dlynn Posted July 4, 2013 Share #281 Posted July 4, 2013 Advertisement (gone after registration) I will keep you posted for sure. The camera is now traveling to Rome and I may keep my hands on it in a couple of days.It's certainly an anomaly, but my intention was simply to underline that, apart from production issues, there may be some anomaly in the distribution process of the new Leica M. Yesterday I also received a call from a Leica reseller in Bologna informing that a branded new black M240 will be available by this week at his store. Another anomaly. I only wish they would have similar availabilities in southern france..... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted July 4, 2013 Posted July 4, 2013 Hi dlynn, Take a look here Production Issues with M240?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
250swb Posted July 4, 2013 Share #282 Posted July 4, 2013 Ditto. Clifton Cameras had 2 in the first week (I had one) and they are a 'normal' Leica dealer. If I was Leica, in a situation where demand far exceeded supply, I would prioritise my longstanding dealers with a good sales record, and spread the rest thinly amongst the remainder.... As I said earlier, as of two days ago even a well known Premier Dealer had only received four camera's (four in total, two on launch), and as they are allocated fairly without prejudice by Leica that makes for a very low number in the UK. This is nothing to do with demand exceeding supply, there is no supply to speak of. Around 50 customer camera's to the UK since the official launch date is probably nearly as many as the demo models the dealers were sent (without packaging so they couldn't be sold on). So if all the dealers have a waiting list it is hard to imagine how you decide who has a better sales record if they all have nothing to sell, even the bigger dealers have shelves of lenses waiting for camera's to go with them. You may just as absurdly allocate camera's based on a photographers lack of experience, because they are the ones who will need a couple of lenses, a grip, a bag, and any number of Leica related products. Steve Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
StephenPatterson Posted July 4, 2013 Author Share #283 Posted July 4, 2013 You may just as absurdly allocate camera's based on a photographers lack of experience, because they are the ones who will need a couple of lenses, a grip, a bag, and any number of Leica related products. Steve Which is exactly what I believe is happening in Singapore and now Hong Kong. No M240 without the purchase of a new Leica lens or lenses (and we're not talking Summarit). Hell in Hong Kong it's almost an interview process at Tin Cheung to be vetted as to whether or not they "might" at some point in the future sell you a camera. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
thighslapper Posted July 4, 2013 Share #284 Posted July 4, 2013 They probably have an old woman at Solms with a pack of cards allocating deliveries depending on what gets dealt out every time she shuffles the pack..... Whatever Leica do there will be grumbles.... and unfortunately they will probably plod on at this pace for the foreeable future as it doesn't look like additional assembly capacity is forthcoming Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmclalla Posted July 4, 2013 Share #285 Posted July 4, 2013 I believe it is more believable to have this discussion once you really have a new M in hand versus a dealers promise of one in a few days. I have had those kind of promises broken regularly anywhere in the world regarding Leica product. Please let us know when you ACTUALLY have your new M and give us your impressions of it. If could sound more believable to you, now the M240 is my hands:D, just delivered by courier. In the next days, I'll share my preliminary impressions. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeicaMarc Posted July 4, 2013 Share #286 Posted July 4, 2013 I waited for two weeks for my Silver M240. No downpayment whatsoever. I think Leica stores do get delivered sooner than regular stores.. Ordered it I believe two weeks ago and picked it up last saturday Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
StephenPatterson Posted July 5, 2013 Author Share #287 Posted July 5, 2013 Advertisement (gone after registration) It seems something must be going on it Italy. A member of the M240 facebook group just posted that a dealer in Genova has both a black and silver chrome M240 in stock and available for purchase (although by the time you read this they are probably gone)... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
marknorton Posted July 5, 2013 Share #288 Posted July 5, 2013 I would be really unhappy if I thought the Leica boutiques are getting priority over the normal dealers. I dislike the Leica stores intensely, the condescending attitude of the people (as Edina Monsoon said in Ab Fab, "you can drop the attitude, you're only a shop assistant") and the gloomy red on black décor. Give me a proper dealer and the likes of Ivor and Brian at Red Dot Cameras any day of the week. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeicaMarc Posted July 5, 2013 Share #289 Posted July 5, 2013 I would be really unhappy if I thought the Leica boutiques are getting priority over the normal dealers. I dislike the Leica stores intensely, the condescending attitude of the people (as Edina Monsoon said in Ab Fab, "you can drop the attitude, you're only a shop assistant") and the gloomy red on black décor. Give me a proper dealer and the likes of Ivor and Brian at Red Dot Cameras any day of the week. They do get priority. They even switch people on waiting lists depending on what you are going to buy in the future. Lets say you ONLY want the Leica M you are number 10 on the list. But: mention the fact that you are going to buy limited editions or lenses in the future from them: you are number one. Trust me on this one. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
