k-hawinkler Posted January 11, 2013 Share #621  Posted January 11, 2013 Advertisement (gone after registration) Jaap, I was using the VF-2 with a 560 Telyt and focusing was far easier than using a Visoflex. Especially as the amplification meant you did not have to change the aperture to focus and then stop down to take a photo. However, compared with the Olympus, I am going to miss image stabilisation on the M-240. I wish they had incorporated this along with a supersonic sensor shaker to get rid of dust, just like the cheap little Olympus has. I am amazed how clean the sensor stays on it.  Wilson   Hi Wilson,  My brand new $210 Olympus E-P2, $170 VF-2 and $72 Kipon adapter arrived. So, I put on a Leica Summilux-M ASPH 50/1.4, yielding effectively a 100 mm lens with regards to angle of view, as the crop factor of the MFT sensor is 2x.  First image: IBIS on @ 1/10s, f=5.6 ISO=400, handheld Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!  Second image: IBIS off @ 1/8s, f=5.6 ISO=400, handheld  Even this 2.5 year old Olympus IBIS technology seems to work rather well. As Jono The GetDPI Photography Forums - View Single Post - OM-D is Camera of the Year 2012 on DPR points out the OM-D E-M5 is a notch or two better.  Therefore, it looks like that OM-D E-M5, or its rumored about follow on model, may be a good tool for my Leica/Leitz normal- and tele-lenses. Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!  Second image: IBIS off @ 1/8s, f=5.6 ISO=400, handheld  Even this 2.5 year old Olympus IBIS technology seems to work rather well. As Jono The GetDPI Photography Forums - View Single Post - OM-D is Camera of the Year 2012 on DPR points out the OM-D E-M5 is a notch or two better.  Therefore, it looks like that OM-D E-M5, or its rumored about follow on model, may be a good tool for my Leica/Leitz normal- and tele-lenses. ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/190687-preparing-for-the-m/?do=findComment&comment=2211947'>More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 Hi k-hawinkler, Take a look here Preparing for the M. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
wlaidlaw Posted January 11, 2013 Share #622  Posted January 11, 2013 K-H,  The missing IS on the M-240 is a concern to me too. Another couple of examples on an EP-2 but this time using a Vario-Elmar 80-200/f4, set at 200mm. Now I don't have very steady hands and you can see that except in very bright sunlight (and it is quite bright here in the UK today), the lack of IS is going to make using longer lenses for sharp photos, hand held, an issue for me. These crops are from images taken at 1/320 of a second, so not slow. The tree was about 50 feet from the window.  Wilson Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/190687-preparing-for-the-m/?do=findComment&comment=2211979'>More sharing options...
wlaidlaw Posted January 11, 2013 Share #623  Posted January 11, 2013 I just took two other images, using a lightweight travel tripod and remote release. Interestingly, the shot without image stabilisation is I think, a little sharper than the one with. So maybe Leica have got it right and there is a downside to image stabilisation but it would still be nice to have it there if you needed it. Maybe on the M250  Wilson Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/190687-preparing-for-the-m/?do=findComment&comment=2212001'>More sharing options...
k-hawinkler Posted January 11, 2013 Share #624 Â Posted January 11, 2013 Well, Olympus advises to switch off IBIS when on a tripod. That's fine. I am thinking aside from handholding, IBIS may also come in handy when on a monopod or some other not totally stable support. When the sun comes back up here I will try out my TE 135/4 and APO 180/3.4. Those are light and compact lenses. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wattsy Posted January 11, 2013 Share #625 Â Posted January 11, 2013 Yes, I think it is usually recommended to turn off image stabilisation when using a tripod. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_tribble Posted January 11, 2013 Author Share #626  Posted January 11, 2013 K-H, The missing IS on the M-240 is a concern to me too. Another couple of examples on an EP-2 but this time using a Vario-Elmar 80-200/f4, set at 200mm. Now I don't have very steady hands and you can see that except in very bright sunlight (and it is quite bright here in the UK today), the lack of IS is going to make using longer lenses for sharp photos, hand held, an issue for me. These crops are from images taken at 1/320 of a second, so not slow. The tree was about 50 feet from the window.  Wilson  Wilson - interesting post - thanks. However - given that the sensor size of EP-2 means that our working with an effective 400mm lens, is it a surprise that hand held's a problem? With full frame 5D2 I wouldn't think of using an non-stablised 200 without at least a monopod, and always use a tripod with the Canon 300 2.8. In the couple of tests I did with the A-T 135 in a recent post, I used a good solid tripod (and in the example, the test target was only 4 metres away.  Malcolm Taylor's just sent me my coded Nikon and Canon adaptors with the frameline selecter adapted to bring up the 90mm frames ... So now I'm all set up, and all I need is the M240 in order to make the leap from speculation to experience! However, when I do start to work with these I'll be surprised if I'm shooting the 80-200 hand held. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
