Guest snowboarder Posted May 25, 2012 Share #21 Posted May 25, 2012 Advertisement (gone after registration) Here's another shot to peruse - All sizes | Massive Winner | Flickr - Photo Sharing! Wide open hand held. Great, but shows exactly the same amount of CA as the 50 Lux... The lens looks great, but again, I would never ever pick it up over the Lux... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted May 25, 2012 Posted May 25, 2012 Hi Guest snowboarder, Take a look here Thein Review of 50mm APO Summicron . I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
georg Posted May 25, 2012 Share #22 Posted May 25, 2012 @lars_bergquist on-axis? Yes, the performance is close with other lenses and it also shows in the Thein review. off-axis is a different story, even very good lenses with a wider angle of view show astigmatism or overall lower contrast towards the outer image zones. The only wider lens that comes halfway close is the 24mm Elmar with 1.5EV less speed. I can see the difference with my M-lenses as well - enough to justify the expense for the 50AA? Hard to tell, maybe with future high-res sensors. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lars_bergquist Posted May 25, 2012 Share #23 Posted May 25, 2012 For the record, Leica makes quite a number of lenses – and cameras too – which I am able to afford, but which I do not desire to own. There are also items it would be nice to have, but which I have decided not to purchase, on the basis of a straightforward cost-benefit analysis. No, it's not all about jaundice, envy and sour grapes. There are level-headed decisions too. Even in this field. But I made such a decision about the M3 too when it was released, so maybe my soul is cold and calloused. I know that the Roman Church, especially in the Middle Ages, deemed such an attitude a Deadly Sin, called acedia. I suspect that other churches too share that judgment. The old man who has seen most of it Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted May 25, 2012 Share #24 Posted May 25, 2012 As with any other possession, many (if not most) people immediately go to the money thing. Some who really miss the point go so far as to resent or to actually hate Leica for creating cameras and lenses that they cannot easily own. What a sad and shallow way to think and live. Leica cameras and lenses are about photography - not money, not status, not elitism or snobbery.... . Yes, they are... my only hope is that this Summicron, with its objectively insane price, won't be the initial offspring of a focused () strategy aimed at nearly doubling the price of the "mainstream" lenses in the next 3 years or so... this would be really a pursue of elitism which could make them to lose a significant part of their loyal customers' set; it's rather clear than the Cron 50AA does have some pluses on its side (which I happily renounce to) , but is hard to think that within a pair of years, for instance, one cannot buy a 35mm f2 because also this focal has gone "crazy priced" in the meantime... the Summarit line, with its f2,5 standard aperture, can't be the only answer for thosands of people who still believes in Leica, can't afford those stellar items but rightly pretend to have some lenses of decent aperture... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lars_bergquist Posted May 25, 2012 Share #25 Posted May 25, 2012 @lars_bergquist on-axis? Yes, the performance is close with other lenses and it also shows in the Thein review. off-axis is a different story, even very good lenses with a wider angle of view show astigmatism or overall lower contrast towards the outer image zones. The only wider lens that comes halfway close is the 24mm Elmar with 1.5EV less speed. I can see the difference with my M-lenses as well - enough to justify the expense for the 50AA? Hard to tell, maybe with future high-res sensors. I have not looked at the paraxial areas only. I have evaluated and commented on the peripheral performance too, which you will find if you read my post. And unless you use your M for copy work, which I do not recommend (I have done quite a bit of such work myself, with a Reprovit II) you cannot expect to keep everything micro-sharp out into the corners. Get real. The obstreperous old man from the Reprovit Age Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
panoreserve Posted May 25, 2012 Share #26 Posted May 25, 2012 My mistake I meant to say any other M lens. I agree that the Apo-Telyr-R 1:3.4/180mm is legendary. I'm not just talking about just definition. "...any other M lens"? A comparison with the fabulous 75AA (for "just" 2.850 Euros, designed by P. Karbe himself) could be meaningful... panoerserve Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
horosu Posted May 25, 2012 Share #27 Posted May 25, 2012 Advertisement (gone after registration) As a current user of the 50 Lux AA (and past user of the Planar) I must commend Zeiss. This review only makes it clear the marginal improvements one can get with a lens priced ...x10 the price of the Planar, which is a non-aspheric (not to mention non-apo) design, just a classic double Gauss. I believe (as does Ming) that the extra stop afforded by the Lux AA has far more importance in actual use, especially on the M9, but on the Monochrom too: 2500 ISO at f1.4 versus 5000 ISO at f2. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
georg Posted May 25, 2012 Share #28 Posted May 25, 2012 I've read what you wrote, all you need are far-distance/ large objects (landscape, architecture) where depth-of-field is negligible. At f5.6, 40lp/mm and 20mm image height, the 50AA offers ~20%-40% more contrast than the already excellent (I have one myself) Summilux Asph and ~20-30% more contrast than the Summicron 28mm or 35mm Asph - all reference lenses in their category already. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sp12 Posted May 25, 2012 Share #29 Posted May 25, 2012 Leica cameras and lenses are about photography - not money, not status, not elitism or snobbery. They are about a deep, burning passion for visual artistry. They are about a love of image making that is so deep that it permeates you to your bones, that you obsess about it. I disagree entirely. Most of the reason I buy Leica is to fit in with my rich friends and as part of my passion for technology. Leica clearly favors us with the big cash as seen by the slow pace of technological development in direct aid of photography (live view, buffer, screen) and the creation of limited editions that sell out immediately. Only secondarily is it about the image making process to me. If that was all I cared about I would probably go for an NEX-7. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Ash Posted May 25, 2012 Share #30 Posted May 25, 2012 I disagree entirely. Most of the reason I buy Leica is to fit in with my rich friends and ... Wow, quite depressing personal view. Sounds like it is time to step back, self-reflect, wipe the slate clean and bring some meaning to life. Regards, Steve Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgk Posted May 25, 2012 Share #31 Posted May 25, 2012 I know that I can only in exceptional cases approach the definition limit of my 50mm Summilux ASPH. To be honest, I find the 50 Summilux ASPH to be head ans shoulders above any other fast 50 I've been able to try (more than I care to count up) and it is substantially better wide open than the pre-ASPH. BUT, and its a big but, I cannot see needing or even wanting a lens which is 'better' than the Summilux ASPH which is itself a stunningly good lens. Period. I'm sure that the Summicron ASPH will be better (except of course at 1.4;)), but the difference has got to be a nuance. Surely we are in territory similar to hi-fi here; marginal improvements can cost a great deal of money. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted May 25, 2012 Share #32 Posted May 25, 2012 Much of this is academically interesting, but one should buy a lens for one's own needs, preferences and desires. The fact of the matter is that the viewer of your prints will never know, unless you tell them, what camera or lens you used to make a picture. (A double blind test will prove the doubters wrong in most every case.) There are many links in the print chain, starting with the photographer. This is another remarkable Leica lens. As Puts said (in his review of the 35 Summilux FLE), Leica lens reviews are becoming boring, as the modern lenses are all technically outstanding, and one needs to search hard for meaningful differences. A new technical standard may have been achieved in some respects here, but as always, the artistic part is up to the user. I hope Leica makes lots of money off this lens (to fund future success), but continues to offer us great alternatives at different price points. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lars_bergquist Posted May 25, 2012 Share #33 Posted May 25, 2012 [ ... ] I'm sure that the Summicron ASPH will be better (except of course at 1.4;)), but the difference has got to be a nuance. Surely we are in territory similar to hi-fi here; marginal improvements can cost a great deal of money. And they will be lost on you forever after you have attended your first hard rock concert. Though my youth fell before rock, so in my case it was automatic weapons and no earmuffs ... Theoretically, the advantage is there, but the question is, can we poor imperfect human beings make practical use of it? The slightly-hard-of-hearing old man from the Kodachrome Age (Yes, I was born in the same year as 35mm Kodachrome) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyedward Posted May 25, 2012 Share #34 Posted May 25, 2012 Much of this is academically interesting, but one should buy a lens for one's own needs, preferences and desires. The fact of the matter is that the viewer of your prints will never know, unless you tell them, what camera or lens you used to make a picture. (A double blind test will prove the doubters wrong in most every case.) There are many links in the print chain, starting with the photographer. This is another remarkable Leica lens. As Puts said (in his review of the 35 Summilux FLE), Leica lens reviews are becoming boring, as the modern lenses are all technically outstanding, and one needs to search hard for meaningful differences. A new technical standard may have been achieved in some respects here, but as always, the artistic part is up to the user. I hope Leica makes lots of money off this lens (to fund future success), but continues to offer us great alternatives at different price points. Jeff I have often wondered how the results from double blind ratings of shots of the same subject would impact on the status quo between different formats, manufacturers, etc. I appreciate that many variables cannot be controlled, but many can. An example would be to use the same M body with various 50mm lenses. It would be an interesting proposition. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bybrett Posted May 25, 2012 Share #35 Posted May 25, 2012 "...any other M lens"?A comparison with the fabulous 75AA (for "just" 2.850 Euros, designed by P. Karbe himself) could be meaningful... panoerserve Yeah I've done that. And I'm a big fan of the 75 APO. The 50 APO has no equal. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bybrett Posted May 25, 2012 Share #36 Posted May 25, 2012 Great, but shows exactly the same amount of CA as the 50 Lux... Not from where I'm sitting. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rramesh Posted May 26, 2012 Share #37 Posted May 26, 2012 Don't underestimate the power of bragging rights. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted May 26, 2012 Share #38 Posted May 26, 2012 But don’t overestimate the bragging rights provided by a Leica lens. Only a minuscule percentage of the populace will recognize an MM with Summicron APO for what it is. Useless for the professional poser. It is not in the league of a Bugatti or a head-turning trophy wife. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lars_bergquist Posted May 26, 2012 Share #39 Posted May 26, 2012 To 99.9% of this planet's population, a Leica M9 or a MM is just an obsolete camera. Even a crappy Rolex carries more prestige. The old man from the Kodachrome Age Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ecaton Posted May 26, 2012 Share #40 Posted May 26, 2012 An excellent review of a great lens which I'll definitely not buy. Leica shows us what is technically possible, what they can do if money/pricing is not a limiting factor.Reminds me of an interview with a chef of one of these super hotels in the Emirates whose main challenge was not budget, but finding for each and every day of the year the freshest and best products in the world, no matter the costs. What would make Leica really look outstanding and innovative in product development and engineering, though, is the Porsche Boxster test. The best product by any standard in a premium priced, yet still more widely affordable market segment, manufactured in decent volumes and to high standards. Will this be the new mirrorless system? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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