microview Posted July 5, 2013 Share #290 Posted July 5, 2013 Good news! Leica statement emailed out earlier this week: "To ensure that we can continue to maintain these uncompromising quality standards and simultaneously reduce order-fulfilment times, Leica Camera AG is currently significantly expanding production capacities, creating job opportunities for additional specialists and trainees, and is building a completely new, ultra-modern factory that will open in Wetzlar in 2014 with facilities to satisfy production demand. The sum total of these measures will relieve pressures in the production process and simultaneously lead to considerably shorter order-fulfilment times." So only another six months' wait and all will be fine!!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
StephenPatterson Posted July 5, 2013 Author Share #291 Posted July 5, 2013 I have never seen a building assemble a camera, so I'm not sure the new campus is the answer to all the production problems. Do we even know if Leica is working more than one shift? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
marknorton Posted July 5, 2013 Share #292 Posted July 5, 2013 So only another six months' wait and all will be fine!!! Of course. However, 31 December 2014 is 18 months away. The cameras are not even made in Solms, they are made in Portugal with just enough work being done in Solms to justify a "Made in Germany" label. Therefore, unless Leica are planning to relocate all M production to Wetzlar (remember they have a new plant and a cheap workforce in Portugal to keep busy too), the new Wetzlar HQ isn't going to impact M availability. Lenses, which are made in Solms are a different story. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dante Posted July 25, 2013 Share #293 Posted July 25, 2013 Based on the pictures I have seen, M building may be training-intensive but is not particularly capital-intensive (except possibly for the workbenches). Dante Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted July 25, 2013 Share #294 Posted July 25, 2013 Of course. However, 31 December 2014 is 18 months away. The cameras are not even made in Solms, they are made in Portugal with just enough work being done in Solms to justify a "Made in Germany" label. Therefore, unless Leica are planning to relocate all M production to Wetzlar (remember they have a new plant and a cheap workforce in Portugal to keep busy too), the new Wetzlar HQ isn't going to impact M availability. Lenses, which are made in Solms are a different story. Do you have figures, Mark? I doubt there is too much difference in production costs. If they wanted to go cheap they would have moved East. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted July 25, 2013 Share #295 Posted July 25, 2013 I have never seen a building assemble a camera, so I'm not sure the new campus is the answer to all the production problems. Do we even know if Leica is working more than one shift?Certainly not. That would be prohibitively expensive. This is Europe, Sir! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest tanks Posted July 25, 2013 Share #296 Posted July 25, 2013 Certainly not. That would be prohibitively expensive. This is Europe, Sir! Assuming your comment was not in jest, is shift differential really that much more in cost in Europe? I am not talking about people working double shifts, but different people working on each shift. Of course, part of the problem might also be that Germany leads the world in least amount of hours worked per employee per week. Countries where people work least - NBC News.com Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted July 25, 2013 Share #297 Posted July 25, 2013 Tongue in cheek detector failure.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
georg Posted July 25, 2013 Share #298 Posted July 25, 2013 Solms does final assembly, Portugal makes some of the Rangefinder and internal assembly - most of the critical components are sourced from suppliers and could cause delays. Did they actually ramp up staff? Last time I read something about only 600 employees in the new factory of Wetzlar!? Two-shift operation is not that expensive in Germany but without use if you have limited yield for example in sensor production... I have no idea whats wrong there, waiting since Sptember, was offered a black (no interest in cheap paint) one in May and rejected... By the way, union-companies like Leica usually have 35h/week and 30 days paid holidays, usually more efficient than 40h/week. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
uskoeln Posted July 25, 2013 Share #299 Posted July 25, 2013 Germany: 10 yrs ago 35 h per week, today avg. 38 h/wk with trend to 40 and more (looking to fulltimejob) I have no clue how they get to twentysomething Uwe Assuming your comment was not in jest' date=' is shift differential really that much more in cost in Europe? I am not talking about people working double shifts, but different people working on each shift. Of course, part of the problem might also be that Germany leads the world in least amount of hours worked per employee per week. Countries where people work least - NBC News.com Sent from my iPad using Forum Runner Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobitybob Posted July 25, 2013 Share #300 Posted July 25, 2013 As I've only had my M on order for a few months I'll give it a few more to see what happens. In the meantime I've brought a Fujifilm XE-1 to replace the Lumix L1 I was using with my R lenses. You never know if it's as good as people say, there may be another M available for someone, as I'll use this and keep my M9. In couple of months a bus load of folks from this Forum will be getting a tour of Leica Wetzlar, it may be worth waiting to see what they find out! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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