Torquinian Posted May 6, 2012 Share #21 Posted May 6, 2012 Advertisement (gone after registration) It all depends what you aim to photograph. My R8 kit with three lenses; flash; film; 2X extender & 8x20c binoculars weighs around 7kg. When I don't want to carry all that I use my Minilux. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted May 6, 2012 Posted May 6, 2012 Hi Torquinian, Take a look here What's this? IIIc? IIIb? IIIf?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
runes Posted May 6, 2012 Author Share #22 Posted May 6, 2012 I ended up buying both a IIIc AND an M6. Best of both worlds. I haven't had the time to meet the seller of the M6 yet, but hopefully we'll meet in a couple of days. The IIIc however came to me about a month ago, and as I promised here are some pictures, and some questions regarding the camera as there are some things I don't understand. Sorry about the quality - auto "everything" in the camera as well as Photoshop. I've removed the last digit in the serial number in the pictures. The complete package. According to the seller the original owner was a professional photographer. In 1940 he bought two cameras - this one, and a Contax III to try them out and see which one he preferred. He shot a couple of rolls and decided that for him the Contax was the better camera, so he never used the Leica again. Based on the looks of the camera, and what I've found out about the photographer this sounds plausible. However there are some things that's quite strange. Hopefully some of you Leica experts can help me a bit. Camera and original hangtag. According to the serial number 36472X the camera is a IIIc manufactured in 1940. The shutter release however looks more like a IIIb. And the box (with matching camera serial number, not lens serial number) states that this is a Model IIIb , made for the American marked (?). The wind-on knob has a film type reminder, which I thought didn't start until the IIIf? The 5cm Elmar's serial number is 36099X which puts it in 1937, while the 3.5's serial number is 54088X which puts it to 1940. And than there's this "thingy" that I have no idea what is? All help appreciated. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/178820-whats-this-iiic-iiib-iiif/?do=findComment&comment=2002394'>More sharing options...
runes Posted May 6, 2012 Author Share #23 Posted May 6, 2012 I recently bought a IIIc. See this thread: http://www.l-camera-forum.com/leica-forum/leica-collectors-historica/230271-camera-buying-tips.html I promised in that thread that I would post some pictures of it, and today I finally got the time to take some quick & dirty pics of it. However as I was taking the pics I realized that there were some things that weren't completely right. Sorry about the quality - auto "everything" in the camera as well as Photoshop. I've removed the last digit in the serial number in the pictures. The complete package. According to the seller the original owner was a professional photographer. In 1940 he bought two cameras - this one, and a Contax III to try them out and see which one he preferred. He shot a couple of rolls and decided that for him the Contax was the better camera, so he never used the Leica again. Based on the looks of the camera, and what I've found out about the photographer this sounds plausible. However there are some things that's quite strange. Hopefully some of you Leica experts can help me a bit. Camera and original hangtag. According to the serial number 36472X the camera is a IIIc manufactured in 1940. The shutter release however looks more like a IIIb. And the box (with matching camera serial number, not lens serial number) states that this is a Model IIIb , made for the American market (?). The wind-on knob has a film type reminder, which I thought didn't start until the IIIf? The 5cm Elmar's serial number is 36099X which puts it in 1937, while the 3.5's serial number is 54088X which puts it to 1940. On the backside there's a sync contact which didn't start until the IIIf either? All help appreciated. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/178820-whats-this-iiic-iiib-iiif/?do=findComment&comment=2002458'>More sharing options...
runes Posted May 6, 2012 Author Share #24 Posted May 6, 2012 Oh, and the camera also has a flash sync contact. I thought that didn't start until IIIf either? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael-IIIf Posted May 6, 2012 Share #25 Posted May 6, 2012 And than there's this "thingy" that I have no idea what is? That has to be a home-made remote release. Try putting it on the camera. It looks like its base will line up with the tripod mount and I suspect the lug on the lever will line up with the shutter release button. If they do it would be a simple matter to tie a length of string onto the end of the lever and you have a remote release which will never need batteries What a beautiful camera and story. If it's really sat dormant since 1940 I would be nervous about using it until serviced. Congratulations. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
runes Posted May 6, 2012 Author Share #26 Posted May 6, 2012 That has to be a home-made remote release. Try putting it on the camera. It looks like its base will line up with the tripod mount and I suspect the lug on the lever will line up with the shutter release button. If they do it would be a simple matter to tie a length of string onto the end of the lever and you have a remote release which will never need batteries Wow. You sir, is really smart (at least smarter than me). I tried what you said, and indeed it is a remote release. What a beautiful camera and story. If it's really sat dormant since 1940 I would be nervous about using it until serviced. Congratulations. Thank you. I haven't used it yet, as it probably needs some CLA and TLC. The seller also put a film in the camera without cutting the leader, so there's some small film parts/debris somewhere in the shutter area. Before this is fixed I will not use the camera in fear of "breaking" it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted May 6, 2012 Share #27 Posted May 6, 2012 Advertisement (gone after registration) Hi Runes ! Beautiful buy !! (Buys... we'll speak later about the M6... ) And an "adventurous" buy... declared as a IIIc, factory's label of a IIIb... flash sync as a IIIf... ok : is a "factory upgraded" item : Leitz did provide and regularly listed those upgrades frm older models to newer ones, and such items, with s/n not in line with the "content" are perfectly legitimate and original, and interesting variants. Anyway... I hope you DID feel the unique sensation when one firstly handles a "Barnack classic"... ; time has passed, digital is THE today's concern... but a solid Leica screw mount with some of its proper lenses remains a milestone in the story of photography... and one can catch very good pictures with it, provided that film (as is now) is available.... Handle it, use it, love it, take accustomed and then, appreciate the evoultion-without-revolution that M6 does represent.... you have two significant pieces of the noblest breed of 35mm photo history. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
