How much haze is too much haze in Summicron collapsible?

[Leica_red]

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Hello everyone,

 

This is my first post as a Leica owner. This week I got my first Leica (a beautiful M3) and today I got my first lens. I got an old collapsible Summicron 50mm f2 that seems to be immaculate. It has a serial from 1955, but under strong light the lens seems in absolute perfect condition. It came with a Skylight UV filter attached to it and it seems like it has been attached to it since the lens was bought (I don't know if this is actually true, but the lens is in that good condition). No signs of peeling coating, almost no dust inside the elements, BUT I think it might be hazy.

 

When looking through the lenses it's almost like there's no haze at all. It is only when looking with a strong light that it becomes noticeable.

 

Therefore my question, how much haziness is too much haziness? I am posting some pictures here, I think it is visible enough from them. Do you think I should send for a CLA? The problem is that this week I will not have the time to test a roll of film (to have it developed and all) and in a few days I have am traveling for the summer. Thus, if it needs a CLA I'd need to send it as soon as possible (I heard Youxin Ye has a really good return time) to ensure that I'd have it back in New York City before I leave for my ethnography work abroad.

 

So, for those who know how to judge a lens, what would you recommend me?

 

Thank you, and I hope I will contribute a lot to this community from now on.

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[kknox55@gmail.com]

I have had a few of these lens over the years. Most un touched lens will have some haze, yours has a fair amount. That will effect your photos, it will cause much lower contrast & degrade the colors. I have sent a couple to have cleaned, much better pics after cleaning. Take a few some before cleaning, then after. You will be amazed of the results after cleaning of the lens. Youxin Ye charges about $80.00 to clean it. Youxin will have it back to you in a week.

[Ecar]

Yes, this is definitely too much and it needs a good cleaning job - there might also be some fungus (hard to tell). Bear in mind that the collapsible Summicron is already a low-contrast lens, so the pictures you'll be taking with this particular one will look seriously foggy unless you have it cleaned. It's a rather straightforward operation (if one knows what he's doing...) and the lens will come back to you as new - well worth it IMO.

[Leica_red]

Thank you for your opinions and help. I sent it to Youxin Ye today and he said he could return it to me within two days! (I happen to be in a rush because I'm leaving the country next week). He is very kind and understanding and I am looking forward to using this lens very soon.

 

Just a question. I know that the lens is low contrast and will tend to flare a lot. Does it help that it has a UV filter on it? Or should I go ahead and buy a lens hood for it. I see a lot of them on eBay for dirt cheap, but I wonder if they are good enough for the purpose of increasing the contrast capabilities of this lens. If they are not enough, can you let me know what I should buy instead?

 

This is the sort of hood I'm talking about: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Silver-39mm-Tilted-Vented-Metal-Lens-Hood-Shade-for-Leica-M-Summicron-Brand-New-/360651587272?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item53f8827ec8

 

 

Thank you

[TomB_tx]

The lens hood would improve it more than a filter. I have one of those hoods, and it is decent for the cost. Get a 52mm pinch-cap to fit the end of the hood.

[Michael Geschlecht]

Hello Leica_red,

 

Welcome to the Forum.

 

Especially in the field: It is more important to use a rigid lens hood to protect against inadvertant impact & damage than it is to use it to suppress flare. Also: It is a lot easier to relpace a 12585 (The code # for the hood.) than it is to replace a lens element or a focussing mount.

 

You might even consider also taking a small, sturdy table tripod with a large ball head & a cable release. Handy in all sorts of situations.

 

Against my chest it gives me +1 stop of additional steadiness at any given shutter speed. Against the inside of a door frame, against a rock, a wall or against a tree, as well as on a car with its engine turned off or even on a table it gives you as many stops of stability as you need. It is often useful in the field in all sorts of situations

 

The more you use it the more uses you find for it.

 

F8 at 1 second on a tripod can sometimes give you a much different picture than F2 at 1/15th of a second hand held.

 

By the way - What type of ethnography? Where? Sounds interesting.

 

Best Regards,

 

Michael

[NZDavid]

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I had one if these lenses once but got rid it it because of the haze. The 50 Summicron rigid is a much better lens IMO because it is likely to be in better condition. Unless you want soft pictures, of course. If cleaning is available locally without having to send overseas and wait for months or pay a bomb, that sounds like a good option. It still wouldn't be my main lens choice, though.