k-hawinkler Posted January 11, 2013 Share #627 Â Posted January 11, 2013 Advertisement (gone after registration) Yes, I think it is usually recommended to turn off image stabilisation when using a tripod. Â Â Nikon advises the same for their VR Vibration Reduction technology in their lenses. Â Over the years I always wondered which approach would turn out to be the in principal better approach. I am always unhappy if there are multiple options for something but I have not figured out yet the decisive argument that identifies the best of the available options. Â Anyway, I now think IBodyIS is more promising than ILensIS as the former can explore more easily more degrees of freedom. In the OM-D E-M5, Olympus exploits 5 axis, namely 2 translational and 3 rotational ones. In the E-P2 only the 2 translational axis are used. Â Anyway, whatever the specifics are, I am really exited that there exist cameras with in-body-image-stabilization so that all my Leica/Leitz lenses can benefit from that technology. Even better the lenses can stay as they are and one doesn't need to pay an IS premium for each lens. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
k-hawinkler Posted January 11, 2013 Share #628 Â Posted January 11, 2013 Wilson - interesting post - thanks. However - given that the sensor size of EP-2 means that our working with an effective 400mm lens, is it a surprise that hand held's a problem? With full frame 5D2 I wouldn't think of using an non-stablised 200 without at least a monopod, and always use a tripod with the Canon 300 2.8. In the couple of tests I did with the A-T 135 in a recent post, I used a good solid tripod (and in the example, the test target was only 4 metres away. Â Malcolm Taylor's just sent me my coded Nikon and Canon adaptors with the frameline selecter adapted to bring up the 90mm frames ... So now I'm all set up, and all I need is the M240 in order to make the leap from speculation to experience! However, when I do start to work with these I'll be surprised if I'm shooting the 80-200 hand held. Â Â Chris, Â Imagine if you could though and produce perfectly usable results? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter H Posted January 11, 2013 Share #629 Â Posted January 11, 2013 Al, please don't... I was not planning on an M and still I am dithering. ( Â I smell ice cream! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wlaidlaw Posted January 11, 2013 Share #630 Â Posted January 11, 2013 I started off trying to use a bean bag with the 80-200 and it confirmed my suspicion that bean bags are for AF lenses. The focus on my 80-200 is VERY low resistance (I don't know what others' ones are like) and the slightest movement on the bean bag changes focus. Even trying just to rest the hood on the bean bag was not very satisfactory. I have seen the results my brother gets with his Nikon D800 and his 200-400 VRII lens, with a bean bag and they are excellent. He acquired a bean bag for me in South Africa to use on my trip there before christmas but I ended up not really using it. I can hand hold with a 135mm with no problems and the 280 Telyt and Visoflex I took with me, were just too clumsy to use in a Land Rover back seat, either on the M9 or Olympus. Â The 28/90 framelines R to M Leitax adapter for the 80-200 Vario Elmar in order to use it on the Olympus, went missing for a couple of weeks between Spain and the UK and did not arrive until after I got back. The Post Office had decided to try and charge me duty on it, until I reminded them that as far as I knew, Spain was still a member of the EU. Â Wilson Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted January 11, 2013 Share #631 Â Posted January 11, 2013 Solution: rest the camera on the bean bag, not the lens...Focussing is easier as well. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wlaidlaw Posted January 11, 2013 Share #632 Â Posted January 11, 2013 Solution: rest the camera on the bean bag, not the lens...Focussing is easier as well. Â Jaap, Â This doesn't work with a camera as small as an EP-2, with a lens as big and heavy as a Vario Elmar 80-200. The balance would be all wrong. I think the same would apply to an M 240 with this lens but to a lesser extent. Â Wilson Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted January 11, 2013 Share #633 Â Posted January 11, 2013 Works well with an M and a 135 . Yes - it takes a big hammer to drive a long nail, to use an expression out of context Long lenses require a decent camera body. Just a good sensor is not enough. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
k-hawinkler Posted January 13, 2013 Share #634  Posted January 13, 2013 So, here is a hand held shot with  Olympus (E-P2, VF-2) + Kipon VISO-m4/3 adapter + Leitz 16464K short focus mount + Tele-Elmar 135/4 lens head. With a crop factor of 2x this setup has the angle of view of a 270 mm lens on a full frame 35 mm film camera. This combination of parts actually focuses noticeably beyond infinity.  But I had no problem focusing on the little building at the right of the twin peaks near the image center, using magnification. It's a little awkward using the thumb at the back of the camera to switch between unmagnified and magnified view in the VF-2. Also, the almost 3 year old sensor of the E-P2 performs subpar.  Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!  I also tried the Leica APO 180/3.4 on the E-P2. That begins to approach the maximum focal length I can manually focus handheld successfully with this camera and viewfinder. Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!  I also tried the Leica APO 180/3.4 on the E-P2. That begins to approach the maximum focal length I can manually focus handheld successfully with this camera and viewfinder. ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/190687-preparing-for-the-m/?do=findComment&comment=2213470'>More sharing options...