runes Posted May 6, 2012 Author Share #28 Posted May 6, 2012 A little more about the history of the camera. The one I bought it from got it as a gift from the son of the original owner when he helped him clean out the house i 2002. Both the original owner and the son never threw away anything, so it was quite a big job. There's an interesting story about father and son here. They were pioneers in color photography. The article is originally in Norwegian, and the auto translate isn't that good, but I suppose you'll understand most of it. Google Translate Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
runes Posted May 6, 2012 Author Share #29 Posted May 6, 2012 BTW, the camera has red shutter curtains, so they weren't replaced when the camera was rebuilt into a IIIf. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted May 6, 2012 Share #30 Posted May 6, 2012 BTW, the camera has red shutter curtains, so they weren't replaced when the camera was rebuilt into a IIIf. One more interesting (and uncommon) feature... ... and an intriguing story behind, thanks for the link. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jc_braconi Posted May 7, 2012 Share #31 Posted May 7, 2012 This is a IIIc sync. i.e. modified close to a IIIf Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lars_bergquist Posted May 7, 2012 Share #32 Posted May 7, 2012 Yes, and if the original owner bought the camera in 1940, then either he or somebody else had it modified to IIIf specs at the earliest in 1950. It seems to be in pristine condition, but the rangefinder housing must have been added new during the modification, I think. Now if he bought both a Leica IIIc and a Contax II or even III in 1940, both with lenses, and then decided to let one kit lie idle for decades ... then he must not have been just a professional photographer but also a very rich one. Not even an institutional owner like a newspaper would have been nonchalant enough to do that. The cost of each would have been a sizeable slice of a working person's yearly income. A Contax cost about as much as a small family car. The old man from the Age of the IIIc Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lars_bergquist Posted May 7, 2012 Share #33 Posted May 7, 2012 And yes, the serial number of the camera body identifies it as a IIIc from 1940. Upgraded cameras kept their original serial numbers. The old man Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
runes Posted May 7, 2012 Author Share #34 Posted May 7, 2012 I had some problems posting the original post yesterday, so by a mistake I posted both here and in this thread: http://www.l-camera-forum.com/leica-forum/leica-collectors-historica/230271-camera-buying-tips.html Moderators, please feel free to merge the threads. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lars_bergquist Posted May 7, 2012 Share #35 Posted May 7, 2012 The box is curious. It is stamped "Modell IIIb" which is patently incorrect – that camera was never a IIIb – but the serial number is obviously correct. Strange things happen in photographic stores. The old man Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
runes Posted May 7, 2012 Author Share #36 Posted May 7, 2012 Yes, and if the original owner bought the camera in 1940, then either he or somebody else had it modified to IIIf specs at the earliest in 1950. It seems to be in pristine condition, but the rangefinder housing must have been added new during the modification, I think. Now if he bought both a Leica IIIc and a Contax II or even III in 1940, both with lenses, and then decided to let one kit lie idle for decades ... then he must not have been just a professional photographer but also a very rich one. Not even an institutional owner like a newspaper would have been nonchalant enough to do that. The cost of each would have been a sizeable slice of a working person's yearly income. A Contax cost about as much as a small family car. The old man from the Age of the IIIc Yeah, I know it sounds really strange. The Contax was sold at the same time I bought the Leica, and it too was barely used. I really have no good answer to why he would spend so much money on two cameras that he almost never used. However I have no reason to question the seller, but maybe the photographers son memory isn't 100% correct. Maybe the camera weren't bought in 1940, but rather in the early 1950s. I suppose a IIIc modified into a IIIf would be cheaper than a "real" IIIf? And also a NOS (or gently used) Contax III would be cheaper after the IIA and IIIA had been released? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jc_braconi Posted May 7, 2012 Share #37 Posted May 7, 2012 Looks like an hand made shutter release activated at distance by a wire as there is no self timer on the camera. kind of half OORFC.. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/178820-whats-this-iiic-iiib-iiif/?do=findComment&comment=2004005'>More sharing options...
jerzy Posted May 8, 2012 Share #38 Posted May 8, 2012 " ....... but the rangefinder housing must have been added new during the modification, I think." Rangefinder housing is original one, it has "step" below the reverse lever. During upgrade a plate with "kontakzahlen" has been added. This indicates rather early upgrade. Mid fifties it was not unusual that the whole housing was renewed (factory ran out of plates?) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
iphoenix Posted May 9, 2012 Share #39 Posted May 9, 2012 Wasn't the Barnack body from IIIC onwards slightly wider than previously? I seem to remember that the base plates are not interchangeable for that reason. If so, either it started life as a IIIC or the whole body was replaced during an update (I think the second alternative to be unlikely). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlanG Posted May 9, 2012 Share #40 Posted May 9, 2012 A very similar looking IIIc with added flash synch is on this site: Leica Screw Mount Cameras - the 1930's through the 1950's I certainly am not an expert on this but here is what they say, "The Leica IIIc was introduced in 1940 with a total redesign of the body and shutter crate The IIIc is not only a bit larger than it predecessors, but features an all new single cast top cover. Remarkably, the external appearance of the early Leica IIIc is almost identical to the previous III, IIIa and IIIb cameras of the 1930's." I have no idea why the box would be incorrectly marked. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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