colonel Posted October 10, 2012 Share #1 Posted October 10, 2012 Advertisement (gone after registration) I am currently deciding on the best 28mm to get with a M9 I will use it for buildings, close street and landscape and also for indoors people I am deciding between: 1. Zeiss 28mm f2.8 Biogon 2. Leica 28mm f2.8 ASPH Elmarit 3. Leica 28mm f2 ASPH Summicron I used the Elmarit before briefly and found it to be great, crisp, sharp with nice colours, but I noticed some vignetting even stopped down to f8 (is this normal) ? I also just read this disturbing piece from digilloyd: diglloyd.com blog - Which 28mm Leica M Lens is Best? 28/2.8 Elmarit or 28/2 Summicron. I think his experience might be a one off! So I wonder if its the case of, if you have the money and don't mind the slight viewfinder blockage, then get the Summicron ? or is the contrast and detail on the Biogon the equivalent ? Lastly if f2 does not matter (which it does to me slightly, but not the overriding concern) then is the Elmarit the best of the bunch ? Particularly interested to here from folk who have used all three in terms of the differences in: 1. Sharpness/detail 2. Contrast 3. Vignetting 4. Perceptions of draw Distortion is the one thing I am not too concerned about, as I can edit out easily rgds Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted October 10, 2012 Posted October 10, 2012 Hi colonel, Take a look here The 28mm question. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
LucisPictor Posted October 10, 2012 Share #2 Posted October 10, 2012 Hmmm... I recently had the chance to shoot with a Cron 28. That lens is a dream!! (I normally use the CV Ultron 2/28 on my M8.) The Elmarit 28 ist much cheaper, though. And I do not know the Zeiss Biogon 2.8/28, but I do know the Biogon 2/35 which is a fantastic lens. OK, let's put it in a nutshell: If you have the money, go for the Cron 28. 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rickp13 Posted October 10, 2012 Share #3 Posted October 10, 2012 hello colonel just for reference before you decide, please have a look at the following article by forum member adan: http://www.l-camera-forum.com/leica-forum/customer-forum/45854-praise-mandler-lenses.html his description of the pre-ASPH 28 led me to try the lens, and i cheerfully admit to liking the resulting photos very much. good luck with your quest rick 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter H Posted October 10, 2012 Share #4 Posted October 10, 2012 I can't answer this question because I have neither the Elmarit not the Biogon, which appear to be splendid lenses. But I know that my Summicron is one of my two all-time favourite lenses along with my 50mm Summilux ASPH, and if I had to spend the rest of my life with just these two lenses, I could cope quite happily. 5 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
colonel Posted October 10, 2012 Author Share #5 Posted October 10, 2012 I can't answer this question because I have neither the Elmarit not the Biogon, which appear to be splendid lenses. But I know that my Summicron is one of my two all-time favourite lenses along with my 50mm Summilux ASPH, and if I had to spend the rest of my life with just these two lenses, I could cope quite happily. funny you should say that I was looking for the perfect partner for my 50mm Summilux ASPH I also like the 28/50 combination for many things including travel 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkP Posted October 10, 2012 Share #6 Posted October 10, 2012 (edited) I can't answer this question because I have neither the Elmarit not the Biogon, which appear to be splendid lenses. But I know that my Summicron is one of my two all-time favourite lenses along with my 50mm Summilux ASPH, and if I had to spend the rest of my life with just these two lenses, I could cope quite happily. Oh so true! I have also written here before that if I could only keep two (of my too many) lenses they would be these - the 2.0/28 Summicron ASPH and 1.4/50 Summilux ASPH FLE. For me, both of these focal lengths, and the intrinsic characteristics of their images complement each other beautifully. I think that I have taken some of my best photographs with the 28 Summicron. I have no experience with the 28 Biogon, but I agree with the previous post that the 25 is excellent. After using the 28 Elmarit ASPH for about 9 months I replaced it with with the Summicron (but changed the lens hood). Not for one moment have I regretted the decision - the lens is a joy to use, it's results a joy to behold, and I much prefer the quality and character of the images from the Summicron. Edited October 10, 2012 by MarkP 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter H Posted October 10, 2012 Share #7 Posted October 10, 2012 Advertisement (gone after registration) Harold and Mark, these two lenses truly have become the heart of my photography. 