giordano Posted January 13, 2013 Share #635 Â Posted January 13, 2013 Anyway, I now think IBodyIS is more promising than ILensIS as the former can explore more easily more degrees of freedom. In the OM-D E-M5, Olympus exploits 5 axis, namely 2 translational and 3 rotational ones. Â Five axes mean rise & fall, left & right shift, vertical and horizontal tilt and a rotating back. Who needs a view camera? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wlaidlaw Posted January 13, 2013 Share #636 Â Posted January 13, 2013 K-H, Â I agree on the zoom. I can't remember where the M-240's zoom button is. I think the live view button is on the front towards the top right. One nice feature would be to return to normal non-zoomed view on a touch of the shutter release. My instinct says the EP-2 should do this but it doesn't. I was actually surprised how good the sensor on the EP-2 was. My expectations were quite low but (heresy, heresy), I think it is close to being as good as my M8 and over 640 ISO, certainly lower noise if you develop the ORF files in Capture One (V.7 Pro). The only time you notice the M8 being better is on a really tight crop, where I guess the softening of the AA filter on the EP-2 becomes noticeable. Â Wilson Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
k-hawinkler Posted January 13, 2013 Share #637 Â Posted January 13, 2013 Five axes mean rise & fall, left & right shift, vertical and horizontal tilt and a rotating back. Who needs a view camera? Â If I am not mistaken a view camera has a different goal. Â Here one pursues image stabilization E-M5 > Frequently Asked Questions , Quote: Â "The E-M5 employs new five-axis image stabilization technology. It now corrects for yaw, pitch, vertical shift, horizontal shift and roll, whereas earlier image stabilization technology could only correct for vertical shift and horizontal shift." Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
k-hawinkler Posted January 13, 2013 Share #638  Posted January 13, 2013 Hi Wilson,  K-H, I agree on the zoom. I can't remember where the M-240's zoom button is. I think the live view button is on the front towards the top right. One nice feature would be to return to normal non-zoomed view on a touch of the shutter release. My instinct says the EP-2 should do this but it doesn't.  What I understand from posts on this forum is that the Leica M-240 handles more elegantly switching between magnified and normal view. If one uses an M-lens and changes focus then it automatically switches to a magnified view. If one uses a non (rangefinder coupled?) M-lens then there is a little button on the front of the camera that when pressed gives a magnified view. Really slick.  The Sony NEX cameras I have automatically switch to the normal view when pressing (or half pressing?) the shutter button. Again, one has to use the thumb to go back to magnification though.  I was actually surprised how good the sensor on the EP-2 was. My expectations were quite low but (heresy, heresy), I think it is close to being as good as my M8 and over 640 ISO, certainly lower noise if you develop the ORF files in Capture One (V.7 Pro). The only time you notice the M8 being better is on a really tight crop, where I guess the softening of the AA filter on the EP-2 becomes noticeable.  Wilson  I guess I am being spoiled by my D800E, M9, NEX-5N, and NEX-7. The E-P2 raw files didn't allow me to brighten underexposed areas with the same quality results as my other cameras, using CS6.  Fooling around with the E-P2 is quite educational, as were playing with the NEXs.  The OM-D E-M5 looks now even more interesting as a stepping stone towards the M-240. Too bad the M-240 doesn't offer IBIS. Me thinks the follow on to the M-240 better add that feature as well. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_tribble Posted January 21, 2013 Author Share #639 Â Posted January 21, 2013 An additional thing to think about. Â Over the years I've found an external microphone has been invaluable for getting decent sound on interviews. I had had some concern about the M-240 as I didn't want to layout on the smart grip, and this looked like the only way of getting an audio out minijack. However, I just came across this: Â OLYMPUS SEMA-1 External Microphone Kit - WAE+ Â They're a reputable vendor and this is an excellent price... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeTexas Posted January 21, 2013 Share #640 Â Posted January 21, 2013 I'm using a Canon FD 500mm reflex on my NEX-6 hand-held. On windy days it's a little hard to hold it steady enough to magnify and focus, and I tend to shoot at least 1/500s to avoid shake, but I'm getting some nice results. I've already ordered a Canon FD to M adapter in anticipation of the new M. Â (I can't post any examples here as no Leica equipment is currently being used, but you can see some shots here: Cormorant | Flickr - Photo Sharing!) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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