[barrybed]

Red, You made a wise choice. Youxin will do a good job and have it back before you know it. I have owned both rigid and collapsible. At 2.8 and 4 and beyond they are nearly the same. I have kept the rigid and only sold the collapsible because I needed the money for something else. I once did a 'flare test.' I pointed each lens directly at a very bright reflection from a chrome car bumper, very unscientific I know. But the collapsible won out. You will not be disappointed!! Robbie

[jaques]

I have handled quite a few of the collapsible Summicrons and whilst they are really great lenses they do have a somewhat softish 'old look' wide open even when they are very clean. This can be good if you are after that look. If you want a much crisper image you cannot go past a v2 rigid summicron from the 70's. These lenses are extremely sharp and just excellent in my opinion- my example is one of my favorite lenses. Having said that the collapsible lenses match perfectly with an m3.

[Ecar]

The lens hood would improve it more than a filter. I have one of those hoods, and it is decent for the cost. Get a 52mm pinch-cap to fit the end of the hood.

+1

[tobey bilek]

Any at all is too much. Very slight will cause contrast loss, more will kill resolution.

 

I have had lenses cleaned that were almost clear & the difference was remarkable

[Leica_red]

Thank you everyone for your responses. This being my first Leica lens makes me nervous about what to expect. I hope that once it is clean and CLAd by Youxin I'll be in for a nice surprise.

 

BTW, I've always heard how great this lens is for Black and White photography due to its low contrast, I plan to use it mostly for that myself. However, does anyone have an opinion on what color photography (film) is like with it? I heard the colors were very soft, but then most people from whom I've heard that from had haze problems with it so I wonder if color contrast gets better after the lens being cleaned out.

 

I already ordered a vented hood for it, so maybe that will also help?

[Leica_red]

Hello Leica_red,

 

Welcome to the Forum.

 

Especially in the field: It is more important to use a rigid lens hood to protect against inadvertant impact & damage than it is to use it to suppress flare. Also: It is a lot easier to relpace a 12585 (The code # for the hood.) than it is to replace a lens element or a focussing mount.

 

You might even consider also taking a small, sturdy table tripod with a large ball head & a cable release. Handy in all sorts of situations.

 

Against my chest it gives me +1 stop of additional steadiness at any given shutter speed. Against the inside of a door frame, against a rock, a wall or against a tree, as well as on a car with its engine turned off or even on a table it gives you as many stops of stability as you need. It is often useful in the field in all sorts of situations

 

The more you use it the more uses you find for it.

 

F8 at 1 second on a tripod can sometimes give you a much different picture than F2 at 1/15th of a second hand held.

 

By the way - What type of ethnography? Where? Sounds interesting.

 

Best Regards,

 

Michael

 

The tripod idea is great! thanks for that, although I wonder how I could accomodate a tripod to my M3 that has the tripod hole not in the middle but on one of the sides of the bottom.

 

About my ethnography, I am a sociology PhD working on national pride and national cuisine in Peru, so I'm going there this summer to conduct interviews and engage in participant observation. Already done a lot of field work in past years, but I was thinking about adding a visual dimension to it this time around, hence the new Leica. Of course, that's only an excuse to buy one, to tell you the truth

[Ecar]

Colors are somewhat muted, but in a pleasant way. Cleaning will definitely help to get some contrast back, but don't forget that you can add quite a bit in post (assuming you scan your negatives and process them on the computer), if that's what you are after. And the lens is far from being the worst offender when it comes to flare (try a Summarit 50/1.5 against the sun and you'll see what I mean).

[Michael Geschlecht]

Hello Leica_red,

 

I use my own home made version of a Leitz/Leica table tripod (TUOOG/14100) with a medium sized version of their large ball head (KGOON, which later evolved into KGOON/14121). The offset tripod connection has never been a problem. Even with a 90mm or 135mm lens.

 

Those grooved little ball heads in Leitz/Leica large ball heads grip tightly without tightening too hard & seem to never slip.

 

A ball head is the only type of tripod head that makes sense in the field. Don't forget a cable release.

 

A kitchen or dining room doorway or wall is a perfect place for a table tripod. Don't forget to get soft, non-marking slippers for the tripod's feet if the tripod that you get doesn't already have them.

 

Soft, non-marking slippers on a tripod's feet are often a reason you will be permitted to use it.

 

It's interesting that you are studying Peruvian Cooking because it appears from your writing that you are in or near the New York Metropolitan area which is an area with a significant Peruvian population & a number of Peruvian restaurants. Good practice before you go.

 

Best Regards,

 

Michael