7 thread [Merged]. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
gyoung Posted March 14, 2014 Share #4402 Posted March 14, 2014 Certainly the presentation is easier than projectors, and printing too (I used to do Cibachrome at one time) but I do like my mechanical leicas, they were affordable, are reliable, and are relatively cheap to repair on the odd occasion service is needed (as long as you stear clear of Solms etc.). The quality I get from Nikon scanning at 24bit and 4000 dpi is also at least as good as any digital camera I think, and better as far as tonal range is concerned The lenses I have, a relatively modest collection, are certainly better than anything I have for the Nikon, although some of their newer stuff seems good, but the weight and size are just well out of proportion to what 35mm photography has always been IMHO. I was dissapointed to see in Photozone's tests that the 35/2 asph Summicron did relatively poorly even on an M9, perhaps there is little hope that the older leica designs will do well even on cameras with sensors designed for them. So, maybe APS-c is the way? And Fuji has some excellent 'native' lenses unlike Sony (excepting a few, and no really wide angle), and take what we can get from our lovely old lenses! Leica seems to have something up its sleeve, but from recent history I doubt I can afford it, its bound to be twice as much as the nearest competition even if (?) its 'better'. Thanks for all your efforts, its an interesting time! Gerry Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest polygamer Posted March 14, 2014 Share #4403 Posted March 14, 2014 Hi, I find a few criteria important when selecting lenses for system cameras: -communality: must be attachable to Leica m mount and others via adapters -compactness: as small and light as possible, even with adapter -optical quality: Voigtläner/ZEISS/Leica-like ... That is why I do not have SONY/ZEISS lenses and do not use SLR/DSLR lenses outside. (The Voigtländer Ultron 2/40 and a few other Nikon lenses I kept when giving my Nikon equipment to my wife.) Coming back to corner performance of the A7, now compared to the NEX-6, with the Leica Elmarit 2,8/28 ASPH attached. First the scene, NEX-6, A7, f8: Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/214267-the-sony-a7-thread-merged/?do=findComment&comment=2549609'>More sharing options...
Guest polygamer Posted March 14, 2014 Share #4404 Posted March 14, 2014 Now the crops, NEX-6+A7 f2,8, NEX-6+A7 f8: Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/214267-the-sony-a7-thread-merged/?do=findComment&comment=2549613'>More sharing options...
Guest polygamer Posted March 14, 2014 Share #4405 Posted March 14, 2014 Hi, I think the results are clear. There is also some variation in lighting because the A7pictures were taken before my lunch at the Schloßhotel, the NEX-6 ones after this. So, is the glass half empty, or half full ? Who cares, as long as it's enjoyable ... Have a nice weekend! Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/214267-the-sony-a7-thread-merged/?do=findComment&comment=2549616'>More sharing options...
steveclem Posted March 14, 2014 Share #4406 Posted March 14, 2014 Pils? I will have a Kolsch if you please! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gyoung Posted March 14, 2014 Share #4407 Posted March 14, 2014 Advertisement (gone after registration) Looks like the choice is between a very good 40mm equivalent and a rather poor 28 Prost! Gerry Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest polygamer Posted March 14, 2014 Share #4408 Posted March 14, 2014 Looks like the choice is between a very good 40mm equivalent and a rather poor 28 Prost! That's not how I see it. The Elmarit performs better on the A7 at f8 than on the NEX-6. The buildings in the distance I focussed on, are shown better at f 2,8 with the A7. The blurred twigs, however, spoil the picture ... Over the weekend, I shall go to Berlin, taking with me the A7 with the Voigtländer Skopar 4/21 and the Leica Summarit 2,5/35 (and the NEX-6 as a back-up). So, next week I might have something to show. Cheers! Immo Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
3D-Kraft.com Posted March 15, 2014 Share #4409 Posted March 15, 2014 The blurred twigs, however, spoil the picture ... Taking "crops" (in different scaling) from the border of an 1.5x crop sensor (that cuts out the filet piece of the lenses image circle) and comparing it with border crops of the same lens on a full frame sensor after changing the display window looks like a quite misleading comparison to me. At the end, this test only proofs that a 1.5 crop shows a different picture and that typical border problems (like field curvature) are invisible after cropping. Thank you for that insight Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gyoung Posted March 15, 2014 Share #4410 Posted March 15, 2014 Indeed, thats what I wanted to know, but its complicated by the effects of pixel density with older design wideangle lenses. My 24/2.8 nikkor is worse on a 16mp aps-c than on a 24mp full frame. Gerry Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest polygamer Posted March 18, 2014 Share #4411 Posted March 18, 2014 Hi, I am back from my long weekend in Berlin. As I said, I have something to show. First, I would like to state that I do not do anything which might be called testing. I try out the equipment I own and purchased (in contrast to some camera- or lens-groupies who get their equipment from dealers or manufacturers for free and who may have a hidden agenda). This is not a scientific effort. I do not want to waist my time, however, or of the people reading my postings. So I try to deal with questions I find interesting, and others might, too. Coming to a few findings from my trip to Berlin. I wanted to travel light (1 piece of luggage with Lufthansa), so I took the Voigtländer Skopar 4/21, the A7, the NEX-6 and my Leica Summarit 2,5/35 with me. With the combination A7 + 21 Skopar I was not entirely happy, because some pictures had a pink lower middle. With the NEX-7 there were pink corners, with the A7 we have soft corners and a pink bottom. So a few pictures to illustrate this: Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/214267-the-sony-a7-thread-merged/?do=findComment&comment=2552082'>More sharing options...
