jc_braconi Posted June 19, 2012 Share #41 Posted June 19, 2012 Advertisement (gone after registration) Yes... I noticed this very odd detail... my impression is that, maybe, it could be not a rangefinder coupling , but "something else"... (which I can't imagine... could it be something related to the R bayonet ? To auto-diaphragm? Btw, do you think it IS a R bayonet ? I am not 100% sure of this.... I wrote the seller asking some detail...) It seems to me that maybe it is not a RF cam because, looking at my 280V2, I have the impression that to make a "tube" that fits into its std. 39x1 thread AND transmits the focus helicoid movement to such a cam is not an easy task for a 3rd party lab (the most similar item with a coupling of this kind is probably the Tele Elmarit 135) : maybe Leitz/Elcan itself could have engineered some prototype of a Telyt 280 in RF coupling (they did for the Telyt 200) ... but of course on a std. M mount, which isn't the case for the above lens... For my point of view , I mean for what I can see on the pict this is a M bayonet and the miling for the range finder wheel is exactly at "noon" where there is the connecting plunger also the red bulb is at the right position including the groove for locking the lens on the M body flange but this do not explain the goal of this modification waiting for an answer from the seller. Now a question just comes in mind: Is it possible to screw a 280 V. II lens head on a 2.8/135 focusing tube (whithout the goggles) ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted June 19, 2012 Posted June 19, 2012 Hi jc_braconi, Take a look here Rare error in Paul van Hasbroeck's Leica History. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
luigi bertolotti Posted June 19, 2012 Share #42 Posted June 19, 2012 For my point of view , I mean for what I can see on the pict this is a M bayonet and the miling for the range finder wheel is exactly at "noon" where there is the connecting plunger also the red bulb is at the right position including the groove for locking the lens on the M body flangebut this do not explain the goal of this modification waiting for an answer from the seller. Now a question just comes in mind: Is it possible to screw a 280 V. II lens head on a 2.8/135 focusing tube (whithout the goggles) ? Mentre scrivevi ho aggiornato il post di prima... la montatura è proprio strana...) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jc_braconi Posted June 19, 2012 Share #43 Posted June 19, 2012 Vado a vedere si e possibile .... BRAVO Luigi ! BUT on the Visoflex NO FOCUSING at all have to try with the adapter Viso lens to R... Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/181952-rare-error-in-paul-van-hasbroecks-leica-history/?do=findComment&comment=2043688'>More sharing options...
jc_braconi Posted June 19, 2012 Share #44 Posted June 19, 2012 have to try with the adapter Viso lens to R... NO FOCUSING at all on a R body Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wlaidlaw Posted June 19, 2012 Author Share #45 Posted June 19, 2012 I suspect it is a Bitzalux lens - bits of this and bits of that. I have got my callipers out and found that JC's image above is exactly .9000 scale on my MBP screen. On this basis the diameter of the bayonet (not including lugs) is 40.71 mm - maybe within the limits of the accuracy of this method, the same as the 40.55 mm of the M mount. Flange focal distance is wildly different from the 68.8 mm of a Visoflex 2/3 lens. I make it 83.31 mm, so what on earth could that fit? I wonder if it has been modified to be a movie camera lens? Wilson Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jc_braconi Posted June 19, 2012 Share #46 Posted June 19, 2012 I suspect it is a Bitzalux lens - bits of this and bits of that. I have got my callipers out and found that JC's image above is exactly .9000 scale on my MBP screen. On this basis the diameter of the bayonet (not including lugs) is 40.71 mm - maybe within the limits of the accuracy of this method, the same as the 40.55 mm of the M mount. Flange focal distance is wildly different from the 68.8 mm of a Visoflex 2/3 lens. I make it 83.31 mm, so what on earth could that fit? I wonder if it has been modified to be a movie camera lens? Wilson Wilson may be it was not clear for you as we communicate in Italian with Luigi The pict I posted is, after Luigi suspecting, the lens head of my 4.8/280 V II screwed on my Summicron 2/90 focusing mount and we get the same lens as is on the bay. the thread pitch and diameter being the same they fit but, after testing it does not work focusing both on the Viso and on R body. Voila ! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted June 19, 2012 Share #47 Posted June 19, 2012 Advertisement (gone after registration) Vado a vedere si e possibile ....BRAVO Luigi ! BUT on the Visoflex NO FOCUSING at all have to try with the adapter Viso lens to R... THANKS JC !!! I am proud like a child of this discovery.... . No focus you say... is it "beyond infinity" or a sort of "near focus only" ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jc_braconi Posted June 19, 2012 Share #48 Posted June 19, 2012 THANKS JC !!! I am proud like a child of this discovery.... . No focus you say... is it "beyond infinity" or a sort of "near focus only" ? You can be No focusing at all both in Viso and R Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted June 19, 2012 Share #49 Posted June 19, 2012 ...The pict I posted is, after Luigi suspecting, the lens head of my 4.8/280 V II screwed on my Summicron 2/90 focusing mount and we get the same lens as is on the bay.the thread pitch and diameter being the same they fit but, after testing it does not work focusing both on the Viso and on R body. Voila ! I haven't a black Summicron of that kind... but a chrome one yes... Tonight I'll try that odd coupling - the mix of finishes I think will look terrible (apart usability...) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wlaidlaw Posted June 19, 2012 Author Share #50 Posted June 19, 2012 Should we let the seller know what he has got or let some poor fool buy this "dog's dinner"? My hopefully genuine S3 Telyt 280 should be winging its way to me in France via GLS courier. I will post some comparative shots with the series 2 and 3. I really do hope I can see the difference. Wilson Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jc_braconi Posted June 19, 2012 Share #51 Posted June 19, 2012 Should we let the seller know what he has got or let some poor fool buy this "dog's dinner"? My hopefully genuine S3 Telyt 280 should be winging its way to me in France via GLS courier. I will post some comparative shots with the series 2 and 3. I really do hope I can see the difference. Wilson Browsing his web shop I found a single head of a Summicron 2/90 made in Canada I am sure it is the one to be fitted to the focusing ramp screwed on the 4.8/280 head. I wrote my supposition to the seller after that.... Best wishes Wilson Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted June 19, 2012 Share #52 Posted June 19, 2012 Browsing his web shop I found a single head of a Summicron 2/90 made in Canada I am sure it is the one to be fitted to the focusing ramp screwed on the 4.8/280 head.I wrote my supposition to the seller after that.... Best wishes Wilson Right... and hasn't he the focusing group of a 280 ? To acquire a 280V2 that can be used only on Televit or Focorapid, WITH the proper adapters (to be found somwhere...) isn't exactly a good business... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wlaidlaw Posted June 19, 2012 Author Share #53 Posted June 19, 2012 Right... and hasn't he the focusing group of a 280 ? To acquire a 280V2 that can be used only on Televit or Focorapid, WITH the proper adapters (to be found somwhere...) isn't exactly a good business... Exactly. I had been looking for a 14138 for over a year now. Am I correct in thinking that the head of the series 3 will not fit on my Televit without modification, even assuming I can ever find a 14138. Wilson Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted June 19, 2012 Share #54 Posted June 19, 2012 Exactly. I had been looking for a 14138 for over a year now. Am I correct in thinking that the head of the series 3 will not fit on my Televit without modification, even assuming I can ever find a 14138. Wilson Why ? Afaik any V3 head can accept 14138 and be mounted on Televit... even the head of the V2 can be mounted , always with the elusive 14138. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! (which wouldn't be difficult to "copy"... finding the right shop, which I didn't... Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! (which wouldn't be difficult to "copy"... finding the right shop, which I didn't... ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/181952-rare-error-in-paul-van-hasbroecks-leica-history/?do=findComment&comment=2043952'>More sharing options...
jaapv Posted June 19, 2012 Share #55 Posted June 19, 2012 Both my V3 and V2 will fit 14138 + Televit, but the barrels are not interchangeable. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wlaidlaw Posted June 19, 2012 Author Share #56 Posted June 19, 2012 So all it needs for the magic Leica fairy to find me a 14138. There was one for sale in the USA a few months ago but the seller wanted $475 for it! Doug Herr had two made but he thinks the company that did it is no longer around. Given that Novoflex wanted to charge me €300 for the very simple LEIMAR top hat adapter to fit a 65 Elmar head recessed on their bellows, I hate to think what a European company would charge for a one off 14138. It is the sort of thing that small machine shops in the far east can get someone to write the CAD/CAM file for pennies, then they just stick an aluminium alloy billet into a CNC milling machine. I wonder if Leica might be prepared to release to Andreas, the old drawings of adapters, which they have zero intention of making any more, as a service to this forum. Someone like Amadeo Muscelli in Venzuela, might be very happy to add to the range of adapters he already makes (and beautifully at that). I will send Andreas an email to see what he thinks. Wilson Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted June 19, 2012 Share #57 Posted June 19, 2012 So all it needs for the magic Leica fairy to find me a 14138. -...It is the sort of thing that small machine shops in the far east can get someone to write the CAD/CAM file for pennies..., then they just stick an aluminium alloy billet into a CNC milling machine. Wilson Sorry, don't trivialize CAD/CAM ststems... happens that I make my live on them.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wlaidlaw Posted June 19, 2012 Author Share #58 Posted June 19, 2012 Luigi, I did not mean to trivialise CAD/CAM. My son uses this a lot as a development engineer for a large UK earthmoving manufacturer, so I am aware that it is not an easy process. However we have all seen how the far east is selling, often via eBay, all sorts of photo adapters for very low prices. I have just ordered a 46 to 52mm step up ring for £1.75 including postage! I am sure these are not being made by hand but being churned out on CNC machine tools. Somebody must be writing the CAD/CAM files for this, probably on pirated Autocad software. They may well even be moonlighting on their employers computers and/or machine tools. Wilson Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted June 19, 2012 Share #59 Posted June 19, 2012 Luigi, I did not mean to trivialise CAD/CAM. My son uses this a lot as a development engineer for a large UK earthmoving manufacturer, so I am aware that it is not an easy process. However we have all seen how the far east is selling, often via eBay, all sorts of photo adapters for very low prices. I have just ordered a 46 to 52mm step up ring for £1.75 including postage! I am sure these are not being made by hand but being churned out on CNC machine tools. Somebody must be writing the CAD/CAM files for this, probably on pirated Autocad software. They may well even be moonlighting on their employers computers and/or machine tools. Wilson That's true... it was a semi-joke from me ; anyway when I asked to an Italian shop the cost of copying my 14138, they asked me if I could make an order of "around 40" to have a price of "around 50-60 Euros each" (with metal provided by me, and no surface finishing) to justify the cost of copying (but I would have provided a precise 3D model and draftings...), of NC programming, tools, machine time etc... ... I gave up... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted June 19, 2012 Share #60 Posted June 19, 2012 No focusing at all both in Viso and R Just tried with my 280V2 head and the focusing unit of my chrome Summicron 90... it DOES focus... when mounted on Bellows II... (avoid to post the pict of such a awful combo,,, ) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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