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MarcRF Posted October 10, 2012 Share #8 Posted October 10, 2012 got the 28 elmarit asph. until now every focus was spot on. cant report anything described in the article... in terms of image quality both leica 28mm lenses are superb. I like a bit of vignetting but there is none when I stop down to f/5.6 and further and the cron has vignetting too... the elmarit has less distortion and is smaller, not to mention the price difference of 2300€ between the 2.. I got it to pair with my summilux 50 asph too by the way. simply love that combination and although I had the money to spend on the cron I picked the elmarit and love it. compact and lightweight. it's really great Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
smkoush Posted October 10, 2012 Share #9 Posted October 10, 2012 I have a 28mm Elmarit ASPH paired with the 50mm Summilux ASPH. I used a 28mm Summicron for a little bit, and I very much liked it. It is true that the Summicron rendition is more like the 50mm Summilux, and that the Elmarit is less so. However, for what I use the lens, you wouldn't be able to tell the difference (quick hyperfocusing street stuff). At the end, the size of the Elmarit wins, and that's why I went for it over the Summicron. It is such a fun little lens. 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MarcRF Posted October 10, 2012 Share #10 Posted October 10, 2012 i knew that the 28/50 combo was quite common stuff but that so many people pick the summilux and elmarit asph felt right before but with some support it just feels even better Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
IkarusJohn Posted October 11, 2012 Share #11 Posted October 11, 2012 Hi Harold, Read the rest of Lloyd Chamber's writings and you will see he doesn't like rangefinders. The truth of the matter is that with a coupled rangefinder mechanism and a digital camera, the tolerance for the calibration between lens and body can be critical. So, more often than we all like to admit, lenses back focus or front focus - that's ultimately one of the great things about focusing using live view (like with a NEX of other camera with an adapter, or with the new M). A better place to look for advice is Erwin Puts. Here's what he says about the Elmarit-M 28 mm 1:2.8 ASPH: This Elmarit-M is a delightful lens ... Very good definition over the full image area from corner to corner and at all distances guarantee this lens a wider audience ... This may be one of the first 28 mm wide angle lenses for rangefinder cameras that display no distortion at all and is an especially fine companion for the M8 ... etc About the Summicron-M 28 mm 1:2 ASPH: The Summicron-M 2/28 mm ASPH is one of the crown jewels in the Leica scuderia of lenses ... Already at full aperture this lens delivers high contrast imagery with crisp definition of exceedingly fine detail over most of the image field ... The overall performance of the lens is such that we may be witnessing a new paradigm for the Summicron-class of lenses ... etc The Leica Pocket Book describes the Elmarit-M - "The almost complete lack of distortion is noteworthy for a 28 mm lens ... Excellent contrast with fine detail over all but the outer edges of the format." About the Summicron, it says "The Summicron at f/2 is as good as the Elmarit at f/2.8. Optimum aperture is f/3.5 where very fine details are crisply rendered with clear and brilliant colour hues in finely shaded areas." Then again, you could listen to Digilloyd bleat about rangefinders ... 4 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
colonel Posted October 11, 2012 Author Share #12 Posted October 11, 2012 Hi Harold, Read the rest of Lloyd Chamber's writings and you will see he doesn't like rangefinders. ........ A better place to look for advice is Erwin Puts. ... I agree Erwin is great. Also Steve Huff, Luminous Landscapes and a few others Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtomalty Posted October 11, 2012 Share #13 Posted October 11, 2012 The 28 2.8 asph was the first lens I purchased with my original M9. Unfortunately,nasty color issues (red edges,corners,etc) made it an impractical option for me despite a few post production correction options and I returned it in short order. Most apparent in neutrally coloured subjects or winter scenes with snow (of which 1/3 my year is comprised of) Replaced with 28 Summicron which is essentially 'clean' out of the camera. Mark Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinnfell Posted October 11, 2012 Share #14 Posted October 11, 2012 I have the 28 cron and can just underwrite what others have said about it. It is really a dream lens. It does have some vignetting and distortion, but not much. Besides, if you do journalism and people , what this lens is meant to do, the slight vignetting actually helps, since it imparts a certain "3D" feeling. . Besides, there is not so much that it doesnt go away like dew before the sun if you enable corrections in LR4. So in fact you have the option - afterwards - to choose if you want your pictures to be "clinical" or not. Remember, it is contrast, color and to a certain degree vignetting which makes a lens "pop", micro contrast is less necessary unless you habitiually make huge enlargements. The 28 cron has it all. All in all , beautiful images every time! For indoor shots, 2.8 really doesnt cut it in my opinion, especially not with the ISO selection of the M9. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Q Wong Jr. Posted October 11, 2012 Share #15 Posted October 11, 2012 Colonel I own both the M & R versions of the Elmarit 28. Size wins. Sent from my iPad using Forum Runner 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
IWC Doppel Posted October 11, 2012 Share #16 Posted October 11, 2012 From an optical perspective the 28 Summicron is stellar, as far ahead of most other wide angles as the new APO 50 is ahead of the 28 Summicron. But real life comparisons will be the make or break as the MTF's of most Leica 28's are extremely good. I can only comment on the 28 Summicron and in comparison to other lenses (not 28) the image quality is stunning in terms of contrast, clarity and fine detail. If architectural detail and people are your plan, I personally can vouch for the Summicron as the bokeh is also very nice and perhaps more classic than some modern Leica lenses. In comparsion to other lenses on my shelf it has a personality which fist your needs, I use it for the exact reasons you mention. BUT comments from those who have the other 28's will be key. As I well know stellar MTF's are only one point 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bpalme Posted October 11, 2012 Share #17 Posted October 11, 2012 If you have the money the 28 Summicron bests all others not even a comparison in my eyes. Lake Moraine | Flickr - Photo Sharing! Lake Moraine | Flickr - Photo Sharing! Peyto Lake (Pea-Toe) | Flickr - Photo Sharing! The size differences are so small I can't imagine that would actually sway someones opinion. 100 Grams is nothing. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
colonel Posted October 11, 2012 Author Share #18 Posted October 11, 2012 If you have the money the 28 Summicron bests all others not even a comparison in my eyes.Lake Moraine | Flickr - Photo Sharing! Lake Moraine | Flickr - Photo Sharing! Peyto Lake (Pea-Toe) | Flickr - Photo Sharing! The size differences are so small I can't imagine that would actually sway someones opinion. 100 Grams is nothing. the first photo is super thanks for posting Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobertJRB Posted October 12, 2012 Share #19 Posted October 12, 2012 I have the 28 cron and used to have the 28 ZM biogon. The biogon isn't really praised in reviews. Most find the ZM 35/2 and 25/2.8 to be the better lenses. But my copy was absolute awesome. On a M8 that is. If u like zeiss colors I found the 28mm ZM to be the best option compared to the other ZM's. Strong contrast, vivid colors, nice 3D pop. Far more than with the ZM 35mm and 50mm I used to have. I sold it for the 28 cron because of the speed and focusknob. Its told so many times before the cron is absolute great. It really is and is by far my most loved lens ever. It has some flaws like a huge hood and quite a lot of vignetting, but I actually love the vignetting and would have loved it when the 35 cron had as much. Normally I'm not really a 28mm person (more a 35mm) so when I bought the M9 I planned to sell the 28 cron for the 35 lux. At the end I kept the 28 and added a 35 cron. Now I use the 28 almost all the time and am thinking of selling the 35mm.. I used the 28 elmarit ASPH for a really short time. Looked in contrast to be in between the cron and ZM (ZM the most and strongest, cron the least). In sharpness I'm sure all are great. So, if your on a budget or really like the zeiss look you can't go wrong with the ZM biogon. For the leica look, and/ or a far smaller lens with focusknob the elmarit is great. And if u want a wow lens I would go for the 28 cron. 4 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfage Posted October 13, 2012 Share #20 Posted October 13, 2012 If you have the money the 28 Summicron bests all others not even a comparison in my eyes.Lake Moraine | Flickr - Photo Sharing! Lake Moraine | Flickr - Photo Sharing! Peyto Lake (Pea-Toe) | Flickr - Photo Sharing! The size differences are so small I can't imagine that would actually sway someones opinion. 100 Grams is nothing. Hey that's my lake! I live here! 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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