Guest polygamer Posted March 18, 2014 Share #4412 Posted March 18, 2014 So, I find the SONY pink bottom in the underground picture, less so in Wittenberg Platz with the KaDeWe, more so in the Goethe picture of which I made a crop. I had similar colourings with the ZEISS Biogon 4,5/21 on the A7. But never with the Leica Elmarit 2,8/21 ASPH. So, at present I do not know what to make of the SONY pink bottom. It could be an effect of the lens correction app. I had it with 2 21 lenses. But this may be because I selected the (wrong) settings for the app. The Leica Elmarit 2,8/21 ASPH does not need app correction. I shall try the Elmarit again to see if it also shows the SONY pink bottom. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_livsey Posted March 18, 2014 Share #4413 Posted March 18, 2014 Some interesting artefacts from the lights in the underground picture, seen these before from that sensor. I wonder if the "native" lenses do that? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest polygamer Posted March 18, 2014 Share #4414 Posted March 18, 2014 Some interesting artefacts from the lights in the underground picture, seen these before from that sensor. I wonder if the "native" lenses do that? Hi, the Voigtländer Skopar can show the most interesting flares. But the SONY A7 produces flares with many Leica lenses, also with the Summarit 2,5/35. How the SONY/ZEISS lenses behave, I cannot say. I do not have any ... The question is also, do they show the SONY Pink Bottom, too ??? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest polygamer Posted March 19, 2014 Share #4415 Posted March 19, 2014 The Leica Elmarit 2,8/21 ASPH does not need app correction. I shall try the Elmarit again to see if it also shows the SONY pink bottom. Hi, today I tried my Leica Elmarit 2,8/21 ASPH on the A7 again, to make sure how it compares to my other 21s. So, f 2,8; 4; 5,6; 8, ISO 100, JEPG ooc, WB auto: Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/214267-the-sony-a7-thread-merged/?do=findComment&comment=2552806'>More sharing options...
Guest polygamer Posted March 19, 2014 Share #4416 Posted March 19, 2014 So, the Leica Elmarit 2,8/21 ASPH is my best 21mm lens. You can see, how the image improves. At f8, the SONY border and corner weaknesses are gone. There is no pink bottom. The formula is simple: You take a € 1260 FF body and a € 3500 Leica lens, and - presto: you get decent results. It's not a trick - it's a SONY with a little help from a real camera company !:D:D Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gyoung Posted March 19, 2014 Share #4417 Posted March 19, 2014 That looks very nice, I have the Elmarit, cost me a lot less than that 10 years ago, now perhaps I need the Sony 'digital back' for it! Gerry Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest polygamer Posted March 19, 2014 Share #4418 Posted March 19, 2014 That looks very nice, I have the Elmarit, cost me a lot less than that 10 years ago, now perhaps I need the Sony 'digital back' for it! Yes, I quoted the former list price. Currently, they are around € 1800 in ebay. I went through my 21mm files (Elmarit, Voigtländer Skopar, ZEISS 4,5) again, and I must say, the Elmarit is my best 21. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick_S Posted March 20, 2014 Share #4419 Posted March 20, 2014 The formula is simple: You take a € 1260 FF body and a € 3500 Leica lens, and - presto: you get decent results. Sure, but given the Sony's sensor limitations, can you get better results with a small retrofocus design like the Voigtländer 20mm f/3.5 SL-II for a fraction of the cost? Nick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest polygamer Posted March 20, 2014 Share #4420 Posted March 20, 2014 Sure, but given the Sony's sensor limitations, can you get better results with a small retrofocus design like the Voigtländer 20mm f/3.5 SL-II for a fraction of the cost? Hi, I cannot say, I do not have the 20mm Voigtländer. It has received mixed reviews. Positive from Ken Rockwell, less so from photozone. I could extrapolate my good experiences with the 2/40 Ultron (for Nikon), which is risky ... What I am showing, are results when trying out Leica M mount lenses I have. They might be relevant for people with dual use interests, i.e. for Leica M mount cameras, and others - such as SONY - via adapters. So, basically, I am writing for the few people like myself ... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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